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Thread: The case against Jeff Fisher

  1. #16
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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Thanks TNT for posting. Good to get a titan fan's view.
    I agree with pretty much everything which is why I didn't really want Fisher. I heard people saying he would help Bradford and have good offensive gameplans, which made no sense to me because he was on the defensive side of the ball. I don't watch a lot of Titans games and assumed his defense was fairly good during his tenure, and that he at least made decent gameplans. I knew his defense was sort of vanilla (not as bland as you say), so the only way I wanted him to be HC is with Gregg Williams as DC since the defense would be more aggressive.

    For all the hate Spags got (from almost everyone) as a guy who didn't run a tight ship, was a players coach, ran the ball and was ultra conservative I don't see how Fisher is different. He's probably more conservative since Spags was very aggressive and blitz happy on defense (I was a fan of the defense he ran).

    Fisher is Spagnuolo with a mustache and previous experience.


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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    So the coach who you had for 16 years sucked. Wow, that's really unfortunate.

    Thanks for stopping by.
    Wow, did you even read his post? He didn't say Fisher sucked. He argued some of Fisher's selling points with facts and numbers.

    I think Fisher is a good coach. I wouldn't mind him coaching in STL. I just don't think he's a great coach. There are concerns I have about his philosophy offensively. But he is the most high profile candidate out there, so of course he will get the most attention by the media, which in turn makes some people beleive he's the only guy available right now who can help us win.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    I'll tell you one of the biggest reasons I don't want Fisher, it is because I think when this is all said and done he's going to not only be the highest paid coach in the league, but get a VP tag attached to being a HC which just makes me sick. He is an OK coach.

    I would rather have the next Tomlin, McCarthy or Payton, then the next Jeff Fisher...or Jeff Fisher himself.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Quote Originally Posted by Fettmaster View Post
    Wow, did you even read his post? He didn't say Fisher sucked. He argued some of Fisher's selling points with facts and numbers.
    All contained in a list of "myths" about Jeff Fisher.

    That did not come accross as an objective analysis to me.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike View Post
    Again, I appreciate your perspective, which might temper the fact that Fisher is perceived by many as some sort of a savior. Something I'm not convinced of.
    I agree Mike, I'm not convinced either. On the flip side, who else is out there? I don't want another OC/DC "genius" as a head coach this time. We've done that before, let's try something new. The last time we did that we brought back Dick Vermeil. I'm not saying we will become the GSOT, but who knows. What we have been doing lately isn't working obviously.

    With all of that said, I don't like that Fisher seems to be milking this Miami vs STL "coaching showdown".
    Last edited by ramsbruce; -01-11-2012 at 05:25 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by RealRam
    What next, NFL gay players kissing on the mouth. To me it is S.O.S.: simply/obscene/sickening. Rest assured I will never cheer for a known homo player

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Goods point Azul. The GM position is deemed as secondary in importance, to the HC, for some reason.? Again, you have pointed out to me, more evidence to suggest, that maybe the fascination in hiring Jeff Fisher, does lack an element of knowledge for some of us, including myself.?

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    All contained in a list of "myths" about Jeff Fisher.

    That did not come accross as an objective analysis to me.
    Look, you're right, I'm not 100% objective. I'm a fan of a team who just got rid of a long term coach, and that coach is being hyped up a bit. There's a reason a Titans fan posted this and not a Bears fan or something. With that said though I don't think anything I posted couldn't have been written by a more 'objective' source. In other words I don't think anything I said couldn't be reasonably concluded and agreed upon by anyone else who scratched beyond the surface.

    For what it's worth, I had noticed and argued against the myths years before Fisher did leave. Honestly it seemed to me most media coverage of him was very lazy and didn't bother to investigate beyond the perceptions that somehow became popular belief with Fisher, and this has lead to a lot of fans out there not too familar with the Titans believing it all to be so.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Fair enough. I'm just waiting for the chips to fall into place. I see a lot of good reasons to favor Fisher for the Rams' HC position, but I will be fine if we end up going in another direction.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    I'm tired of this circus. It's obvious this guy has no strong desire to be the HC of the Rams. So, why all the fuss over him?


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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    Just a few thoughts here:

    Myth #1 – Fisher is hard nosed, and makes a disciplined team
    I think this is somewhat conflating several issues. When I think of "hard-nosed", I think mentally tough. When I think of a "disciplined" team, I think of a team where defensive players maintain gap assignments, receivers run the right routes and contribute to run blocking, etc. Finally, when I think of a disciplinarian, I think of the Tom Coughlin school of coaching where team rules are strictly enforced. There have been some players' coaches who didn't have to run their players down to have a tough, disciplined defense. Different coaches have different ways of getting the most from their players. Generally, from what I could tell, Fisher's teams were mentally tough, tenacious, scrappy, "hard-nosed", what have you...but maybe not necessarily disciplined.

    Myth #2 – Under Fisher, the Titans always had a tough D
    I don't think many really believe that the Titans always had a tough D. Although some coaches can sometimes scheme around the loss of talent, often teams that succeed after injuries owe as much to superior depth as to superior coaching. I think we are all pretty aware that Fisher coached some very good teams, and he also coached through some awful years of cap hell. And yeah, Fisher's D wasn't particularly exotic, but some of the best defenses don't do a lot of things--they just do what they do very well, and that does tie back to that question about discipline. If you run the same base defense most of the time, but everybody is very clear on what their responsibilities are, it can still be effective. Everybody and their mother knew how Tampa 2 worked, and yet it was still effective.

    Myth #3 – Fisher brings stability
    I agree that Fisher's long tenure speaks more to the organization than it does to his talents, but to be fair, Bill Cowher didn't win a Super Bowl until his 14th season with the Steelers. People don't tend to hold that against him too much because at a career .623, he's one of the top 15 winningest head coaches in league history. Fisher's career .542 record isn't so shiny. I think he ranks somewhere around 40th in league history.

    Myth #4 – Fisher mostly had poor talent to work with
    You say McNair was underused, but he was a career 82.8 QB rating quarterback. He was very athletic, but early in his career, he didn't seem all that accurate. My impression was that there were some years that he had a lot of talent to work with, but some of his better work was getting bad teams to 7-9. Of course, that does raise a legit point that we might be getting a coach who is better at not being awful than he is at winning championships. It'd be better than what we've had recently, but it might not be enough.

    Conclusion
    Fisher is a good coach, but he is being massively overrated at the moment because of his friends in the media.
    I tend to agree with the assessment that he's a good coach but overrated a bit at the moment. I wouldn't say that's because of friends in the media, though, so much as because there aren't a lot of attractive options in terms of proven coaches who want back into the game. If Dungy, Cowher and Chucky are all off the table, Fisher starts looking like a solid candidate for the honor of being the "Best of the Rest".
    Last edited by Goldenfleece; -01-12-2012 at 01:38 AM.

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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    it pisses me off how he's stalling... every day i hate him even more for not signing.. it should be the opposite he's the dude with no job and he can be replaced in a quick second.. he's making this so over dramatic..
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    Re: The case against Jeff Fisher

    After all the above is funneled into the fans grinder analyzer (mine is getting saturated from Clan info), I'd like to know the consensus on this, even if it is only our impression:

    How is Fisher regarded in general by the PLAYERS he's coached (coordinator / HC)?

    Well respected as a leader? Players recognize Fisher's achievements? Liked as a mentor? Et cetera.

    Thanks. You too, TNT.
    Last edited by RealRam; -01-12-2012 at 03:00 AM. Reason: Ram

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