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  1. #1
    general counsel's Avatar
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    bruce vs. curtis

    Modified version of The Big Red Man's prior post on whether to bring ike back. As i mentioned in my response to the big red mans thread, i dont think that in the cap era you can answer a question like that without a lot more data (ie intangibles/leadership, cap hit to waive, cap cost to replace the production, current cap cost of the player involved).

    However, if we want to have an interesting hypothetical discussion and ignore the cap for a minute, in a vacuum, dollars aside, who would you rather have as the rams #2 receiver in 2007, bruce or curtis.

    Personally, i still think ike is the better guy right now. Will that be true in two years? Maybe, maybe not. Curtis is not getting any faster as he gets older. He is certainly faster than ike, but i think he is less reliable and not as precise a route runner, which is very important. Dont get me wrong, i like curtis a lot and think he can be a good #2 receiver, but i think he is like Az, a star #3 guy to stretch the field but not so sure he will be a terrific #2 and i dont see the big upside for the future given that he is already 29.

    For my money, i think ike is more valuable right now and i think that curtis is likely to get more money on the open market than ike is currently paid, which makes this an easy choice for me when you throw in the cap considerations, which of course includes the hit you have to take if you waive bruce.

    ramming speed to all

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  2. #2
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Curtis is a good WR, and in the right system, probably could put up some pretty good numbers.

    Bruce is a HOFer, who is still among the most productive "#2 WRs" in football.

    Even with their age difference, this one is a no-brainer, in my opinion.

    Bruce stays.

    Curtis probably goes.

  3. #3
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Avenger hit the nail on the head. Isaac stays, Curtis goes. Although it doesn't really have to be that way, its up to Curtis, who knows what he really wants?


    Always and Forever a fan of the St. Louis Rams

  4. #4
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Quote Originally Posted by Varg6 View Post
    Avenger hit the nail on the head. Isaac stays, Curtis goes. Although it doesn't really have to be that way, its up to Curtis, who knows what he really wants?
    I'm a fan of both Curtis and Bruce (of course, they're both RAMS!) and I agree that it "doesn't have to be that way". Keeping both would be my preference, while we draft a bigger WR to groom for the future.

    Both Bruce and Curtis bring different things to the table. Bruce brings experience and is still one of the best, if not THE best, route runners in all of football. Curtis on the other hand is a much faster receiver. Not a little faster, he's a lot faster. However, being a receiver in the NFL is much more than pure speed. Anybody remember Ron Brown?

    Great receivers know how to get separation from their defenders. They know how to read a D and find the holes and gaps in coverage. They know how to sell a move to a defender that sets them up for THE move that gets them separation for the catch. In my opinion, Bruce is still better at this than Curtis. Curtis gets his separation from his speed, and being a #3, he has the advantage of having (usually) slower guys on his tail which increases his chances of separation.

    My question is, can/could Curtis hold up as the #2 guy over a 16-game season? I have my doubts. But, honestly, nor can Bruce anymore... So, it's kind of a draw in that respect, in my opinion. The Rams best interest would be to keep things at #2 & #3 as they are and see how the year plays out. Unfortunately, I believe Curtis will do what's best for him (financially) and move on. The question then becomes, who moves into the #3 spot?

    Bottomline, if you held a gun to my head and made me choose between the two, based solely on talent and worth, I'd take Bruce. Although, I may change my mind next year.
    Faithful Rams fan since 1968

  5. #5
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    The one guy on offense who was consistently rock solid in execution and didn't miss a beat from game one this year was Ike. The fact that he was able to absorb the new offense from the beginning while everyone else was having difficulty speaks volumes about his intelligence and skill as a receiver, but more than anything, his value.

    He still gets open in critical situations, always makes the clutch catch and continues to look and play like a Hall of Famer. He's one of those rare players with that special aura around him.

    I love Curtis, but Ike has proven to all who doubted him that he is still the man.

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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Quote Originally Posted by RAMFANRAIDERHATER View Post
    My question is, can/could Curtis hold up as the #2 guy over a 16-game season? I have my doubts. But, honestly, nor can Bruce anymore.
    I'm not sure how you can say you don't think Bruce can hold up for 16 games. He just played all 16 games this past season, there is nothing that suggests he can't play a full season next year. On top of that he's only missed 6 games in 8 years.
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce
    The backhanded compliments about Austin Davis are amusing.

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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce View Post
    On top of that he's only missed 6 games in 8 years.
    The slacker!

    I have to agree that Bruce is the one that I would keep. He's still very productive. He has a few more years left in the tank. Curtis has the speed, but not the experience and he's not getting any younger. If Curtis decides to move on, I like the idea of bringing in a taller WR to groom to replace Bruce when its time.

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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Quote Originally Posted by RAMFANRAIDERHATER View Post
    Anybody remember Ron Brown? .
    if im thinking of the right guy kick returner around the late eighties to early nighties a bit of a tony horne of his day without the production of horne

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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    keep both hopefully and draft someone for the future but if only one then keep bruce as the rev is a natural preacher after all!

  10. #10
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    Re: Bruce vs. Curtis

    All the above is good reading.

    Bruce vs. Curtis. It is a very interesting debate we've had here for awhile regarding these two Ram receivers and the cap issues combined with the excellent abilities of both WRs makes it a somewhat difficult choice.

    I go for the easy decision: KEEP BOTH! Sir Isaac is the epitome of a Rams icon and speedy, sure handed Curtis is a very fine #3. Both would avail much for the next season, minimum.

    If KC feels he needs to explore the market, let him be. I for one would prefer that he stay for 07. The picture of Holt / Bruce / Curtis is just too enticing for me not to want to keep enjoying.

  11. #11
    Country's Avatar
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    I think that the Rams have a 0% chance of resigning Curtis and it is not because of the money.

    Curtis is going to leave so he can go to a team that will throw at him more. Even if he stays and replaces Bruce he won't get as many balls as he would playing in KC or a place like that.

    It sucks though because it makes WR a draft need.

  12. #12
    viper's Avatar
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Quote Originally Posted by Country View Post
    I think that the Rams have a 0% chance of resigning Curtis and it is not because of the money.

    Curtis is going to leave so he can go to a team that will throw at him more. Even if he stays and replaces Bruce he won't get as many balls as he would playing in KC or a place like that.

    It sucks though because it makes WR a draft need.
    I'm OK with Curtis leaving, if that is what happens, as long as we get someone that is a big receiving threat and/or is a great kick/punt returner or both. If not, Looker is a very good possession receiver and we have a few prospects on the practice squad that could step up. Not to mention what we may acquire thru F/A or the draft.

  13. #13
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    Bruce has been & still is what i want to see in a WR. It was just last off season he was released & we were all shocked beyond belief. We prayed, hoped & wished for his return before he could be signed by another team. Are prayers were answered, Bruce comes back & has another steller season, adding to his already impressive resume. I'm blowin away that we are even havin this debate. Curtis needs to test the market & if he moves on so be it, we will be fine drafting a young WR to be tutored by 2 of the best WR in the league.

  14. #14
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    I would rather have Bruce than curtis any day, Curtis will have his pay day and leave and I don't blame him!! but could he be that No1 WR on a team?? cause that what he will be paid for???

    steve
    "The breakfast Club"

  15. #15
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    Re: bruce vs. curtis

    I think unless martz reels him into the lions who seem to love to throw money at wr's. we will resign curtis. I mean with the expanded cap it would make sence that we lock him up before the market throws anything at him. He likes it here it sounds like and we all love him. Remember that not everyone is in it for the money. Unless his agent is a Poston like greedy monster. why wouldn
    t we just lock him up for a 3 yr, prepare for the future in sound fashion and take a 2nd day returner to be groomed along with curtis and underused looker. Then after that we can work of defence.

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