Bernie on Poston on Pace

[Nick]

Carl Poston was on the NFL channel on the Sirius (satellite) radio network today.

Here's what he said about Pace and the Rams:

“The situation in St. Louis is a little more difficult because the Rams just fundamentally don’t want to pay an offensive lineman what some of the other positions are being paid. To be quite frank with you, on their side it is a difficult situation because they had Kurt Warner and they had Marshall Faulk. You had two guys who were MVP’s of the League. However, Orlando was there before both of those guys. If you ask either one of those guys, it took the offensive line and, obviously Orlando Pace, to help them with their Super Bowls, Pro Bowls and MVP’s.”

“Now another side of that is Orlando Pace was a number one pick in 1996. Well, the number one pick in 1997 just got 34.5 million dollars and a 100 million dollar contract. However, he’s a quarterback, but he still has not gone to the Super Bowl like Orlando or gone to the Pro Bowl as much as Orlando. Don’t get me wrong, I’m not trying to say that Orlando is a quarterback, however I don’t see Peyton Manning being 40-million or even 30-million or even 20-million dollars more valuable than Orlando Pace. Those are some of the issues that we are confronted with in dealing with Orlando’s deal in St. Louis.”

“I’d like to use Gallery’s deal in Orlando Pace’s situation. You have somebody who hasn’t put their foot on the turf yet, and you have somebody who’s been in the Pro Bowl six years now. You have to take a look at those situations and they will obviously have an impact in Orlando’s contract.”

Cheers,
Bernie

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Post subject: Poston speaks out on Pace

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funny....Pace got more than established NFL tackles as a rookie....Poston didn't complain then...he wants to have it both ways.

Cheers,
Bernie

[general counsel]

Putting aside a lot of the usual poston BS, i dont think you can argue with the fact that pace deserves more money than gallery, and i think quite a bit more. Gallery may be the new Pace, but he has yet to set foot on the field in an NFL game. Sure, pace got more than "established" nfl tackles when he signed originally, but i doubt that he got more than 6 time first team nfl all pros at his position were making at the time.

We better be ready to cough up $20 mill. or i dont see how a deal will get done. If it cant get done long term, at least we need him in camp, and presumably, at some point, he will show up.

ramming speed to all

general counsel

[RamWraith]

As much as I like Pace and hope he signs....I would be willing to help him pack his bags.

The salary cap is not designed for that kind of money for a lineman. In my opinion you are eating away a lot of leverage in the future by signing one lineman and giving that much for one person on a 6 man front. The salary cap is designed for skilled players and a couple of good line man. It would be different if the NFL structured different, but its not. If a tackle gets that much where does it end?? People are beginning to take advantage of the cap and are looking for some outrages demands. If a tackle signs for a 20 million bonus then a QB expects a 100 million. Apples for apples people.

[Yodude]

Holy crap!

Something from Bernie that makes sense and is on the money!

There must be snowballs in Hell today!

[AvengerRam]

Postonomics has little to do with reality.


If you could merge Orlando Pace with Jackie Slater, Anthony Munoz, Jonathan Ogden and a brick wall, he still would only get the money that is available under the salary cap for a top O lineman. To even mention Peyton Manning's contract - even with a concession that Pace can't get that money, is silly. And, while Gallery's contract might be pertinent, I suspect Poston is going to argue that Pace should get millions more than the him, notwithstanding the fact that the Rams need to fit Pace under the cap.

Most importantly, though, Poston simply ignore's one economic reality that does not apply to Gallery. If he asks for too much for Pace, the Rams (unlike the Raiders) can simply offer the franchise tender and nothing more. Pace then can choose to play for $7 Million + or sit.

[adarian_too]

i dont think you can argue with the fact that pace deserves more money than gallery, and i think quite a bit more. Gallery may be the new Pace, but he has yet to set foot on the field in an NFL game.

Not only is it not worth arguing over ... until fans demand that corporate executives realign their values and priorities and stop paying unproven talent more than established stars - regardless of the sport - then one is bound to chase their tail trying to get a handle on who the villian is in the story ...

Is it restraint of trade and/or collusion for the entire draft selection to remain unsigned by any team because they all are demanding more than last year's draft class? The value of a commodity is supposedly based on supply and demand and the NFL has its own minor league system in college football. Eli doesn't want to play in SD? Screw him. Winslow wants more money than Gonzalez. Screw him too. There will be more talent coming out of the college ranks shortly and if the Cts and FTC would gets their acts together - people like Clarett could say they could supply labor sooner - and at a lower cost I bet.

[RamWraith]

*LOL*...PERFECT POINT adarian!!

Not only is it not worth arguing over ... until fans demand that corporate excutives realign their values and priorities and stop paying unproven talent more than established stars - regardless of the sport - then one is bound to chase their tail trying to get a handle on who the villian is in the story ...

[HUbison]

With record contracts coming out every other day (most recent being Winslow's contract --- whose signing bonus was more than his old man's career earnings) the NFL has to reach a boiling point some time. I mean where does it end? With players looking at his neighbor's greener grass and teams willing to mortgage the farm to act as that players ChemLawn, there has to be some point where all of this boils out. But I guess that is why they call it balance.

In today's NFL the greatest skill is not passing, running, catching or tackling, but evaluating. A coach or GM that can properly value the worth of a player and the athlete with the best Net Present Value will find themselves in the Super Bowl.

[Yodude]

In today's NFL the greatest skill is not passing, running, catching or tackling, but evaluating. A coach or GM that can properly value the worth of a player and the athlete with the best Net Present Value will find themselves in the Super Bowl.

Great point, HUbison....and all you have to do is look at the Patriots' organization to witness the validity of your statement.

[DJRamFan]

Poston is talking out of the wrong side of his mouth. Pace is really hurting himself and the team with this garbage. The man can be stellar, but this annual whining ritual is getting old.

[HUbison]

Poston is talking out of the wrong side of his mouth. Pace is really hurting himself and the team with this garbage. The man can be stellar, but this annual whining ritual is getting old.

You're right, DJ. When will he figure out that every year he plays for that tender is another year that he loses money. The Rams will keep franchising him until he his worth descends, and by then nobody will pay him the kind of money he could make if he signs a reasonable long-term deal now. Oh well, I guess the Postons and their cerebral cub-scouts will venture on down the paths of stupidity.

[Nick]

The Rams will keep franchising him until he his worth descends

Then it's only a matter of time before the Rams are forced to ask guys like Faulk or Bruce to rework their contracts. The Rams probably can't afford to continue franchising Pace past this season without either making some significant cuts or getting some renegotiations on contracts. He's going to cost a minimum of $8.46 million in 2005 and $10.15 million in '06 if he's tagged in both of those years. That's going to get pretty costly pretty quickly.

[HUbison]

Then it's only a matter of time before the Rams are forced to ask guys like Faulk or Bruce to rework their contracts. The Rams probably can't afford to continue franchising Pace past this season without either making some significant cuts or getting some renegotiations on contracts. He's going to cost a minimum of $8.46 million in 2005 and $10.15 million in '06 if he's tagged in both of those years. That's going to get pretty costly pretty quickly.

kinda sucks, huh.

[Nick]

kinda sucks, huh.

Yeah, definitely. Perhaps that's why we drafted someone like Chillar, because with the Pace situation, we've no guarantee that we'll be able to keep someone like Polley on our roster. I really hope that if we can't get him signed by March next spring, we start looking for other answers at the LT position. Pace is a great player, but it's not worth self destructing our team over.

[AvengerRam]

Kellen Winslow, Jr. just signed a contract making him the league's highest paid TE... and he's a Poston client.

By Poston's logic, shouldn't Winslow be paid less than Tony Gonzalez?