After experience in Miami, Linehan has reason to be patient

[AvengerRam]

Patience.

That seems to be the message coming from Scott Linehan in response to critics of the Rams currently dysfunctional offense. Learning a new system, and developing a new attitude on offense takes time. This is merely the "growing pains" period.

In Linehan's case, these sentiments are not merely optimistic words. They are the voice of recent experience.

Last year, in Miami, Linehan was brought in to jump start the Miami offense. His lineup unquestionably had less talent than the current Rams offense. While he had a good 1-2 RB punch in Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams, a very good WR in Chris Chambers, and a top-notch TE in Randy McMichael, the Dolphins' O line was a mess (less talent and experience than the current Rams' O line) and Gus Frerotte had a tenuous hold on the starting QB spot.
In the first part of the season, the Dolphins offense was inconsistent and, quite frequently, inept. Over the first ten games of the season, the team averaged only 16.2 points per game (including defensive scores), while posting a 3-7 record. This culminated in a shutout loss to the Cleveland Browns, of all teams.

Then, things just clicked. The offense started scoring points, and the Dolphins went on a 6 game winning streak, averaging 26 points per game in the process, to end at 9-7.

There is no guarantee that the Rams offense will experience such a dramatic turnaround, but given this recent history of the "Linehan system," its not surprising that the coach intends to stay the course.

Who are we to argue with that?

[laram0]

It all sounds good I just don't understand why he messes with the offense. The defense needed and has received a ton of attention that was expected.

As far as the offense goes, there's always room for improvement but it looks like he completely tore it down.


Patience...ok..I'm waiting...................................................

[WhinerFan]

Originally Posted by AvengerRam

Patience.
Learning a new system, and developing a new attitude on offense takes time. This is merely the "growing pains" period.

While he had a good 1-2 RB punch in Ronnie Brown and Ricky Williams, a very good WR in Chris Chambers, and a top-notch TE in Randy McMichael, the Dolphins' O line was a mess (less talent and experience than the current Rams' O line) and Gus Frerotte had a tenuous hold on the starting QB spot.

Who are we to argue with that?

Explain the success of the "Linehan System" over the "Coryell" offense.

With many new QB's in the NFL learning new systems (including Alex Smith learning his second in two years) why is Bulger and Co. having such a hard time?

The answer is simple: Offensive Line play.

[shortman1984]

Originally Posted by WhinerFan

Explain the success of the "Linehan System" over the "Coryell" offense.

With many new QB's in the NFL learning new systems (including Alex Smith learning his second in two years) why is Bulger and Co. having such a hard time?

The answer is simple: Offensive Line play.

Well Alex Smith hasnt been in a system long and he is still young.. Unlike our current players they have been under the Martz System for like 6 years..i know if you do something long enough it is hard to change.. So it is different. The O-Line wasnt Horrible in the first game and we still couldnt Score..Now this is nothing agains Bulger but if you put Frerotte in there i guarentee you he will do a better job because for one he knows Linehan's system..Not saying he would be the better QB in the long run, i just believe Bulger needs to learn this system better..I mean i dont care what coach you have, that coach wont make you any less accurate. How does a QB go from completing like 65 percent of his passes to completing barely 50 percent...Its the system. Now there are timing issues as in before Bulger knew where Holt or bruce or any of the other recievers were going to be before they made their cuts.....so i believe that once they get thier timing right...then we will be ok.....and i sure hope they learn that offense....its sad when you cant score but 13 against the niners...

[WhinerFan]

Originally Posted by shortman1984

Well Alex Smith hasnt been in a system long and he is still young.. Unlike our current players they have been under the Martz System for like 6 years..i know if you do something long enough it is hard to change.. So it is different. The O-Line wasnt Horrible in the first game and we still couldnt Score..Now this is nothing agains Bulger but if you put Frerotte in there i guarentee you he will do a better job because for one he knows Linehan's system..Not saying he would be the better QB in the long run, i just believe Bulger needs to learn this system better..I mean i dont care what coach you have, that coach wont make you any less accurate. How does a QB go from completing like 65 percent of his passes to completing barely 50 percent...Its the system. Now there are timing issues as in before Bulger knew where Holt or bruce or any of the other recievers were going to be before they made their cuts.....so i believe that once they get thier timing right...then we will be ok.....and i sure hope they learn that offense....its sad when you cant score but 13 against the niners...

I agree that timing was everything in the Mike Martz version of the "Coryell" offense.

However, that has never been the case in any of Linehan's offenses. The primary success factors in those offenses has been: recievers that run deep go-routes and strong-armed QB's. In addition, Miami's OL (and Minnesota's when they were successful) last year (as bad as it was) was better than a this year's healthy St. Louis OL.

The brunt of the blame must be focused on the OL; for not adequately opening holes for a big/tall back like Davis, or providing enough pass protection for an immobile QB like Bulger.

And keep in mind that I like the two players previously mentioned.

As for being "stuck" in a system for several years without changing, I would point to any number of veteran QB's, this year and last, who have changed systems (even teams) with less of a hangover than Bulger.

[AvengerRam]

Originally Posted by WhinerFan

Explain the success of the "Linehan System" over the "Coryell" offense.

With many new QB's in the NFL learning new systems (including Alex Smith learning his second in two years) why is Bulger and Co. having such a hard time?

The answer is simple: Offensive Line play.

Enough with the Alex Smith stuff. Yes, he's improved, but he's hardly setting the world on fire (and has played two defenses which are not exactly known as the best in the league). Plus, unlike Bulger, who was in one system for five years, Smith had very little to "unlearn."

Linehan's plan is to implement an offensive scheme that is lower-risk/more controlled than the Martz offense. Its a more methodical approach. The Rams offense is not used to this, and its not just Bulger, its not just the line.

Ironically, the player who has arguably adujusted the fastest is Steven Jackson. Perhaps that is because this is an offense that suits him better than the Martz offense did.

The point of this thread (which I'd like to get back to despite the efforts to derail the topic) is that Linehan recently had success, albeit delayed by a learning curve, implementing this offense in Miami.

I think history could repeat itself.

[WhinerFan]

Originally Posted by AvengerRam

The point of this thread (which I'd like to get back to despite the efforts to derail the topic) is that Linehan recently had success, albeit delayed by a learning curve, implementing this offense in Miami.

Was Miami's learning curve delayed by the implementation of a new system? Or was it by the introduction of a new QB (unfamiliar with his receivers) who is currently this team's back-up?

It seems hard to imagine that a QB who has been so in sync with his receivers would have such a hard time completing passes.

The OL is simply not performing up to par. A QB who is not "mobile" and a tall/big RB will never perform well with a bad OL. It simply does not matter which "system" is used. Battles are won in the trenches, they can make everything else look bad.

[AvengerRam]

Sorry, but while the O line is certainly part of the problem, its not the whole problem. The Rams are running the ball effectively (121.5 yards/game, 4.3 average - both up from last year). They are not protecting effectively, but there is also a problem with the receivers getting open.

This is a systematic issue, not a Marc Bulger issue, not an O line issue, not a receivers issue.

[LaRamsFanLongTime]

The primary success factors in those offenses has been: recievers that run deep go-routes and strong-armed QB's.

This right here is what is wrong with the system. Im gonna tattoo it on Linehans head before this weekend. Work the middle of the field. Holt and Bruce are route runners maybe the best in the league. I sound like a parrot as of late because that is all I keep saying and I will continue to say it. I think most of Bulgers sacks in the game could have been avoided had most his receivers not been so far down field. Hot routes are also vital to a teams success.This team is just not playing fast. Everything is slow and is not developing.

The o-line while it has not been stellar has not been the blame for all the pressure. Alot of the plays are taking way to long and Bulger is having a tough time getting through his reads. Most of the successful passing has been quick hits just like in the past. The o-line is also letting Steven Jackson gain over 100 yards a game right now which is pretty nice.Hopefully Linehan figures it out and this offense is utilized in the correct fashion.

[RAMMAN68]

That seems to be the message coming from Scott Linehan in response to critics of the Rams currently dysfunctional offense. Learning a new system, and developing a new attitude on offense takes time. This is merely the "growing pains" period.

I know it will take the team time to not only grasp the new system both on offense and defense. My biggest complaint is the lack of intensity that I saw on both sides of the ball in the second half.

I just hope the team is full prepared this week and shows some fight.

[RAMFANRAIDERHATER]

I understand the Linehan quote that it takes time, and agree that we must stay the course. But what bothers me, or should I say, what I question is why do new head coaches insist on coming in and completely revamping systems?

If you KNOW that it takes time to implement a new system, with new plays and nomenclature, WHY do it? It's not like Mad Mike's offense was bad. If I remember correctly, our offense was pretty damn good. In fact, it was one of the greatest ever. So, why is it necessary to completely overhaul it? If Linehan believes in a more balanced attack, fine. Add in some more running plays. But if the Rams old "system" worked well, and the same players are still in it, why not continue to use some of the old, successful plays and combine some of the new? Wouldn't it make the implementation pill a little more easy to swallow? Hell, it's not like Martz's plays and terminology were trademarked or something. Why wouldn't it make sense for the new head coach to approach key players on offense and say; "what do you guys feel comfortable with"? "What plays were consistently successful in certain situations"? ...and continue to use them, especially in key situations?

What's wrong with combining some old with some new? I know they use different terminology, but that hasn't anything to do with timing. That's a brain issue. To improve the transition, why not keep what works (Passing game) and improve on what didn't (balanced attack) ?

Anybody ever hear the old cliche; "If it ain't broke, don't fix it"?

[theodus69]

The thing is we all want our boys to win and want this to be a great season,But the reality is not only are these guys learning a new system ,they are also in a rebuilding period also!:\ Look what Vermeil did his first couple of years. granted , the Rams wrer one of the worst teams in the league then( Alot of you weren't there for those years) But 6-10 isn't tearing it up and this team is not that good. they need some help and so does Linehan!:x So let's set back and see how this year unfolds, because frankly, 8-8 is quite a reality right now!!!!:\

[evil disco man]

Originally Posted by laram0

It all sounds good I just don't understand why he messes with the offense. .... As far as the offense goes, there's always room for improvement but it looks like he completely tore it down.

Originally Posted by RAMFANRAIDERHATER

But what bothers me, or should I say, what I question is why do new head coaches insist on coming in and completely revamping systems? .... If I remember correctly, our offense was pretty damn good. In fact, it was one of the greatest ever. So, why is it necessary to completely overhaul it?

It's practically impossible for a new head coach, or offensive coordinator, to join up with a new team and simply pick up the previous offense and run it smooth as silk. Linehan's come a long way on his road to becoming a head coach, learning under guys like Dennis Erickson and Nick Saban, creating his own offensive system along the way. He's constructed his own playbook and offensive system over the years and it's what made him successful in Minnesota and Miami, leading up to him being an eligible head coach. He can't just throw that away in hopes of re-creating Martz's GSOT in St. Louis.

Mike Martz's offense was and is arguably the most complicated in the NFL. I just don't see it being something you can simply copy, when he's been quoted (and I believe it) as saying he never runs the same pass patterns twice. He had "audible" routes built in to the system, among other things, making it a one-of-a-kind offense in the league. Guys like Torry Holt and Marc Bulger have known only this offense for their whole careers. This is why I imagine the Rams would take a little more time to pick up a new system than many other teams do. With audibles, different timing patterns, and different languages written into the playbook, along with other factors involved that we can't realize as non-NFL players, this new philosophy on offense will take some time, and hopefully we can all have some patience.

Since 1999 we haven't had to deal with too much change as Rams fans. With basically the same staffing and the same players each year, it wasn't hard to gauge our expectations. This season will take some patience from us and from Ram players alike. We all know they've got the talent (other than O-line injuries bothering us), and I, for one, believe it will all fall into place eventually, whether it takes 1 week, 5 weeks, 10 weeks, or until next season. Just have patience.

Patience, patience, patience.

[HUbison]

Originally Posted by theodus

Look what Vermeil did his first couple of years. granted , the Rams wrer one of the worst teams in the league then( Alot of you weren't there for those years) But 6-10 isn't tearing it up and this team is not that good.

Excellent point, theo. In fact, Vermeil (like Linehan) also inherited a 6-10 team. He spent two years stepping back to rebuild before finally putting all the pieces together. Yet some expect Linehan to do it in two weeks?

[Brain Daddy]

Originally Posted by AvengerRam

Patience.

That seems to be the message coming from Scott Linehan in response to critics of the Rams currently dysfunctional offense. Learning a new system, and developing a new attitude on offense takes time. This is merely the "growing pains" period.

That's all good and well, but if he knew it was going to take time, why not give the starters more reps during preseason? I realize a coach wants to keep his players healthy, but what good are healthy players if they're innefective? At least in preseason, any struggles wouldn't really count.