Goodell says "Nothing New" in Spygate

[r8rh8rmike]

Originally Posted by Pape

Looking at the case what do we know?.

We know Goodell for some reason destroyed all the original evidence and has consistently made definitive statements about the case before actually reviewing material. We also know he's the NFL Commissioner investigating the NFL team in question.

[Ferter]

Man the pats and their cohorts the NFL have this cheatin down to a science.

The pats were able to win 3 SB's by 3 points each time. Amazing!

And the fact that they had the Rams defensive signals in SB 36, boy oh boy did that ever pay dividends for the pats offense.

It's no wonder the pats were able to amass 13 points and 267 total yards of offense.

Gee, it should make perfect sense to anyone knowing the pats had the Rams D' signals. How else could the pats get that kind of offensive production?

Now SB 37 that was one hell of a game! No farce on that, no sir. You remember bucs-48 - raiders-21. Grudengate?

Rest assured there is no person on God's green earth that despises the pats any more than I do. But reading the never ending whining, from fellow Rams fans, year after year, has become downright embarrassing at times.

We lost, plain and simple, the Rams beat their own sorry asses that day. Coaches, players the whole entire sorry ass lot of them. The players screwed themselves up and down the field all game long. Sure the officials worked in the pats favor at times, but the bottom line is the mistakes the Rams made were enough to lose the fricken game.

There are no ethics in pro football when it comes to trying to gain an advantage. Teams have been stealing signals for years. ALL TEAMS. Pro, college, high school. Hell they even do it in baseball for pete's sake.

Quit crying Rams fans! The pats simply got caught at something all teams have tried at one time or another. For the love of pete - just let it go.

[r8rh8rmike]

Originally Posted by Ferter

Quit crying Rams fans! The pats simply got caught at something all teams have tried at one time or another. For the love of pete - just let it go.

For me Ferter, it's just not the loss in SB 36, it's the suspect way the NFL seems to be handling the whole Spygate thing and most of all, laying as much pain and suffering on the Patriots as possible and removing the maximun amount of legitimacy from their "dynasty".

[ramsbruce]

Originally Posted by Milan

...So, is what he did illegal? I agree, it's pretty low but is it illegal?

Originally Posted by Rambos

It's not a crime and no one says it is.

I'm pretty sure Milan isn't suggesting it's a crime.

Illegal shift, illegal formation etc. Neither of which are a crime, but both are a penalty in the NFL.

[shower beers]

From ESPN.com
----------------------------------------------
WASHINGTON -- Hold on, NFL. Spygate isn't over. Not if the "incensed" Philadelphia Eagles fan in Congress has anything to do with it.
Sen. Arlen Specter on Wednesday called for an independent investigation of the New England Patriots' taping of opposing coaches' signals, possibly similar to the high-profile Mitchell report on performance-enhancing drugs in baseball.
"I have documented the strong factual case that a NFL investigation was neither objective nor adequate," Specter told ESPN.com on Wednesday evening. "If the commissioner doesn't move for an independent investigation, then there will be a permanent black mark on the NFL and the Patriots' record will be historically tainted. Depending on the public reaction, I may ask the Senate Judiciary Committee to hold hearings on the NFL antitrust exemption."
At an earlier news conference in the Capitol, Specter put it bluntly: "What is necessary is an objective investigation. And this one has not been objective."
The Pennsylvania Republican was unforgiving of his criticism of NFL commissioner Roger Goodell, saying that Goodell has made "ridiculous" assertions that wouldn't fly "in kindergarten." The Senator said Goodell was caught in an "apparent conflict of interest" because the NFL doesn't want the public to lose confidence in the league's integrity.
"They are enormous role models for everybody," Specter said. "If you can cheat in the NFL, you can cheat in college, you can cheat in high school, you can cheat on your grade-school math test. There's no limit as to what you can do. I think they owe the public a lot more candor and a lot more credibility."




Goodell essentially declared an end to Spygate after a 3½-hour meeting in New York on Tuesday morning with former New England video assistant Matt Walsh. Walsh supplied the league with videotapes of coaches' signals made by the Patriots but offered no new significant revelations about the cheating scandal that has threatened to taint the team's three Super Bowl titles.
Goodell said afterward that the information from the interview with Walsh "was consistent with what we disciplined the Patriots for last fall," when the commissioner docked the team a 2008 first-round draft pick and fined coach Bill Belichick $500,000 and the team $250,000.
But Specter held his own three-hour meeting with Walsh in Washington on Tuesday. He said Walsh detailed how the Patriots used videotaped signals to their advantage: An offensive player would memorize the signals, watch for them on the sideline and pass them on to assistant coach Charlie Weis, who would then inform quarterback Tom Brady.
"And they had some obviously good results," Specter said.
Specter said he would prefer the NFL arrange the independent investigation and was willing to wait several months -- while he continues to undergo chemotherapy treatments for Hodgkin's disease -- before calling for Congress to take what he called "corrective action." Such action could include hearings or a full-blown Mitchell report-type investigation. He said public reaction would determine the NFL's next step.
"I would hope that the commissioner would do this on his own," Specter said.
The NFL issued a response through spokesman Gregg Aiello.
"We respectfully disagree with Senator Specter's characterization of the investigation conducted by our office. We are following up after yesterday's meeting with Matt Walsh," he said.
Patriots spokesman Stacey James said the team had no comment on Specter's remarks.


Earlier Wednesday, the Boston Herald apologized for a story that said the Patriots videotaped a St. Louis Rams walkthrough before the 2002 Super Bowl.
In the apology, published in the newspaper's Wednesday edition and posted on its Web site, the Herald said the story was based on sources "it believed to be credible."
"We now know that this report was false and that no tape of the walk-through ever existed," the paper wrote.
"We should not have published the allegation in the absence of firmer verification. The Boston Herald regrets the damage done to the team by publication of the allegation and sincerely apologizes to its readers and to the New England Patriots' owners, players, employees and fans for our error," it said.
Specter repeated his disapproval of Goodell's decision to destroy the notes and tapes confiscated during the initial investigation last fall, as well as the "piecemeal" way the league has revealed details about the tapings. He also cited the fact a Patriots attorney sat in on Walsh's meeting with Goodell as proof the investigation has not been impartial.
"That sequence is incomprehensible," Specter said. "It's an insult to the intelligence of the people who follow it."
Specter's interest in Spygate centers in part on the two NFL teams in his state. The Eagles lost to the Patriots in the Super Bowl in 2005, the same season in which the Pittsburgh Steelers were defeated by New England in the AFC Championship Game.
Pittsburgh defeated New England earlier that season, and the implication is that taped signals from that game helped the Patriots in the rematch. Steelers chairman Dan Rooney has called the matter a "non-issue."
"I have a different perspective," Specter said. "I'm elected by 12 million people, and a lot of them are Steeler fans. ... Frankly I'm incensed about what happened with the Steelers, and I'm incensed about the notes being destroyed. I really am."
Specter was again asked whether his interest in the matter has to do with Philadelphia-based Comcast, one of his largest campaign contributors. Comcast has been involved in a dispute with the league over the placement of the NFL Network on its cable system.
"They have been a campaign contributor," Specter said, "along with 50,000 other people ... I've been at this line of work for a long time, and no one has ever questioned my integrity."
In an interview with HBO scheduled to air Friday night on "Real Sports With Bryant Gumbel," Walsh dismissed Belichick's attempts to minimize the impact of the taping.
"If it was of little or no importance, I imagine they wouldn't have continued to do it, and probably not taken the chances of going down onto the field in Pittsburgh or shooting from other teams' stadiums the way we did," Walsh said.
Walsh told HBO that his superiors coached him on how to evade NFL rules limiting the number of camera operators per team to two, and that team officials instructed him on ways to avoid detection.
Walsh also talked about Belichick's claim that he misinterpreted NFL rules.
"When I was doing it, I understood what we were doing to be wrong," Walsh said. "We went to great lengths to keep from being caught. Just saying that the rules were misinterpreted isn't enough of an apology or a reasoning for what was done. ...
"Coach Belichick's explanation for having misinterpreted the rules, to me, that really didn't sound like taking responsibility for what we had done, especially considering the great lengths that we had gone through to hide what we were doing."
------------------------------------

A bit lengthy, but an interesting article nonetheless. Raises a lot of questions. Thoughts?

[moloch41]

Originally Posted by txramsfan

All i know is....the game was tied late in the fourth quarter and our defensive was rested.

Why Lovie went didn't send the kitchen sink on every play is beyond me.

Ummmm, I'm going to go with- he was the most unaggressive, unimaginative, boring coach we ever had and he will be fired by the Bears in a couple of years. If he couldn't run the Base Cover 2 every play, he was lost.

[RamOfDenmark]

Originally Posted by Ferter

There are no ethics in pro football when it comes to trying to gain an advantage. Teams have been stealing signals for years. ALL TEAMS. Pro, college, high school. Hell they even do it in baseball for pete's sake.

Maybe that's true. But if it is then the league needs to get rid of those rules. Either that or they need to enforce them. One of two options, and if they choose to enforce them then they need to investigate this fully instead of trying to cover it up.

Whining or no whining the commisioner has not looked very interested in the truth in this case right from the start. I'm just tired of the bull**** from the commisioner where he tries to look real tough on crime while he's busy trying to sweep everything under the rug to save face.

[UtterBlitz]

Sen. Arlen Specter is not letting this issue drop. I am glad that he is not Ram related and this is being driven by the Eagles and the Steelers interests.

Goodell is doing his best to ignore any issues of cheating and favoritism since it will be bad for the NFL's reputation, but Specter will not let him. The NFL is big business with lots of revenue and taxes, but it still surprises me to see this issue brought up to Congress. It isn't over yet.

[laram0]

We lost Superbowl XXXVI. Why? IMHO it was the extremely poor officiating. Do I care if the Pats cheated? Yes I do. Continue the investigation? Absolutely. What I'm saying is that even if the Pats cheated combined with the extremely poor officiating we still only lost by a last second FG. A Patriots drive that should have been stalled with intentional grounding by Tommy "the wonder boy" Brady. Which of course wasn't called.

We were the better team just don't have the Trophy to show off. Any real NFL fan or (Patriots fan) knows the RAMS got a raw deal in that game. Those that can't admit that need to go back and watch the game a few more times.

In my heart of hearts I know we were the better team. I also know we were treated unfairly for the whole game by the officials.

[moloch41]

Originally Posted by UtterBlitz

Sen. Arlen Specter is not letting this issue drop. I am glad that he is not Ram related and this is being driven by the Eagles and the Steelers interests.

Spector is driven by one thing- Comcast, who he has strong ties to and who, by chance, is also a company locked in a bitter dispute with the NFL over the NFL network. Now, with that being said, I agree an independent investigation needs to be done- if not to reveal something new- at least to put to rest the suspicion. The NFL has handled this whole situation badly from the beginning. By destroying evidence, declaring that evidence is "Nothing New" before ever seeing it, and by given a BS punishment (The Patsites should have lost their highest first round pick and not their original one.) Even if nothing inappropriate has been done in the handling of this incident, they certainly have given off vibes that it has.

P.S.

If the Pats weren't looking at the tapes during the games, why were they taping them? The Steelers game was a non-divisional opponent in an AFC championship game- what would looking at the tapes AFTER the game was over do for them exactly?

[Rambos]

NFL: Walsh talks about Spygate in HBO interview

Associated Press

NEW YORK -- Former New England video assistant Matt Walsh dismissed Patriots coach Bill Belichick's attempts to minimize the impact of the team's illegal taping of opponents' coaching signals.

" ... it was something that they continued to have me do throughout the two years I worked in video, under coach Belichick," Walsh told HBO's Andrea Kremer in an interview scheduled to air Friday night on "Real Sports With Bryant Gumbel."

"If it was of little or no importance, I imagine they wouldn't have continued to do it, and probably not taken the chances of going down onto the field in Pittsburgh or shooting from other teams' stadiums the way we did."

The Spygate investigation began after the NFL confiscated tapes from a team employee who recorded the New York Jets' defensive signals during the 2007 opener. Belichick was fined $500,000, while the team was fined $250,000 and forced to forfeit its 2008 first-round draft choice.

NFL commissioner Roger Goodell essentially declared an end to the case after a 31/2-hour meeting Tuesday with Walsh, who supplied the league with tapes of coaches' signals made by the Patriots. After meeting with Walsh later Tuesday, Sen. Arlen Specter called Wednesday for an independent investigation. The senior Republican on the Senate Judiciary Committee, Specter criticized Goodell, saying he has made "ridiculous" assertions that wouldn't fly "in kindergarten."

Walsh told HBO that his superiors coached him on how to evade NFL rules limiting the number of camera operators per team to two, and that team officials instructed him on ways to avoid detection.

"The line of reasoning that we would give to other teams for why we need a third camera setup was, 'Well, our coaches want to have a tight shot of the kicker and the holder ... exchange just to go over with the guys in meetings. You know, they want a tight shot, you know, of the quarterback, you know, just to go over the quarterback's footwork and mechanics in meetings,"' said Walsh, who mentioned Patriots video coordinator Jimmy Dee as one of the superiors who coached him.

"If I was in the end zone, we would say, 'Well, we just want to have two end zone shots of the game because our coaches like always seeing the view of our players' backs."'

Kremer asked Walsh about Belichick's comments about his lack of familiarity with Walsh and his actions, referencing a comment that "I couldn't pick Matt Walsh out of a lineup?"

"Um, it's funny. The first time I heard that was when somebody in Hawaii brought the quote to me, too. And my first hand answer to them was, 'Well, I wonder if he can pick me out on one of the three team pictures we're in together.'

"I don't know, if I was just that forgettable and he can't remember me, or if he was just trying to distance himself from this whole situation as best as he could. ... I think Bill's got a pretty good memory."

Kremer also asked about Belichick's claim that he misinterpreted NFL rules.

"When I was doing it, I understood what we were doing to be wrong," Walsh said. "We went to great lengths to keep from being caught. Just saying that the rules were misinterpreted isn't enough of an apology or a reasoning for what was done. ... Coach Belichick's explanation for having misinterpreted the rules, to me, that really didn't sound like taking responsibility for what we had done, especially considering the great lengths that we had gone through to hide what we were doing."

Walsh is going to keep talking now, so we will if Roger Goodell has disclosed all the he was told by Walsh. 3 hours, a lot had to be said.

[Rambos]

How the Pats used the video tapes signs...

Walsh recalls speaking to a reserve quarterback, who told him about being called into Belichick's office before the 2000 season opener against Tampa Bay. Also present in the room were then-offensive coordinator Charlie Weis and football research director Ernie Adams.

The Patriots explained to a backup quarterback how they intended to relay the Bucs defensive signals to starting quarterback Drew Bledsoe. Michael Bishop and John Friesz were the reserve quarterbacks. Tom Brady, a rookie, was not activated for the game.

According to Walsh, the plan was for the backup quarterback to learn the hand signals by Bucs defensive coordinator Monte Kiffin that the Patriots presumably had filmed when the teams played in the exhibition season. The quarterback would see what play was called and tell Weis, who would then relay it to Bledsoe through the headset in his helmet.

"The quarterback, you know, later told me that within two to three seconds when Monte Kiffin sent a play call into [Tampa Bay safety] John Lynch, Drew Bledsoe had it in his helmet," Walsh said.

The Patriots lost the game, 21-16. But Walsh said the Patriots quarterback told him that the spying yielded remarkable success.

By the way not new info? Comish?

[txramsfan]

I'm still more upset over the non-call against Warner when he took a blow to the head and threw the INT to Law than I am about any allegations of spygate against the Pats.

That was the worst non-call in Super Bowl history.