AR Takes Bernie To Task; Bernie Backtracks, Then Blathers - Page 3

*ZigZagRam* · #31 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

The thread clearly was not meant to be any kind of self promotion by Avenger.

He was simply calling out Bernie on an article about our Rams that lacked basis of fact. Many times Bernie simply writes with nothing to back up his points. He was called on it, and he responded with the same nonsense.

Miklasz should be able to back up his claims, but instead he resorted to spewing the same nonsense that he posts in many of his articles.

Perhaps if you could see past whatever personal agenda you have, you'd realize Avenger's criticism was not meant to make him look better. He was simply calling a journalist out, to elaborate on a column. I believe that should be part of their job.

**Nick** · #32 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by elAcky

you have dominated this board over the last few months to the point of suffocating it !!

I believe this is where I ride in on my high horse and object - if anyone dominates/suffocates the board by endless posting, it's me.

*1st & Goal* · #33 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

Why is a different opinion have to be an agenda? Have been reading this thread and it seems everyone thinks AV is right and Bernie is wrong. This may be true but when someone else speaks up with a different opinion, don't make judgements. :ramlogo:

**AvengerRam** · #34 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

If you, elAcky, or anyone else wants to argue that Bernie is right and I'm wrong, be my guest (I might argue back, but that's to be expected).

elAcky hasn't said a word about Bernie's article. He just doesn't like me (or "Yanks," apparently).

As for me (or Nick) dominating the boards... what is stopping you from starting your own threads? If your thread is interesting or evocative, people will respond.

*ZigZagRam* · #35 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

Besides, this thread wasn't about right or wrong. It was about Bernie writing a whole bunch of fluff in a column (like he so often does) without giving sufficient fact to support it. One of the ClanRam faithful called him on it, and he still didn't give anything to support his side.

Then one of the other posters turned it into a personal agenda (I've seen many arguments in the past), and called Avenger out for trying to make himself look like he's 'the man.' Pardon me for seeing the real point of this post. Exposing Bernie as a gossiping, fire-starter, who doesn't give fact in his columns. And fails to do so when confronted about it.

**AvengerRam** · #36 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

Well, that's not entirely true, Zig. Bernie did say that "senior administration officials" told him that "the column rocked Rams Park, it was all that anybody talked about for a day."

My crack team of spies told me later of the content of that very discussion at Rams Park...

Jay: "Say, Mike. Did you see that column by Bernie?"

Martz: "Yeah, that was pretty lame, wasn't it? What do you expect from him, though?

Charlie: "Hey, I have a good idea... let's go outside near where Bernie sits in his car and pretend to be having an argument."

Larry: "Yeah! And you can pretend to hit me, and Mike will then hold you back!"

Jay: "That will be great! Let's do it right before lunch, okay?"

Mike: "Sounds good. Hooters for lunch?"

Charlie: "You know it. Let's go a bit early so we can make sure we get a table in Monica's section!"

Larry: "Ooh, I like that Monica!"

Mike: "Okay, we meet back here at 11:45. Later, guys."

*adarian_too* · #37 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by NickSeiler

...says the guy who started this thread to talk about how he's taking Bernie to task and who has posted in it seven times (of twelve responses) with transcripts. :tongue:

Did someone just catch irony in a bottle?

*RAMMAN68* · #38 (**permalink**) -18-03-2005

With all the BS that some of the beat writers in the STL pour out it's no wounder that the practices are closed and Martz is put off by reporters.
I don't know how it is in other NFL cities, but here in SD they don't spew out as much BS about the Chargers (which sometimes is warrented) as BM writes about the Rams.

**HUbison** · #39 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

Here's my take on the St. Louis sportswriters (or at least some of them, certainly not all). The city of St. Louis has had two consistencies in their sports, the Cards and the Blues. The Blues have the longest active playoff streak in professional sports and are generally pretty successful. Therefore, there's not a lot for the reporters to gripe about and "expose" for the Blues. Also, that's a much smaller fan base and not the demographic that is going to sell papers. Then you have the Cards. The city loves them and to say anything bad about the Cards would provoke a riot at the offices of the PD. The public would burn the place to the ground if they blasphemed the Redbirds. That leaves only the Rams. These guys know that dirt sells and the only team they can rub it on if the Rams. They're the new kids in town and have their share of interesting characters to paint in all sorts of controversial colors. And that's what they do, whether the material is factual or pure speculation, if the writers are going to "reveal a seedy underbelly" to a St. Louis professional sports team, they have no choice but pick on the Rams, whether they deserve it or not.

**AvengerRam** · #40 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

And who will avenge this injustice?

Who...?

Who...?

Who...?

Well, it ain't gonna be Underdog, that's for sure. So I guess it has to be me.

*viper* · #41 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

You know, this has been a most interesting thread to watch develop to those of us who have watched it closely. It seems to be a microcosm of life in actuality. I believe we've seen Av do his thing in the beginning, which he is the master thereof, to personal attacks upon him, and thereby others back and forth in defense thereof, to what I can only imagine as one moderator or another wrestling one clan member and perhaps others to the ground to edit personal attacks that started with eLacky who took a shot at Av.

The dynamics of this thread are almost unprecedented and are a learning experience all upon themselves.

Fearlesssone and yodude definitely had some colorful and entertaining things to say.

Personally, although, off subject, as if that was an issue in this thread, I would like to say that I believe Av is entitled to his opinion. He has the right to call anybody on their BS if he feels there is a problem.

I firmly believe that Av is the heart and sole of this board. I thoroughly enjoy his opinion, antics and sense of humor. If he was not here, this board would be lacking, it would be less than it is. Even those of you who have criticized him, have acknowledged that he is a great, if not, the best poster on this site.

Av, I salute you and want you to know that I for one, appreciate, not only your input, but, actually everything you bring to this board. If I was ever to hire a debater, I would hope it would be you (although, Nick would be a close second).

Anyway, thank you for what you bring to this board and know that your ways and sense of humor is appreciated by many of us.

Keep it up my friend!

Here's to a great 2005 for the Rams!!!!

Go Rams!!! :ramlogo:

**AvengerRam** · #42 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

Thanks Viper! Truly kind words.

You know, I think Dez needs to renegotiate my contract and give me a raise!

(Hmmmm.... a 250% increase on a salary of bupkis is...)

*fearlessone* · #43 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by 1st & Goal

Why is a different opinion have to be an agenda? Have been reading this thread and it seems everyone thinks AV is right and Bernie is wrong. This may be true but when someone else speaks up with a different opinion, don't make judgements. :ramlogo:

1st & G:

You are correct, one should never make judgements because a different opinion exists and a different opinion is not always an agenda. The context in which a certain opinion was conveyed contained some over the line, condescending comments that were ugly and seemed to me at least, a personal attack too.

I have conveyed some second opinions concerning certain posts and have been roasted for it but they never seemed to have a personal attack (unless it was ATC, as he truly believes he is the second coming LOL) like a few comments in this thread.

Personally I welcome different opinions and really enjoy them especially when Posters like Yodude, Nick, AV, Moklerman, TeX, etc. go against the grade which is why I hang aroud here :redface: It keeps things interesting.

Have a great weekend,

FLO

**HUbison** · #44 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

So to catch everyone up to speed:

1. Bernie doesn't know (or care to know) the difference between fact and his opinion.
2. AV has no qualms with calling Bernie on the carpet for the above mentioned.
3. Don't ever, ever, ever take a personal shot at someone around here. And certainly nothing based on nationality, race, religion, etc. There's simply no need for it.
4. The greatest characteristic a poster can attain is not knowledge, wit, or humor, but common sense.
5. Viper apparently owes AV a life-debt and is attempting to pay it off with his last post. :redface:

Ok, there's the Cliff notes version of where we've been with this eye-opening thread. Carry on.

*viper* · #45 (**permalink**) -19-03-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by HUbison

.
5. Viper apparently owes AV a life-debt and is attempting to pay it off with his last post. :redface:

OK, OK...I admit it...it was after beer 30! :redface: