Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast
Results 16 to 30 of 34
  1. #16
    ramsbruce's Avatar
    ramsbruce is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Here
    Age
    42
    Posts
    3,406
    Rep Power
    50

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by yellow and blue View Post
    They know what they are doing. They are Hall of Famers.
    Exactly.

    Well said.

    BRUUUUUUUUCE


  2. #17
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,550
    Rep Power
    144

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    I once heard an interview with Keyshawn Johnson where he was talking about how he does so much more then just catch passes, how he is a physical blocker downfield, etc... Anyway he got kind of mad and starting saying "I ain't soft! If you wanna be a soft receiver then go play for the Rams."
    An interesting statistic that some may not know:

    As far as 2007 receptions, yards, and TDs, the following people are tied with Keyshawn.....

    1. Me
    2. President Bush
    3. Albert Schweitzer
    4. "Weird" Al Yankovic
    5. Stephen Hawking
    6. Cheech
    7. Chong
    8. Nick & AV

    Is ANYBODY getting my point yet?!?!?

    Keyshawn is sitting behind a desk. No different than any other player who doesn't have it to go anymore! Why the flyin' fornication should Bruce and Holt (both of whom are still playing) take advice from some monkey whose own advice has taken him off the field!?!?!

    I'm not a smart man, but even I can understand this point! Please tell me I'm not alone.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  3. #18
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,550
    Rep Power
    144

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    But has it really made that much of a difference for either health wise?
    Yes, it has! Read my first reply. It lays out the fact that since being introduced to this Martzesque behavior, Bruce and Holt have played in 96.4% of the Rams games.....266 played, 10 missed.
    call it pride if you like.
    Thin line between pride and stupid. Fortunately, Holt and Bruce know the difference so when has-beens like Keyshawn try to lecture about "softness" it comes off as comical at best, but closer to penile inferiority syndrome.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  4. #19
    txramsfan's Avatar
    txramsfan is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2001
    Location
    Poplar Bluff, MO
    Age
    50
    Posts
    7,266
    Rep Power
    65

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    I think maybe some of this has to do with culture, and please my across the pond Ram fan friends I'm not trying to group everyone of you in a category. This is a brutal game played with pads and helmets that are used as weapons, something soccer and rugby don't have. When a WR goes across the middle, stretches out to catch a pass that may be thrown a little to the side (or high even worse), that WR, RB, or TE is at a very vunerable position to be hit that could end their career. The defensive player is coming at them full speed and their job is to dislodge the ball from the receiver with such force that they knock them into a Bugs Bunny movie.

    Now, it sounds like UK has watched a bunch of football. He knows that the pads on a WR are a little smaller than on let's say a LB. The WR probably gets outweighed by 25 lbs or more. Doesn't have as much muscle. SO WHY SHOULD THE WR TAKE THE HIT? TO PROVE THEY ARE TOUGH? To me, they are tough just walking on the field. I'm glad Bruce and Holt hit the deck. What's that extra two yards going to get them? A stint on the IR? Extra yards are for RB's, not WR's.

  5. #20
    UK Ramfan 83 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    688
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    txramsfan,

    Hi there...

    I can see what you're saying..

    Being in the UK I am constantly defending the NFL from people who have no clue about the contact element of the sport. If I had a pound (£) for everytime I have heard someone say "..American football?! Pah! A girls game...look at all that padding they wear. Get that lot over here and get them playing rugby league or rugby union"....yadda yadda ya.

    My defence has always been, have you seen how hard these guys hit each other in the NFL? That is why they have the padding. Also, in the NFL you can smack the crap out of any player even though they don't have the ball....unlike rugby. (Amongst other comparrisons)

    However, playing devils advocate for a second, Top league european rugby union and league teams these days are stacked with absolute cardio monsters and tackling machines who do not wear padding, and have to deal with a very unpleasant experience called 'rucking'. This is where if you fall onto the wrong side of the ball and you are on the floor, the opposing players, who are wearing steel studs, can rake you out of the way with their feet. (More or less stamping on you to get you out of the way!)

    Now I doubt the rugby world cup this year was followed much in the USA if at all. (for obvious cultural reasons) However check out the power and physique's of the guys playing that sport. The guys who play out wide on the wing, and some of the other backs are some of the lightest guys on the field (and by light I mean 'averaging' 235/240lbs) They are considered the 'glamour' players' with the break away speed. Search for Bryan Habana, the South African winger on youtube, and you will see what I mean)

    Most centres and wingers that play rugby run anything from 4.2 to 4.4 40's. (Habana may even be running a 4.0 these days) They also DON'T come off the field after a couple of plays for a rest, such are the levels of their cardio fitness.

    Don't get me wrong, I'm not bashing football, I'm just evidencing the fact that, yes I acknowledge that going over the middle is riddled with risk and injury (Devin BUSH v's a N.O.S. receiver springs to mind about 4/5yrs ago where Bush knocked the guy out cold. NFL highlight reels are littered with like examples) But, when compared to another sport where the hits and circumstances at times are at the very least comparable, (And with 'rucking' just plain wrong!) I just think it's a little unnecessary to fall down, when others seem to manage just fine. Marvin Harrison, Steve Smith, Kevin Cutis (;-P)

    But hey, If the coach want's you to dive then you dive I guess.. I just hate it.

  6. #21
    laram0's Avatar
    laram0 is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Age
    57
    Posts
    9,155
    Rep Power
    107

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    The dives are good with me. Avoiding injury is a huge factor of course. Also, How many times have you seen a player stripped of the ball that was battling for that extra yardage? I say take it to the ground and keep the ball and health for the next offensive play.

  7. #22
    yellow and blue is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Elida, OH
    Age
    23
    Posts
    60
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by laram0 View Post
    The dives are good with me. Avoiding injury is a huge factor of course. Also, How many times have you seen a player stripped of the ball that was battling for that extra yardage? I say take it to the ground and keep the ball and health for the next offensive play.
    Especially when you already gained a first down or however much they get.

  8. #23
    UK Ramfan 83 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    688
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by yellow and blue View Post
    Why do you complain because they fall? When they fall down, there is always a defender right there. I doubt Holt or Bruce will put the defender on his butt and run for another 10 yards.

    They know what they are doing. They are Hall of Famers.. I really don't think their diving is any sort of problem at the moment.

    1. Why do people complain? = For the reasons I have already given.

    2. There is always a defender right there = Not a very good play I would suggest then

    3. I doubt they will put the defender on their butt and run for another 10yds = It would be nice to see them occasionaly try to. Not all DB's are that big.


    Whatever next? Steven Jackson, wearing his red 'no contact' jersey during a game?!?!

  9. #24
    majorram's Avatar
    majorram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    London surrey
    Age
    42
    Posts
    1,420
    Rep Power
    20

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Hey UK Ramfan 83 welcome.... I will say that I'm all for Bruce and Holt hitting the hay, nice to have them STILL on the field,

    Both still take punishment ever sunday!!! and they are BOTH excellent blockers down field something you don't always see....


    steve:l
    "The breakfast Club"

  10. #25
    UK Ramfan 83 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2007
    Location
    United Kingdom
    Posts
    688
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Hi majorram,

    Good point. They are good blockers. Though in the past I have actually seen Bruce on TV during a game gettin' some verbals froma DB for blocking in open play below the waist..........well below the waist in fact. Between the DB's knees and ankles to be precise on the replay.... Albeit this was around 2003.

    I do accept that they are 'skill & finesse' type receivers rather than 'aggresive & hard nosed' types...
    Last edited by UK Ramfan 83; -11-21-2007 at 04:44 PM. Reason: Error in spelling

  11. #26
    RealRam's Avatar
    RealRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2001
    Location
    Mexico
    Posts
    8,222
    Rep Power
    68

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by UK Ramfan 83 View Post
    Whatever next? Steven Jackson, wearing his red 'no contact' jersey during a game?!?!

    Well I sure hope not! Point well taken UK. It's pro football.

    Earlier I mentioned how the game has changed in terms of protecting the $uper $tars, i.e., the evolving approach the NFL has taken in order to protect its main re$ource$.


    While I admit there are excellent, justified, and wise reasons for this modern day philo$ophy of "protecting" the player$, I still agree with you UK: one should not be expected to see the actual game of contact eventually turn into flag football* in order to keep the team$ investment$ healthy and $trong all year long!

    There has to be a happy medium and apparently WRs diving and sliding before a potential big hit is one of these agreement$.


    Again, I'll give into the evolution of player protection in pro football. Yes, 45 years ago there were still players using helmets with no face mask at all (and the padding inside was l-o-w tech). Everything has evolved: mouth guards, uniform material, flack jacket, shoulder pads, even the black eye shades are "advanced, new and improved"! That's fine. I'm all for this type of high tech and progress.

    And no, 45 years ago automobiles did not have air bags. :x


    IMO though, the contact concept in football is different in that it should be maintained in accordance to the nature of the game without playing dirty, i.e., within rules of sportsmanship. I do not condone dirty play.

    It's no wonder some old -- and I mean old -- and retired players scoff at and redicule some of the rule$ in place to keep NFL QBs clean and pretty at the end of the season! Or RBs and WRs for that matter.

    Ray Nitschke, Deacon Jones, Dick Butkus, Bubba Smith, Tommy Nobis, Merlin Olsen, Dick 'Night Train' Lane, Larry Wilson, Lonnie Warwick, Ben Davidson, Mike Curtis, Jack Tatum ... this non-dirty dozen is just a sample of defenders that, to say the least, probably just smile and shake their head every time they hear a "roughing the passer" penalty called.

    From Chuck Bednarik to Jack Lambert, these football players gave as hard and as good as they received, for there were true monsters on the offensive side too; Larry Csonka for example (Bednarik also 'enjoyed' playing OL in addition to LB). That was the game. Hard nosed, tough, violent.


    Fast forward to the 21st century and we're debating how not to get hurt in pro football. That's okay, don't get me wrong. Pro football is that, a profession, a business. And that too is the 'nature' of the game.

    As it is, we, the 2007 Rams can surely testify what it means to lose so many players due to injury. What it means to lose on the scoreboard and in the bottom line of the organization's bank account. And as the ebb of the stock market does, so do pro sports teams, when they go through seasons with a plethora and the misery of sport-induced casualties.

    :\ Was it just our turn this year...


    In conclusion, I'll accept, though somewhat reluctantly, that on occasion our own Bruce and Holt and company follow this dive / slide receiver tactic because I know, and I trust, they will nevertheless always play hard and professionally.



    *. - UK83, 'Flag Football', are you familiar with this variation?
    Last edited by RealRam; -11-22-2007 at 10:08 PM.

  12. #27
    Drew's Avatar
    Drew is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Milford Haven
    Posts
    512
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Complaining about Holt and Bruce "diving" over the years is like having the best filet mignon you've ever had, cooked perfectly, and complaining that the plate it is served on is slightly chipped.
    lol!!! Man, i felt a little wee seep out then...am a boy drew as opposed to a drew barrymore,honestly!

    am on my second bottle of jim beam tho so dont hold anything against me....

  13. #28
    Drew's Avatar
    Drew is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Milford Haven
    Posts
    512
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    An interesting statistic that some may not know:

    As far as 2007 receptions, yards, and TDs, the following people are tied with Keyshawn.....

    1. Me
    2. President Bush
    3. Albert Schweitzer
    4. "Weird" Al Yankovic
    5. Stephen Hawking
    6. Cheech
    7. Chong
    8. Nick & AV

    Is ANYBODY getting my point yet?!?!?

    Keyshawn is sitting behind a desk. No different than any other player who doesn't have it to go anymore! Why the flyin' fornication should Bruce and Holt (both of whom are still playing) take advice from some monkey whose own advice has taken him off the field!?!?!

    I'm not a smart man, but even I can understand this point! Please tell me I'm not alone.

    didn`t realise Keyshawn"i have not caught anything but man-flu this year" Johnson had said that!

    but having found out, would like to add....you are not alone anymore!

  14. #29
    Drew's Avatar
    Drew is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Milford Haven
    Posts
    512
    Rep Power
    9

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    as for anyone claiming Bruuuuuuuuuuuuuuce is soft,anyone see the hit Jon Lynch done on him during the opening game last season,to which Ike got up in a heartbeat??

  15. #30
    AlphaRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    a
    Posts
    2,521
    Rep Power
    74

    Re: Bruce and Holt still diving then ?!?!

    Quote Originally Posted by moloch41 View Post
    I'm bothered by soft play, but the both of them seem to lay the ball on the carpet when they get hit, so as long as they're holding onto it- I'm all for them sliding down.
    That is another reason why Holt and Bruce go down before taking a hit. Defenders like to stand-up a receiver and strip the ball.

    Bruce was the one that convinced Holt about taking the dive. My understanding is that he told Holt that it would lengthen his career.

    The funny thing is that Bruce and Holt in 1999 had a combined yards after catch of either 17.3 or 19.3 yards after a catch average (going from memory).
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

Page 2 of 3 FirstFirst 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 15
    Last Post: -07-11-2007, 06:43 PM
  2. Bruce Happy to be Back
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 4
    Last Post: -04-22-2006, 01:27 AM
  3. Holt: mild-mannered reporter
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: -02-01-2006, 10:32 PM
  4. Bulger, Bruce, Holt Making Progress
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -11-10-2005, 10:09 PM
  5. Bruce and Holt: Rams Dynamic Duo
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: -10-24-2004, 11:19 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •