Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 18
  1. #1
    MauiRam's Avatar
    MauiRam is offline Pro Bowl Ram
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Maui, Hi.
    Age
    70
    Posts
    4,897
    Rep Power
    79

    Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    By Jim Thomas
    ST. LOUIS POST-DISPATCH
    02/22/2009

    INDIANAPOLIS According to league sources, the possibility of the Rams restructuring the contracts of either wide receiver Torry Holt or offensive tackle Orlando Pace now appear unlikely.

    And if that's the case, it's looking more and more as if Holt and Pace will not be with the Rams in 2009. Holt is in the final year of his contract and is scheduled to count $10.2 million against the salary cap. Pace has three years remaining on his deal and is scheduled to count $9 million against the cap in '09.

    Releasing or trading Holt would save the Rams $8 million in salary cap space. Doing the same with Pace would save the team $6 million. There appears to be some interest in Pace and Holt throughout the league, but whether that translates into a trade remains uncertain.

    The Rams and Kennard McGuire the agent for both players have had discussions at the NFL scouting combine, but no resolution has been reached. It's possible that a resolution with Holt or Pace may not be reached by the start of the free agency period Friday.
    But the Rams can't wait too long on Holt because he's due a $1.25 million roster bonus in mid-March.

    When asked about Holt and Pace on Friday, coach Steve Spagnuolo said the Rams will try to do what's best for the team. But there's also a sense that the Rams want to do what's best for Holt and Pace as well. Both players are seven-time Pro Bowlers who have done a lot for the Rams and have represented St. Louis well during their time with the team. At this point in their careers, they might want a chance to play for a team that's in a better position to compete for the playoffs and the Super Bowl.

    BARTELL UPDATE

    Negotiations continue between the Rams and Jeffrey Griffin, the agent who represents free-agent cornerback Ron Bartell. Although the sides aren't close to a contract agreement, they are making progress.

    All indications are that Bartell wants to remain with the team and is intrigued by the possibility of playing for Spagnuolo and in Spagnuolo's defensive system. Rams executive vice president of football operations Kevin Demoff was scheduled to meet again with Griffin on Saturday.

    THUMBS-UP ON SPAGS

    New York Giants coach Tom Coughlin says Spagnuolo will make a good head coach in St. Louis.

    "He's very smart," Coughlin said. "He's very good with people. He's very direct. He's very personable. He's an excellent football coach and communicator. He has great energy."

    Spagnuolo was defensive coordinator for Coughlin for two years before getting hired by the Rams last month.

    "He'll provide the kind of leadership that's necessary for his staff," Coughlin said. "He has an ability to have his finger on what is going well, what isn't, and he will take responsibility for that which isn't. So I think he'll be a head coach that will be very sincere. Players have enjoyed playing for Steve, and they like the system that he brings. So he'll be an outstanding coach for the Rams."
    Last edited by MauiRam; -02-22-2009 at 06:12 AM.


  2. #2
    majorram's Avatar
    majorram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2001
    Location
    London surrey
    Age
    42
    Posts
    1,421
    Rep Power
    20

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Not so worried about Holt leaving But Pace, to me we really need to keep this guy....somehow!!!

    steve
    "The breakfast Club"

  3. #3
    general counsel's Avatar
    general counsel is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    atlanta, georgia
    Age
    52
    Posts
    5,605
    Rep Power
    82

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    I agree with major. We really have no reason to keep holt at this point unless he takes a major pay cut and i dont blame him for not doing that. He deserves to leave and play for a winner at the end of his career.

    As for pace, given that the savings is only 6 million, i just dont see how we are going to replace his production for 6 million. We put ourselves in a position where a year from now at the most, we have in all liklihood to either pay big money for another free agent or use two pretty high picks on tackles with no assurance that it works out (or pay barron which seems unlikely).

    Pace is of course not as good as he was. Not close. But he is still an above average tackle and still dominates from time to time. Watch him bury joey porter of the dolphins on the tape if you dont believe me.

    In short, if holt is gone, tell me what we are going to do with the 6 million we save if we cut pace. Are we going to start barron and a rookie? I bet we wind up not spending some of the money or using it on life insurance for bulger. To me, its the same analysis as last year with bruce. The guy is still productive and i dont see a better way to spend the money since you need to replace the production. Age is a LOT less relevant for a tackle than a receiver.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel


  4. #4
    Mooselini's Avatar
    Mooselini is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2007
    Location
    Arizona
    Posts
    3,724
    Rep Power
    28

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    I would love to keep both of these guys. I grew up watching them. They will be some of my favorite all time Rams (since I started watching).

    However, we are rebuilding and this is a business...
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]
    Devaney, if you care about this team... fire the offensive coordinator!!!!

  5. #5
    39thebeast's Avatar
    39thebeast is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    conecticut
    Posts
    2,740
    Rep Power
    38

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    I don't think Holt has alot of trade value I think he will be cut flat out. I do think Pace has some value and I think he could go to a team like the Steelers, Jaguars, or possibly Ravens depending on how they feal about Gaither.

  6. #6
    Ramblin` Ram's Avatar
    Ramblin` Ram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Nation of Rams
    Age
    38
    Posts
    2,401
    Rep Power
    54

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    if the Titans offered us a 1st round pick in October for him,i dont see how 4 months later he is deemed to have no trade value atall now...a mid round pick off someone who requires a very good possesion wideout seems feasable to me.

    Pace ,tho re-structure would be the best possible outcome,even if we have to pay him 6mill i would still keep him..maybe last off-season he seemed to be done,but personally i was quite impressed with how well he held up last season after barely playing the previous two years.
    he has a couple of years left in him for sure and i think the time on the sidelines in the previous two seasons before the last one has somewhat re-ignited his passion in playing.

  7. #7
    dgr828's Avatar
    dgr828 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    THE GOLDEN STATE
    Posts
    1,917
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    I agree with 39thebeast, We might as well cut Torry flat out. Pace does has some value for other teams, but would perfer OP somehow stay a RAM!
    [SIGPIC][/SIGPIC]

  8. #8
    general counsel's Avatar
    general counsel is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
    Location
    atlanta, georgia
    Age
    52
    Posts
    5,605
    Rep Power
    82

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Well Rambling, you have a reasonable point, but one difference can be the cap impact. Personally, i think the bigger point is that if the rams had a chance to get a #1 for holt at midseason last year and they didnt take it, that would constitute gross mismanagement in the front office from my perspective. Midseason it was clear the rams were going nowhere and even with the two wins, once jackson was hurt, it was quite clear it was over. Even with jackson, we werent going to win 9 in a row and go to the playoffs. The #1 pick was and is valuable and we blew it big time if we turned it down.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel


  9. #9
    MauiRam's Avatar
    MauiRam is offline Pro Bowl Ram
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Maui, Hi.
    Age
    70
    Posts
    4,897
    Rep Power
    79

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    Well Rambling, you have a reasonable point, but one difference can be the cap impact. Personally, i think the bigger point is that if the rams had a chance to get a #1 for holt at midseason last year and they didnt take it, that would constitute gross mismanagement in the front office from my perspective. Midseason it was clear the rams were going nowhere and even with the two wins, once jackson was hurt, it was quite clear it was over. Even with jackson, we werent going to win 9 in a row and go to the playoffs. The #1 pick was and is valuable and we blew it big time if we turned it down.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel
    At what point in the season was the offer allegedly made? Before Linehan was canned? If not, I can see Scott being 100% against it, as he needed to win big time to save his neck. Even if it was after Haz took over, Jim needed wins to keep his HC gig. Once again, this one ultimately falls at the feet of the Rams' former management, Billy D did not have the power he has today. Has it been truly substantiated that we were offered a #1 pick for Torry? If we were for sure, it's a bitter pill to swallow ... man what a difference it would make both cap-wise and having an extra #1 .. It hurts to think about it !!!

  10. #10
    Ramblin` Ram's Avatar
    Ramblin` Ram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Nation of Rams
    Age
    38
    Posts
    2,401
    Rep Power
    54

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    At what point in the season was the offer allegedly made? Before Linehan was canned? If not, I can see Scott being 100% against it, as he needed to win big time to save his neck.
    if you recall there seemed to be a talk banded about around the time of his firing that..Linny was willing to get rid of Holt..perhaps willing is putting it mildly more that he was infact the person who was driving it thro but others in the organization was against it and blocked the move.

    something along the lines of Linny & Ziggy were for it,but the others on the coaching staff & front office were against it.

    i may be wrong but thats what my memory recalls..

  11. #11
    laram0's Avatar
    laram0 is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Location
    Massachusetts
    Age
    57
    Posts
    9,221
    Rep Power
    108

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post

    Pace is of course not as good as he was. Not close. But he is still an above average tackle and still dominates from time to time. Watch him bury joey porter of the dolphins on the tape if you dont believe me.


    ramming speed to all

    general counsel
    IMHO Pace is still one of the best left tackles in the NFL. We need to keep him, period.

    I'm curious as to where the CLAN ranks Pace among the LT's peresently in the NFL? Top 5?

  12. #12
    Ramblin` Ram's Avatar
    Ramblin` Ram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Nation of Rams
    Age
    38
    Posts
    2,401
    Rep Power
    54

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    Well Rambling, you have a reasonable point, but one difference can be the cap impact. Personally, i think the bigger point is that if the rams had a chance to get a #1 for holt at midseason last year and they didnt take it, that would constitute gross mismanagement in the front office from my perspective. Midseason it was clear the rams were going nowhere and even with the two wins, once jackson was hurt, it was quite clear it was over. Even with jackson, we werent going to win 9 in a row and go to the playoffs. The #1 pick was and is valuable and we blew it big time if we turned it down.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

    whilst i admit although i believe i can hold my own with game time on-field matters...im pretty much Pop Warner standard when it comes to F.O,salary cap stuff etc... e.g. until we hired a Pro personel head scout (whatever you call it) i didnt even know there was such a thing...i always presumed it was something that the HC & or GM took care of..

    but correct me if im wrong when a player is traded his salary transfers to that team..i had that in mind at the time of the post you replied to,but what i was thinking is..if a team came in that was just one or two players short of serious SB contenders,although i agree they wouldnt want to pay $10mill for him..with Holt i honestly dont believe the money is an issue..i believe Holt wants another visit to the big dance more than anything and although i doubt very much he`d re-structure for us ,if a team came in for him that could seriously take him to the SB in what will probably be the last 2 years of his career,he would re-structure in a heart beat.
    another theory ive been thinking about..maybe a team offering a mid round or later pick for him..would save themselves money rather than seeing Holt hit F.A and then getting in a bidding war with some team that has loads of cap space. maybe offering a 3rd round pick for him would scare off potential bidding rivals and then they try and re-structure him,also they would save some money by not having to pay for that 3rd rounder they gave away to get him.


    now ive thought all that i bet theres a damn stupid rule where players traded cant re-structure in their first year with a new team...grrrrrrrrrr

  13. #13
    Ramblin` Ram's Avatar
    Ramblin` Ram is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
    Location
    Nation of Rams
    Age
    38
    Posts
    2,401
    Rep Power
    54

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by laram0 View Post
    IMHO Pace is still one of the best left tackles in the NFL. We need to keep him, period.

    I'm curious as to where the CLAN ranks Pace among the LT's peresently in the NFL? Top 5?
    that question sounds like a good new thread to me..

  14. #14
    PeoriaRam's Avatar
    PeoriaRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Illinois
    Posts
    2,173
    Rep Power
    39

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramblin` Ram View Post
    if you recall there seemed to be a talk banded about around the time of his firing that..Linny was willing to get rid of Holt..perhaps willing is putting it mildly more that he was infact the person who was driving it thro but others in the organization was against it and blocked the move.

    something along the lines of Linny & Ziggy were for it,but the others on the coaching staff & front office were against it.

    i may be wrong but thats what my memory recalls..
    I think the rumor was Linebaka wanted to cut Holt a la Brown, due to his increased paranoia and was told he lacked the authority to make such a call.

  15. #15
    MarshallMarshall Guest

    Re: Holt, Pace may be on way out .. Jim Thomas

    I will always have Mad love and respect for Holt, but it's time to go we're rebuilding and that involves getting younger. I agree with most when saying hopefully they work something out with Pace, he can teach alot to the rookie OT we are going to draft in the 1st round. Plus I think he has atleast 1 more year if healthy.

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Thomas Chat 2-17
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: -02-19-2009, 03:25 AM
  2. Jim Thomas Chat - 2/10
    By Nick in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -02-11-2009, 03:56 PM
  3. Jim Thomas Live
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: -04-09-2008, 09:53 PM
  4. Jim Thomas Live, Jan 4th
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -01-05-2008, 09:34 AM
  5. J. Thomas Live, 12-27
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 1
    Last Post: -12-28-2007, 11:46 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •