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  1. #16
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    While Boller was efficient and the playcalling dinked and dunked the Rams down the field and into scoring opportunities, it simply wasn't an impressive display of quarterbacking. I don't think you'll find many people who feel those throws are especially difficult. There was very little passing beyond ten yards of the LOS.
    Agreed, he did enough to get the job done. Too bad Marc didn't have the opportunity to play against the same defense.
    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I rewatched every Boller pass play prior to making my previous response, and really didn't see a substantial amount of pressure. Maybe I need to go back and watch again, but for a guy attempting 20 passes, I don't recall him really getting pressured all that much. Certainly not to the extent Bulger was pressured in only three series against the Jets earlier in the preseason, but then again, I don't think the Bengals' defense is as aggressive as what Rex Ryan is doing up in New York.
    Agreed again .. I was very surprised at the Jets seemingly going all out with their blitz packages in the first preseason game. In the past it seems teams haven't wanted to show much in that area until the regular season starts. However, my comments on Marc's inner clock and comfort in the pocket are not based on just one game, rather a composite of the last couple of years. It isn't just my observations, the PD writers have given voice to this issue more than once.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I agree that Boller is a better athlete than Bulger and better able to make plays using his legs. I would also agree that, over the last two seasons, Bulger's confidence in the pocket has diminished and he's not as likely as he used to be to stand in there and take a brutal hit.I think some of that comes from being coached post-Martz with an emphasis on ball security but also from the beatings he's taken over his career.
    This was exactly the point I was attempting to illustrate: that Boller's comfort in the pocket and his inner clock along with his quick feet seem a tick ahead of where Marc is right now, and has been of late. I am not implying Marc can't regain his confidence, no one really knows yet. It is my hope that the WCO and Shurmur's shrewd playcalling (bring on the dink and dunk if it's working) will be just the restorative tonic Marc sorely needs.

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    That being said, I think Bulger's ability to evade pressure is actually a bit underrated by fans (see, for instance, the 13-yard scramble he had last year against Washington that was called back b/c of a Barron penalty), and I think we saw evidence as recently as the Jets preseason game that Bulger is still very much able to make throws under pressure (see, for instance, the 15-yard completion to McMichael despite two free Jets rushing towards him).
    Marc has scrambled successfully here and there, but Boller from what I've seen is superior in that regard. Marc just needs to regain confidence in his O-line, and also confidence in Pat Shurmur to the extent that Marc will believe in Pat's play calling as opposed to say Linehan's. In other words success breeds confidence, whereas getting creamed at every turn doesn't ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    So again, I'm still not sure I saw anything from Boller that Bulger couldn't have done; while Boller is more likely to take off and run in certain situations, Marc's certainly demonstrated as recently as last season that he can do the same.
    Can't agree here Nick, we'll have to agree to disagree. I have too many images of Bulger holding on to the ball too long, or simply curling up in the fetal position to avoid being killed. I don't blame the guy, there aren't many quarterbacks who would have chosen our O-line to play behind the last couple of years. It seems we both agree that Boller, being the "better athlete," is the more gifted scrambler of the two quarterbacks. Where we see things differently apparently is pocket confidence or awareness. At this point in time from my perspective, Kyle's instincts in this area appear a bit sharper. Why? Well .. most likely because Kyle hasn't had the misfortune of having the snot knocked out of him repeatedly for the last two years ..

    Again should anyone misunderstand, I believe Marc should be our starting QB and have the opportunity to regain his confidence behind our revamped line. Marc may not scramble as well as Kyle, but his accuracy clearly has been superior. His ability to read defenses (at least while standing) has never been a weakness. What is crucial for him this season however, is that he find enough success in Shurmur's system early and often enough, to rediscover his confidence and a bit of swagger.


  2. #17
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    Agreed, he did enough to get the job done. Too bad Marc didn't have the opportunity to play against the same defense.
    Agreed, though we did get to see both Bulger and Boller play against a common opponent in the Jets. In that game, Kyle struggled, going 3/9 for only 25 yards.

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    However, my comments on Marc's inner clock and comfort in the pocket are not based on just one game, rather a composite of the last couple of years. It isn't just my observations, the PD writers have given voice to this issue more than once.
    I understand, but was rather just pointing out the difference in pressure that Bulger saw in preseason action against the Jets and Boller saw in action against the Bengals.

    I'm still not sure I would agree that Boller was pressured that much against Cincy, but would be happy to reexamine the broadcast for specific plays.

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    Marc has scrambled successfully here and there, but Boller from what I've seen is superior in that regard.
    Boller is a better athlete, but I don't think the difference is so vast that I'd refer to his ability as superior. That might be splitting hairs, and if so, I apologize. But Boller's longest career scramble is 19 yards; Bulger's is 29. Their yards per rushing attempt average isn't incredibly far apart (2.5 vs 3.0). Again, I think Boller is more likely and willing to do it because he is the better athlete, but I think Bulger has some underrated (and perhaps underappreciated) legs as well and is more than capable of taking off and running if the opportunity presents itself.

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    Can't agree here Nick, we'll have to agree to disagree.
    It would appear that way. We know Bulger can make quick, accurate passes. I think we can agree on that, as it's largely been a strength of his through his career. We also know Bulger can scramble, as he's done so in the past. Not even the distant past mind you, but just last year, too. So while he may not be as likely to take off and run, he's certainly capable of doing it and getting some good yardage in the process. Thus, I still can't say I saw Boller do anything that I think Marc couldn't have done or hasn't done before. While Marc has, over the last two seasons, lost some pocket awareness, I thought he looked pretty good in that regard in limited action against the Jets. And I think he would have been equally if not more efficient in the kind of gameplan Boller ran against Cincy.
    Last edited by Nick; -08-31-2009 at 12:18 AM.

  3. #18
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    It's not hard to put up solid numbers when your pre-season passing gameplan consists of nearly all quick outs, slants, and curls with minimal downfield passing and few long developing pass plays that leave you exposed in the pocket.

    Boller was efficient but I didn't find him particularly impressive, nor do I agree that it was fascinating that he played well within that situation. He wasn't really called upon to do much, as evident by the lack of downfield passing. I didn't see him do anything that I don't think Bulger could have done in the same situation.
    I haven't seen either QB play this pre-season, but I certainly like the fact that the offense scored multiple TDs in the first quarter. I can't remember the last time that happened over the last 3 years. So that in itself is impressive, no matter the reason.

  4. #19
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Fortuninerhater View Post
    I haven't seen either QB play this pre-season, but I certainly like the fact that the offense scored multiple TDs in the first quarter. I can't remember the last time that happened over the last 3 years. So that in itself is impressive, no matter the reason.
    Last year's Dallas game?

  5. #20
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by PeoriaRam View Post
    Last year's Dallas game?
    Thanks for that. Can you name another?

  6. #21
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Fortuninerhater View Post
    Thanks for that. Can you name another?
    No, but Scott Linebaka's patented "gut run, gut run, incompletion/interception to Drew Bennett" red zone offense doesn't lend itself well to touchdowns.

  7. #22
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    14 completions to 9 receivers is a nice stat, even if the longest went for 14 yards. This is West Coast possesion passing that concentrates on a low-risk/low-reward air attack to spread the defense, run the clock, and move the ball.

    We clearly need a back-up with toughness, otherwise he will be vulnerable to the same schemes that KO Bulger. Boller is tough and can throw. Nice back-up QB. GoRams.
    A defeated look of consternation, dissappointment, or even pain. The name derives from the look one often gets when challenged by a large BM.

  8. #23
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Boller is a better athlete, but I don't think the difference is so vast that I'd refer to his ability as superior. That might be splitting hairs, and if so, I apologize. But Boller's longest career scramble is 19 yards; Bulger's is 29. Their yards per rushing attempt average isn't incredibly far apart (2.5 vs 3.0). Again, I think Boller is more likely and willing to do it because he is the better athlete, but I think Bulger has some underrated (and perhaps underappreciated) legs as well and is more than capable of taking off and running if the opportunity presents itself.
    It's safe to say that nobody is going to mistake either of these guys for Michael Vick when it comes to scrambling, but I think for most quarterbacks yards/attempt are less important than what was gained/avoided by taking off. If the guy gets a first down, avoids a big hit, or buys some time to find the open man, he would be scrambling effectively even if his average wasn't overly impressive.

    As for Boller, my gut reaction would be that we are not in danger of a quarterback controversy. Boller has had some good games in his career, but never put together the kind of season that Bulger proved capable of earlier in his career. That said, if Bulger's quarterback rating hovers in the low 70s like it has the past two years, it is possible that the team could start wondering what Boller might be capable of.

  9. #24
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    Quote Originally Posted by Goldenfleece View Post
    It's safe to say that nobody is going to mistake either of these guys for Michael Vick when it comes to scrambling, but I think for most quarterbacks yards/attempt are less important than what was gained/avoided by taking off. If the guy gets a first down, avoids a big hit, or buys some time to find the open man, he would be scrambling effectively even if his average wasn't overly impressive.

    As for Boller, my gut reaction would be that we are not in danger of a quarterback controversy. Boller has had some good games in his career, but never put together the kind of season that Bulger proved capable of earlier in his career. That said, if Bulger's quarterback rating hovers in the low 70s like it has the past two years, it is possible that the team could start wondering what Boller might be capable of.
    Let's not forget who Marc Bulger has played with when comparing his success to another. Very few QBs can boast that they've played with two probable Hall of Fame wideouts and almost certain Hall of Fame RB. And that's to say nothing of Mike Martz's offensive genious.

    So just because he's enjoyed a lot more success than a lot of other QBs, certainly doesn't mean he was better.

    In my mind, he has always been a QB with average skills, fortunate enough to land in the perfect situation. As long as he's winning, his shortcomings can be overlooked. But when he's not, well........

  10. #25
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    Re: Boller is showing the Rams his mettle ..

    My only concern with Boller right now is his short range touch, especially to the outside. He's got a cannon, no doubt; though it won't be called upon a whole lot in this offense. And he's a tough guy, you betcha. But his misses this year in many instances have come from floating passes over the outstretched hands of open receivers to the outside. In this offense that just can't happen. Those quick outs aren't gonna get you more than 4-6 yards, so what they lack in yardage they have to make up for in consistency.

    I'm not down on Boller. It may just be shaking off the rust, but I would like to see that short yardage touch come around.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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