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Thread: The curious case of Sam Bradford

  1. #46
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    Who's this guy who led the pre-game fire up session, threw for 3 TD's, had a 100+ rating, and helped lead his team to a win? It can't be the guy being discussed in this thread, can it?
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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by renrawtruk View Post
    Bradford is proving to be one-dimensional, which he got away with at Oklahoma. He is going in to run the play that is called. No audibles, no leading the team, no pointing at the defense and making adjustments to the play at the LOS. Just simply going out there to throw the ball to the guy the play was designed to go to. At doing that, he has proven to be somewhere in the middle to bottom half of the league...15th-23rd- where almost all his career statistics land.
    Interesting observation.

    I'm not sure I really disagree with your general premise here. Bradford is not a Manning or a Brees; you rarely if ever see him come to the line, diagnose a defense, adjust the play, and strike a devastating shot into their coverage. Is he capable of it? Scouts raved about his intellect coming out of college.

    He seems very much like a "I'm going to take what they give me" quarterback rather than "I'm going to make them pay for giving me this" quarterback. There's a part of me that wonders if a series of conservative head coaches in the pros has also hindered him in this regard, but if it's something observed going back to college, you can't just pin it on the NFL.


    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    This is why arguing about Sam is such a waste of time here or on any message board...

    Sam is a mid-tier starting NFL QB right now, with the potential to be a second tier. That means he can be as good as many guys who have won Super Bowls (Joe Flacco, Eli Manning), even if he'll never be a first tier (elite) QB (P.Manning, Brees, Rodgers, Brady).

    He is not, as some would like to label him, a "bad QB" or a "bust." Is he disappointing as a first overall pick? I suppose, though he's a heck of a lot better than Jamarcus Russell or David Carr (and at least as good as Alex Smith).

    If you think the Rams should get rid of him (which, right now, would kill their salary cap) and roll the dice on a college QB (and, no, the Rams aren't getting Teddy Bridgewater), you are entitled to your opinion.

    I understand fully, though, why the Rams' front office and coaching staff disagrees with you.
    This sums it up pretty well.

    Bradford isn't an elite quarterback, and it's possbile he never will be. But seeing as how there are really only four elite quarterbacks in a 32-team league right now, it's not exactly an easy feat to achieve.

    I think one problem here is the expectation that accompanies drafting a quarterback first overall. People want a cream of the crop guy. But consider that no team that has drafted a quarterback first overall in the last decade has received an elite quarterback in return.

    Carr and Russell were busts. Smith is efficient at best but hardly elite. Newton seems to be getting worse the longer he plays. Palmer spent most of his career in mediocrity. Stafford's numbers are nice, but they don't seem to translate to wins. Eli has two rings but hasn't had the consistency of an elite passer. The closest one to being elite is Luck, but it's too soon to tell.

    When a team drafts a quarterback first overall, fans expect to get the next Peyton. But they should probably be satisfied if they get the next Eli. And that's a level that I think Sam can reach, though he's not there yet.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rambos View Post
    The comparative stats stance doesn't work anymore, if you are a non Bradford supporter. Right, when this year is over it's going to be hard to say Bradford is the problem when he has monster numbers.
    Let's not pretend it's just one side that picks and chooses what matters and what doesn't when it comes to measuring Bradford's success.

    Sam's rookie passing numbers were hardly great - 25th in the league that year in passer rating, for instance - and yet he was praised endlessly because he helped turn the team around to the point where they were contending for a playoff spot. Wins were important then, now it's a different story.

    Food for thought - Tony Romo puts up great numbers every year, but as the full time starter, he has only three seasons with winning records under his belt, the last of which was '09. There's a reason he's never mentioned in the conversation about elite QBs.


    Quote Originally Posted by BarronWade View Post
    Maybe this season its obvious Bradford is not the next Peyton Manning however he can be a Joe Flacco who won a super bowl with a good supporting cast...Lets see how we play in houston
    And I think that's the rub - Bradford may not be the next Peyton Manning, but he's talented enough that he should be able to get the job done with a good supporting cast.

    The two immediate questions that causes me to think of are...

    1) Will that be enough for some people?

    2) How long will it take for the Rams to assemble this good supporting cast?


    Quote Originally Posted by RealRam View Post
    “I talked to Chris earlier,” Bradford said. “He kind of came up to me and was like, ‘Hey, we need you today.’ I thought it was the right thing. I thought that it was time for me, because I usually don’t say a whole lot. I’m pretty reserved.

    “But I think today was a good time for me to get fired up. To let the guys know that it was time to roll. Hopefully, it worked. I think everyone was pretty fired up when I got in there.”

    Judging by the result, a 34-20 Rams victory, maybe Bradford should replace Long in the pregame team huddle.

    “I don’t know, he’s pretty good at it,” Bradford said. “And I realized afterwards it’s a lot of yelling. I was pretty tired after I got done with it. If that’s what it takes, I have no problem jumping in there doing it. But Chris is the one who usually gets everyone fired up, too.”
    I don't think this is going to change anyone's perspective, to be honest.

    People that tend to lean heavily in the pro-Bradford camp will look at this and see a guy stepping up into a bigger leadership role when the team has needed him the most to get them fired up and ready to play, just as many have wanted.

    But those with a more critical stance of Sam will see this as him having to be asked by Chris Long to become that guy, only to essentially hand the role back over to Long with these statements rather than keep it himself.
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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by RealRam View Post

    “I don’t know, he’s pretty good at it,” Bradford said. “And I realized afterwards it’s a lot of yelling. I was pretty tired after I got done with it. If that’s what it takes, I have no problem jumping in there doing it. But Chris is the one who usually gets everyone fired up, too.”
    For some strange reason i am craving waffles after reading this...
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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Nick is the only sane one on this board including myself and especially concerning AV. Go Rams!

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Sam Bradford continues to receive criticism, and most... well, some of it is fair.

    He does lock on to receivers a bit too much. He does check down way too much. His pocket presence is poor, at times. He sometimes waits to long to launch the deep pass, resulting in underthrows.

    But... when you step back and look at the numbers after 5 games, this is what you'll find:

    Yards: 13th in the NFL (ahead of Tom Brady, Colin Kaepernick, Russell Wilson, Andrew Luck)

    TDs: 5th (tied) in the NFL (ahead of Matthew Stafford, Tom Brady, Joe Flacco, Colin Kaepernick)

    Passer Rating: 14th in the NFL (ahead of Tom Brady, RGIII, Andy Dalton, Cam Newton)

    Completion %: 21st in the NFL (tied with Russell Wilson, ahead of Joe Flacco, Colin Kaepernick and Tom Brady)

    I'm only going to draw one conclusion from these numbers: there is still hope for Sam Bradford.

    I want to see him throw the ball down the field more. I want the Rams to tear up a portion of their playbook (under the heading: short passes). I want to see more designed rollouts and bootlegs from Bradford (who is better on the run than most realize).

    But don't tell me there's no hope.

    The numbers and I disagree with that notion.
    Completion percentage is not a plus. 21st in the NFL pretty much sucks. I agree he needs to throw the ball down field more. All these dink passes he throws are maddening. He needs to become a leader and take control.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramhearder View Post
    Nick is the only sane one on this board including myself and especially concerning AV. Go Rams!
    Oh, so that makes me insane? Watch your words amigo.


  7. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Ramhearder View Post
    Nick is the only sane one on this board including myself and especially concerning AV. Go Rams!
    Speak for yourself, loco.

  8. #53
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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderwolf View Post

    Completion percentage is not a plus. 21st in the NFL pretty much sucks. I agree he needs to throw the ball down field more. All these dink passes he throws are maddening. He needs to become a leader and take control.
    21st isn't great, but its higher than the two starting QBs from last year's Super Bowl.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by VegasRam View Post
    That's not actually a slam either - he has flashes, and he's been receiver poor, but I still believe this is his make or break year, and would not give him the big contract (at least until the end of the year after proving he warrants it. Right now he doesn't imho).

    Bradford has basically had 4 different systems to try and learn in the 4 years he has been there. As a rookie that has got to be tough. So I say he is given a pass the first two years and chalk it up to experience.

    The third year I think he should have done better, but, he had no receivers to throw to, so he gets another pass.

    Everyone says this is his make or break year and I agree. He has gotten valuable experience, and he knows what its like to lose. This year he has gotten his receivers so no more excuses. We have no running game and that's going to have to be addressed either with a trade or in the next draft so while the team may not make it to the playoffs, Bradford should show marked improvement in his passing game and his ability to pass down field. The when we have some decent people to hand the ball off to, the passing game will get that much better...................hopefully.

    So in my mind this is the year we see if Bradford is our quarterback of the future. If he does not improve significantly in all phases of the game, its going to be time to start looking for another quarterback. And so far, Bradford has NOT shown that improvement. The rest of the season will be very telling.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Speak for yourself, loco.
    Did someone say crazy?

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    Quote Originally Posted by Spiderwolf View Post

    And so far, Bradford has NOT shown that improvement. The rest of the season will be very telling.
    You mean, apart from the fact that he's on pace to top his career best numbers in yards, TDs and passer rating.

    Guys... this is the big boy table... if you're going to take a position, try to back it up with more than indignation.
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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    One thing in this debate is for sure, Sam Bradford has not earned any extention Mr Fisher, Demoff, Snead.

    I don't care what you think his potential is, you'd be foolish to extend him at this point.

    My biggest problem with this whole thing is Sam Bradford was handed the job from day one. He hasn't had to earn anything because people in this organization have placed the proverbial silver spoon in his mouth.

    Why do you think he himself is not currently concerned about any contract extention? Because he knows what most Ram fans know, he hasn't earned it.

    Sam Bradford has proven to be nothing more than mediocre to this point in his career.

    All the arguments about what he could be and the comparisons to QBs that have actually led their teams to the playoffs and beyond, seem ridiculous to me.

    The bottom line is, Sam has done nothing to this point in his career, to warrant an extention or comparisons to those QBs.

    In fact, if his play doesn't drastically improve to where he's consistently good, one of my 1st round picks would be used on a fearless QB with all the intangibles in next year's draft.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Nick's

    Let's not pretend it's just one side that picks and chooses what matters and what doesn't when it comes to measuring Bradford's success.

    Sam's rookie passing numbers were hardly grea
    t - 25th in the league that year in passer rating, for instance - and yet he was praised endlessly because he helped turn the team around to the point where they were contending for a playoff spot. Wins were important then, now it's a different story.

    Food for thought - Tony Romo puts up great numbers every year, but as the full time starter, he has only three seasons with winning records under his belt, the last of which was '09. There's a reason he's never mentioned in the conversation about elite QBs.
    From Wikipedia

    In his first eight games he scored eleven TDs, which tied an NFL record—held by Dan Marino (1983), Peyton Manning (1998), and Ben Roethlisberger (2004)

    Bradford went 3-2 as a starter in October, passing for 1019 yards and 7 TDs against 3 INTs. He was named the NFL's offensive rookie of the month.

    During October and November, he established a record for most consecutive passes without an interception for a rookie (169)

    In November 28, 2010, against the Denver Broncos, Bradford became the first rookie in NFL history to pass for at least 300 yards and three touchdowns with no interceptions during a road victory.

    He capped November by becoming the first rookie QB to win two consecutive Offensive Rookie of the Month awards.

    On December 26, Bradford surpassed Peyton Manning's record for most completed passes by an NFL rookie quarterback (326).

    Bradford finished the season with 354 completions out of 590 attempts, surpassing Manning's record of 575 for most attempts by an NFL rookie quarterback.

    Bradford became just the third rookie quarterback to start all 16 regular season games and pass over 3000 passing yards, joining Peyton Manning and Matt Ryan.

    I don't know Nick he did some pretty cool stuff in his rookie year and the names he surpassed where pretty good.

    Food for thought - Tony Romo puts up great numbers every year, but as the full time starter, he has only three seasons with winning records under his belt, the last of which was '09. There's a reason he's never mentioned in the conversation about elite QBs.
    Yeah and one of the reasons is Jerry Jones and the other is because he's not.

    If I'm Bradford I would sign a short term extension with the Rams to help them add better players. If they can't get it right I would start planning for my best landing spot. Teams in a few years that will need a QB. Patriots, Denver, Saints. Sam will 28, 29 with 6, 7 years of playing time. He will have pretty good numbers, Kind of like SJ he just played for a bad team and or organization. If he plays it right he can make sure he has the right offense, that gives him the best chance to get to the next level. Look how desperate teams are for a QB. Flynn played one good game and was over paid by the Hawks. Freeman gets cut and has a new deal and a chance with a better team. Sam will get another opportunity if the Rams can't put a quality team together. I hope they can. Who knows what Sam is thinking maybe he can't wait to get the hell out of St Louis the way so many fans talk about the guy. It's kind of been mentioned that Sam does not want an extension at this time, I wonder why? Maybe the best move for him is a fresh start, where he picks the organization, kind of like Steve Young.
    Last edited by Rambos; -10-08-2013 at 01:24 AM.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    This time it was Bradford. He was as animated as he has ever been, shouting words of encouragement with the rest of the team bobbing up and down around him and shouting themselves. So much for Silent Sam.

    “I talked to Chris earlier,” Bradford said. “He kind of came up to me and was like, ‘Hey, we need you today.’ I thought it was the right thing.
    IMO, the fact that the team looked to Bradford at a time when it was in dire need of inspiration, speaks volumes. I still believe in Sam Bradford, and it's quite apparent to me, that his teammates do as well.

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    Re: The curious case of Sam Bradford

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    You mean, apart from the fact that he's on pace to top his career best numbers in yards, TDs and passer rating.

    Guys... this is the big boy table... if you're going to take a position, try to back it up with more than indignation.
    So he has a career year compared to what. Being in the bottom rung of quarterback mediocrity?? Anything he does would probably be a carrier year for him since he really hasn't accomplished anything yet.

    Not saying he cant, but this is the year he has to prove it, and so far it aint happening. Again, he does not need to do much to be better than he has, and I will give you an improvement, but he really needs to step it up. lets see him lead, and throw the ball down the field. Lets see the quarterback we thought we were getting. I want him to succeed as much as anyone, but I just don't think it will happen. I sincerely hope I'm wrong.

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