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  1. #31
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Good artical;
    It kind of fits what I suspected about bad karma in the locker room.
    Sometimes you have to swallow your pride and admit that things aren't going as you planed.

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  2. #32
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Quote Originally Posted by atcchris
    Sorry, I put it in the wrong year. That should have been with 2001.
    Gotcha. You'd be correct then - the Rams did indeed have the best record that season, although two teams were within one game at 13-3.
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  3. #33
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    It kind of fits what I suspected about bad karma in the locker room.
    That's funny. I thought the cause of said bad karma in the locker room was jettisoned before this season started.
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  4. #34
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Quote Originally Posted by Yodude
    That's funny. I thought the cause of said bad karma in the locker room was jettisoned before this season started.
    Not to dig up ghosts of Christmas past, but Yo is right. That was what the media was pushing last year.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  5. #35
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    I have been wondering how the team is feeling about playing as a team. So many of the players have come out flat and unmotivated that I have feared that the team chemistry has been off. Perhaps it is ok for Bruce to lose the ball, but not for McDonald. Perhaps there is a line being drawn between "chosen" players and the rest of them.

    I know players like Pisa and Arch will always play and will overcome pain and injuries to put in their best effort. Those kind of players play for personal pride and don't need outside motivation, but they do need to be pulled from the game when they aren't able to contribute or if they are injuring themselves unnecessarily.

    Most players would need support from the coaching staff and team chemistry to raise their level of play. It seems that we are losing the players at this point.

    So many problems on the team. It is discouraging. So many articles seem to point to Martz losing control of the big picture, and getting caught in the weeds. Is he capable of separating himself from the details and coaching on a high level?
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  6. #36
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Martz must improve his ability to convince the masses he has their back. When players that have strong individual personalities that differ from his mindset, are alienated, problems fester to the point of explosion. Three sources at Rams Park relayed information relating to a meeting that took place between Martz and Kyle Turley last week that in fact exploded with **** bombs, loud exchanges and later a phone call to NFL security by Martz claiming that Turley had threatened him.
    this is not sounding good........

    Martz is from the old school; the mindset is if you're able to walk, you're able to play. Turley is a modern-day athlete. Turley is tough as nails, but he is a thinking man and hence won't be drawn into the ways of days past. Simply watch the game tape, Turley will battle with the best, he will drain the tank but in doing so also realizes that, there is life after football.
    There is life after football and in this modern day of football, these guys are paid so much that they don't need to continue to play as the old timers did when salaries were so much lower. It's a new breed of players now that the dollars flow so freely. Get your millions and get out before your body is ruined. It makes sense to me. I don't think we will see Turley play again.
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  7. #37
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    This kind of stuff happens to everyone, and I would place a very hefty bet that half of the teams in the league have some kind of problem with this issue of some players having more wiggle room than others.
    Reminds me of the apologist whiner fans when they were caught paying players under the table. Their universal belching was “Everybody does it”. Yes every team uses the loopholes available, (Loopholes that the whiners creative accounting system uncovered) such as back loading contracts; however trying to parallel fraud in the form of unreported salaries with "loopholes" is an attack on a person’s intelligence. Their bile is evident in glossing over the real issues.

    So here is what we are left with regarding the Rams:

    The discipline light has clicked on even within the Martz apologist’s cult. So I am going to go out on a limb here and say:
    “Except for the few who cannot put their hand in boiling water and admit that it is hot, the overwhelming majority of Rams fans believe that discipline or lack their of is a significant part to the problems that face the rams nay the absolute root of evil on the team”

    Even though Hadley spends most of his article with lips attached to Turley’s and Martz’s behinds we are suppose to believe the “Mean Old Reporter” rhetoric?


    Forget that it goes a long way in explaining lack of discipline in allowing a simple cut back run to fool the defense not once, not twice not 10 times nay 1 season, or 2 seasons, Hell do we know when or if ever our defense will be discipline enough to stop overrunning the ball? Forget that it takes discipline on special teams to not over-run the ball and get burned. Forget that a quarterback is throwing the ball on running plays. Forget the way turnovers have been treated like spilled milk. Free your memory of that 2000 defense which reeked of non-discipline play. Forget that Martz only a few weeks ago was referring to "A group of players that think they are in college on a scholarship." Ignore all these things that suggest that Hadley is on to something here because Hadley is just a big fat liar trying to put himself in the spotlight. He’s nothing but a yellow journalist that is setting Martz up to look bad. Shame on him for attacking so low?

    And the spin? “Everybody does it.” Yes, since there are preferred players on every team we can just toss this theory out the window and toss yet another blanket over logic. We can just bop along completely oblivious to the fact that there is a chance what is happening at rams park regarding preferred players may be of significant and alarming proportions. Let's take a factitious team that has fumbled 38 times over the course of 10 games while the rest of the league has coughed it up between 1 and 10 times over that same time frame. Since all teams fumble let's ignore those 38 fumbles and look elsewhere for answers.

    If and when the point I am making here ever sinks in, out will come the “It’s not Martz’s fault there is lack of discipline” choir. Wow, can you really be serious?

    You know when it’s all said and done I’ll et you a dollar to a donut that even us “Conspiracy theorists, Alarmists, Coach bashing, separatist, Warner loving, pessimistic worry warts have under estimated the internal damage that has been taking place for 5 years. Sadly the chance of this being true is far greater then the chance that this team will be turned around under this regime.

  8. #38
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Quote Originally Posted by RamTime
    You know when it’s all said and done I’ll et you a dollar to a donut that even us “Conspiracy theorists, Alarmists, Coach bashing, separatist, Warner loving, pessimistic worry warts have under estimated the internal damage that has been taking place for 5 years. Sadly the chance of this being true is far greater then the chance that this team will be turned around under this regime.
    RamTime, you are not putting my fears to rest. If this is true, the internal damage is all encompassing and this team may just crumble. These last two games are tough ones and I am not sure the players have the discipline or motivation to come out and play.

    Quote Originally Posted by RamTime
    The discipline light has clicked on even within the Martz apologist’s cult. So I am going to go out on a limb here and say:
    “Except for the few who cannot put their hand in boiling water and admit that it is hot, the overwhelming majority of Rams fans believe that discipline or lack their of is a significant part to the problems that face the rams nay the absolute root of evil on the team”

    Forget that it goes a long way in explaining lack of discipline in allowing a simple cut back run to fool the defense not once, not twice not 10 times nay 1 season, or 2 seasons, Hell do we know when or if ever our defense will be discipline enough to stop overrunning the ball? Forget that it takes discipline on special teams to not over-run the ball and get burned. Forget that a quarterback is throwing the ball on running plays. Forget the way turnovers have been treated like spilled milk. Free your memory of that 2000 defense which reeked of non-discipline play. Forget that Martz only a few weeks ago was referring to "A group of players that think they are in college on a scholarship." Ignore all these things that suggest that Hadley is on to something here because Hadley is just a big fat liar trying to put himself in the spotlight. He’s nothing but a yellow journalist that is setting Martz up to look bad. Shame on him for attacking so low?

    If and when the point I am making here ever sinks in, out will come the “It’s not Martz’s fault there is lack of discipline” choir. Wow, can you really be serious?
    Martz is the Head Coach and most of the criticism must lie on his plate. I have tried to support Martz this year in hope that he would learn from his mistakes and turn into a good head coach, but he seems to take one step forward and two steps backwards all the time. I am very discouraged by the state of the team this year. There is a lack of discipline as shown by the large amount of penalties and blown plays. There are no repercussions to poor play by some of the players. The team is coming out flat and unmotivated, a sure sign that things are not right.

    Nice post RamTime.... nice and depressing. :confused:
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  9. #39
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    oh,if only........................we all could know the truth here!


    If Martz doesnt make the personnel decisions,(which i truely do believe he does) then i would be the first to admit i was wrong about this guy!

    Shaw has been a pain in the ass before for this team. I hoped that he has changed his ways!

    Georgia........this is still YOUR TEAM..................its time for you to take action and get this team back on top!.................Clean house if need be!!!.....................Shaw included on this change if need be! :ramlogo:

  10. #40
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Quote Originally Posted by Hadley

    There is no question that Martz has played a large role in some very questionable offensive (offensive players and terribly offensive blunders) draft selections ...

    Yes, Martz's voice is loud and clear at Rams Park however, those that say he has complete control are completely mistaken.

    The problems at Rams Park run deep. The friction is greater than ever. Martz and Jay Zygmunt are at odds; Charley Armey is being locked out of personnel moves.

    In part two, I'll explain in detail these issues, along with how Armey has been ostracized, why Dick Jauron is the reason for the friction between Martz and Zygmunt and why John Shaw is telling everybody what they want to hear without stepping up to demand unity.
    If Hadley can flesh out the truth in the inner workings of Rams' Park, then this article will be worth more than the "paper" it was printed on. Nothing Hadley says absolves sMartz of his role in the current state of Rams football.

    But exposing the dysfunction in the Rams' FO (including Georgia, mind you) is only fair in evaluating the prospect of the Rams sustaining a competitive stance year in, year out. The Rams have been trounced far too often this year. And as much as I fault sMartz for much of it, I am also inclined to believe that the FO is also much to blame.

    If Hadley can help us understand who has the final say in draft, FA, and player retention issues, we can argue less on speculation and more on fact. I am curious how Part 2 deals with the "inner workings."

  11. #41
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    It's really fairly simple to me. Every locker room has issues. Has to. You put all these different personalities in one room and try to have a cohesive unit is virtually impossible. It's the professionalism of the team that has to come out during the season that sweeps everything under the rug.

    To me, he hasn't had that bad of season this year considering all the injuries that happened. He still has one more year on his contract. Let him play it out. If he tanks next year, fire him. Even though I'm a Martz fan, I won't be on here in every post spouting out how Martz got jobbed if he is fired. I'll root hard for the new HC just as hard as I did for all the others.

    Some of us attach ourselves way too close to this team and players, be it former or current. They don't know you. They care if you root for them or not, but most could care less if you hate them or not. They have no qualms about it when they look at their bank accounts. We as fans should put things in perspective with our head, and leave our heart out of it. Because when it comes right down to it, the Rams are a BUSINESS much like GE, Ford Motor Company, or Bank of America.

    That's why the Peyton Manning commercial to me is the most poignant commercial out there. Could you just imagine a pro player grilling out and rooting on his investment bankers?

  12. #42
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    I laugh at that commercial every time I see it. Hilarious!
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  13. #43
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    To me, he hasn't had that bad of season this year considering all the injuries that happened. He still has one more year on his contract. Let him play it out. If he tanks next year, fire him. Even though I'm a Martz fan, I won't be on here in every post spouting out how Martz got jobbed if he is fired. I'll root hard for the new HC just as hard as I did for all the others.
    If the person whose supporters you're jabbing would have received the same consideration by Martz, et al, we might not be "spouting out how" he-who-shall-not-be-named "got jobbed".

  14. #44
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Some of us attach ourselves way too close to this team and players, be it former or current. They don't know you. They care if you root for them or not, but most could care less if you hate them or not. They have no qualms about it when they look at their bank accounts. We as fans should put things in perspective with our head, and leave our heart out of it. Because when it comes right down to it, the Rams are a BUSINESS much like GE, Ford Motor Company, or Bank of America.
    By the way.. if the CEO fires a particular CFO or someone who brought the biggest profits to the company ever, the stockholders have a right and responsibility to to hold the CEO accountable for that lack of vision.

    When we look at OUR "bank account" as Rams, what do we have after having the gold in there in 2000? Looks like our CEO squandered our savings.

  15. #45
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    Re: Hadley on Martz (long and pretty good)

    Much to popular disbelief atc, I don't have alterior motives about Warner. I'm not taking a jab at him. If you are, that's your style. That's fine. However, every time I post something, I swear to you and the big Ram in the sky, it isn't always a silent connotation on Kurt Warner. It really isn't.

    I know that may be somewhat hard for most of you to believe, but I promise you that everytime I post something I'm not always thinking of Kurt Warner. You really just proved my point atc, that some of us need to start thinking with our head rather than our heart. If it was that instrumental to you as a fan letting Warner go, then maybe those of you who still are spewing about it might want to rethink if it's really worth it to be a Rams fan. I think Martz is the best thing ever to happen to the St. Louis Rams, but believe me if the front office let's him go you won't see me post after post after post after post after post crying to the high Rams heaven about it. I'll just root for the next guy.
    Last edited by txramsfan; -12-27-2004 at 03:03 PM.

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