View Poll Results: Which DC would you rather have?

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  • Jim Haslett

    20 55.56%
  • Gregg Williams

    16 44.44%
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  1. #1
    RamsSB99's Avatar
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    Which DC would you rather have?

    Which DC would you rather have?
    Gregg Williams or Jim Haslett

    I think Haslett has done okay. However I really like Gregg Williams and on the drive home today I heard how he really has his players prepared. They where talking about how everyone knows who the referees are and what their tendencies are and what you might get by with. They talked about him altering his play calling based on weather conditions. They also talked about how he is very competitive and if Jacksonville or some other team don't offer him their DC position that he would probably accept a secondary coach position with a team. They said he is just itching to continue coaching and keep his competitive fire going.

    I know there are a few that will say fire Linehan, and give the HC position to one of the other two but I would rather keep this thread between Williams and Haslett and who would be the better choice for DC.
    Last edited by RamsSB99; -01-28-2008 at 08:52 PM.


  2. #2
    Keenum's Avatar
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Good question.
    At least for next year, I want to stick with Haslett. Our defense was really playing well in the first half of the season, but our offense was crap and made our D tire out in the 2nd half.
    Hopefully if the offense can get back to normal, the D will be on the field for a reasonable amount of time and be able play well all game. I also like the potential of our development. We got some young guys that have played well when called upon (Chillar, Hill, Atogwe, Bartell, Carriker, Ryan,), and I think Haslett will be able to develop those guys.
    Hopefully.

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    Thumbs down Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Quote Originally Posted by Keenum View Post
    Good question.
    At least for next year, I want to stick with Haslett. Our defense was really playing well in the first half of the season, but our offense was crap and made our D tire out in the 2nd half.
    Hopefully if the offense can get back to normal, the D will be on the field for a reasonable amount of time and be able play well all game. I also like the potential of our development. We got some young guys that have played well when called upon (Chillar, Hill, Atogwe, Bartell, Carriker, Ryan), and I think Haslett will be able to develop those guys.
    Hopefully.
    E-x-a-c-t-l-y! :r

  4. #4
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    I went with Williams. I looked at this as an in general question. If the question were worded "Who would I rather have for 2008?" I may go with Haslett just not to rock the boat. Haslett is not a bad coordinator (though his head coaching abilities are questionable) but I think Greg Williams is over all better.

  5. #5
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    I don't think Williams would want to come here. Rams don't spend on defense. Redskins spent 20% more than the Rams did on defense based on usa today salary cap stats. Rams are offensive minded. That is where they spend the money. Williams would get frustrated here.

  6. #6
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Williams is my choice.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  7. #7
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Although I'm not a huge Williams guy- I think at least his defense has a philosophy. Much like Linehan's offense- Haslett's defense has no identity. I'm not sure if they're an aggressive or not. Sometimes he sends the blitz, but a lot of the time he'll only send 3. And for some reason, no matter which- our cornerbacks still seemed to be locked up one on one. I just don't get it. Two years with this guy- we finished almost dead last in the league and the second season we're in the bottom 3rd. I really don't see why everyone thinks he has this defense going in the right direction. At this rate, we'll be in top ten in 3 years!!!

  8. #8
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Quote Originally Posted by moloch41 View Post
    Although I'm not a huge Williams guy- I think at least his defense has a philosophy. Much like Linehan's offense- Haslett's defense has no identity. I'm not sure if they're an aggressive or not. Sometimes he sends the blitz, but a lot of the time he'll only send 3. And for some reason, no matter which- our cornerbacks still seemed to be locked up one on one. I just don't get it. Two years with this guy- we finished almost dead last in the league and the second season we're in the bottom 3rd. I really don't see why everyone thinks he has this defense going in the right direction. At this rate, we'll be in top ten in 3 years!!!
    While I get your point there has been some changes in a couple things for this defense that shows improvement. This defense was on the field a lot in the second half of almost every game this year because of the offense stinking up the joint. I think the defense did improve because we allowed like 2 rushers all year to go over 100yds and that was the last two games of the year. We allowed 10 rb's to go for over 100 yds last year. I would say that is an improvement. in 06 we were allowing 112 yds rushing per game this year with a terrible offense we allowed 95 yds per game, that is 17 yds better than last year. I think we improved and teams were blowing us out in a lot of games in the second half and still couldnt run great on us. So I think the defense did improve considering the bad situations they were put in by our offense. Also at one point werent the Rams defense leading the league in most 3 and outs forced. Don't know where they finished in that stat but that is impressive as well. When your offense puts your defense on the field over and over and over it tends to wear the defense down and that is what happened this year. I do agree there is plenty of room for improvement, although I do see some things that have gotten better.
    Just Fix It

  9. #9
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser View Post
    While I get your point there has been some changes in a couple things for this defense that shows improvement. This defense was on the field a lot in the second half of almost every game this year because of the offense stinking up the joint. I think the defense did improve because we allowed like 2 rushers all year to go over 100yds and that was the last two games of the year. We allowed 10 rb's to go for over 100 yds last year. I would say that is an improvement. in 06 we were allowing 112 yds rushing per game this year with a terrible offense we allowed 95 yds per game, that is 17 yds better than last year. I think we improved and teams were blowing us out in a lot of games in the second half and still couldnt run great on us. So I think the defense did improve considering the bad situations they were put in by our offense. Also at one point werent the Rams defense leading the league in most 3 and outs forced. Don't know where they finished in that stat but that is impressive as well. When your offense puts your defense on the field over and over and over it tends to wear the defense down and that is what happened this year. I do agree there is plenty of room for improvement, although I do see some things that have gotten better.
    I think there have been a few improvements, but not enough in 2 full seasons to warrant keeping him- certainly not enough to give him the HC job if Linefool gets fired. You also have to remember that there were certain games where the offense had big leads and the defense almost blew it. Haslett gets too conservative in the second halves of games. I mean, my god, Chris Redman almost lead the Falcons back against us in the second half. I know everyone wants to blame the offense for everything because they were awful, but Haslett has as much to do with the defense sinking as the offense does. We knew we couldn't get any pressure with 4 down lineman and our corners couldn't cover for long, but there were periods were Haslett refused to blitz and would even only send 3 and give subpar QBs all the time in the world to get comfortable and find open receivers. I think this is as good as the defense is really going to get under him and it's time to move on. Another thing to remember is that the defenses decent numbers came mainly against bad offensive teams. Any good teams we played absolutely tore us a new one.

  10. #10
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Haslett, based on the thesis that three times is indeed a charm. Look at what's happened as we've put the pieces together, here.

    Year one: Notable Acquistions of Hill, Glover, Chavous, Brown, Witherspoon.

    Woeful against the run, largely due to the FO's big mistake of letting Big Grease Ryan Pickett shimmy on to Green Bay. Solid against the pass, Chavous provides solid leadership though lags in coverage, Brown is solid, Hill develops, Atogwe continues to progress, even with average pass rush. Primary needs going into the offseason are all along the DL.

    Year Two: Notable additions Carriker, Hall, Wade, Ryan.

    Good year, just one 100 yard rusher, coming in the form of Najeh Davenport, who has a thing for us. Fell to pieces at the end of the year, wear and tear taking its toll. Defense was much better than the statistics showed; largely due to the offense being super-inconsistent due to injuries along the OL. Thus, we could not keep the ball for prolonged periods, and the defense saw the field much more than we'd have liked. Atogwe develops into the best FS we've had since Aneas Williams, second in the league with 8 ints. Hill is solid before injury, Witherspoon leads the team in tackles, sacks, and plays End on passing downs. Brown plays well, Bartell is solid in the nickel role, Wade is a true rookie. Absolutely zero pass rush leads to opposing teams having their way. Little is average, if that. Hall is average, if that. Inside, Carriker and Ryan bring it in a big way, emerging as the likely interior duo for at least the 2008 season (draft pending). Tinoismaoa constantly injured. Chillar plays like the SLB we thought he couldn't be.

    Year 3: We need a pass rush, first and foremost. Many fans hope this comes in the form of Chris Long at pick 2, or Vernon Gholston in the same slot or (preferably) via a slight trade down. Then? We need the offense to hold the ball.

    Williams did not do well in Buffalo as a head coach, and though his defense in Washington was very good this season, he'd command a large salary. I'd prefer to keep Haslett.

  11. #11
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Williams. Hands down. No question.

  12. #12
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Three top 10 defenses in 4 years for a team that hadn't had 3 top 10 defenses in the previous 11 years.

    In his first Head Coaching gig, his defense stumbles in its first year (21st), but shows significant improvement in the next year (15th) and third year (2nd).

    Similar story in his first DC gig. Defense stumbles out of the gate (22nd), followed by two improved years (17th, 16th), and in his fourth year his best effort yet (1st).

    And lest we forget........smart enough to sign London Fletcher from his previous team not once, but twice!

    Gotta be Gregg Williams, if you ask me.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  13. #13
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    These are Haslett's stats in 2 yrs as defensive coordinator. I'm just not blown away. We actually fell way back in pass defense. The only category to show significant improvement was Rushing Defense, but that probably had something to do with the fact that teams were successful passing on us. In 2006, teams averaged 29.8 rpg (rushes per game) and in 2007, they averaged 27.8 rpg. If you add the 2 more rushing attempts per game, they averaged 4.4 per rush as opposed to the 4.8 in 2006- not exactly a tremendous turnaround. In 2006, teams averaged 29.8 ppg (passes per game) and in 2007, they averaged 27.8 ppg. I know most of these stats won't matter because people will blame the offense, but you can't blame them for everything that went wrong with this team. There was fault across the board.


    Overall Defense:

    2006: 23rd (335.1 ypg)

    2007: 21st (341.1 ypg)

    Passing Defense:

    2006: 8th (189.7 ypg)

    2007: 21st (225.8 ypg)


    Rushing Defense:

    2006: 31st (145.4 ypg)

    2007: 20th (115.2 ypg)

    Rushing Yards Per Att

    2006: 4.9

    2007: 4.1

    Sacks:

    2006: 19th (34)

    2007: 21st (31)

    Ints:

    2006: 13th (17)

    2007: 10th (18)

    3rd Down %

    2006: 45% (93 out of 205)

    2007: 39% (78 out of 201)

    4th Down %

    2006: 33% (2 out of 6)

    2007: 60% (6 out of 10)

  14. #14
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    Quote Originally Posted by RamsSB99 View Post
    Which DC would you rather have?
    Gregg Williams or Jim Haslett

    I think Haslett has done okay. However I really like Gregg Williams and on the drive home today I heard how he really has his players prepared. They where talking about how everyone knows who the referees are and what their tendencies are and what you might get by with. They talked about him altering his play calling based on weather conditions. They also talked about how he is very competitive and if Jacksonville or some other team don't offer him their DC position that he would probably accept a secondary coach position with a team. They said he is just itching to continue coaching and keep his competitive fire going.

    Haslett probably goes through the same exercises with our defense. I still love Haslett's firey attitude.

    I say keep Haslett for at least 1 more season.

  15. #15
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    Re: Which DC would you rather have?

    I would have to cut Haz some slack for his first year with us with the likes of J. Kennedy etc. Last year we showed marked improvement in run defense overall. We weren't able to generate much of a rush with our D linemen, but I don't believe that's entirely Jim's lack of coaching expertise. Two rookie DTs, and one aging formerly good DT, the monumental contributions of Claude Rotten, a banged up Little, Trevor Who? and Victor (I may not be fast, but I try hard!!) Adeyanju. Where I do hold JH accountable is in the second half of games when we appeared to resort to a type of prevent defense which appeared to prevent us from stopping the opposing team.

    I would prefer to give Jim another year and see what he can do with (hopefully) another defensive FA addition coupled with one or two rookies from the upcoming draft. I don't purport to know which guy is better between Williams and Haz, as player talent is inextricably woven in to whatever stats exist for both guys. If in 2009 the Rams FO (whoever that might be) decides to blow up everything, then that would be the time to try another DC. I am not in favor of trying to implement another defensive scheme with a new DC this year. That said, I would love it if Williams were to accept the position the Rams have apparently offered him. I don't see it as an insult to Williams, as it's not the Rams fault that he was fired in Washington. The Rams have a defensive coaching position open and if he wants to keep his hand in, short of getting a DC job offer this year, he might well accept. If he improves the secondary, it certainly won't reflect poorly on his resume ...

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