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  1. #46
    Azul e Oro is offline Registered User
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Yikes, that's a pretty good hate you've got going for the D, Ferter. LOL.

    There's no way to defend the performance under Haslett but it's not nearly as clear-cut to me as to why they are that bad.You are certainly right,imo, that the rot set in long before he got to The Rams but I see precious little evidence that he he retarded its spread.

    As to his scheme, I've never heard anyone who said anything more complimentary about his schemes than that they were complicated and full of weird blitz packages/tendencies. It's not like he ran a radically different D in NO or post-Limpehan in STL when, presumably, he had more authority than under him.

    I didn't expect him to magically cure injuries or morph players into 3-4 personnel mid-season. But there are players with pedigree/talent/upside who lacked intensity,fundamental skills,and were repeatedly out of position for THREE seasons. Is that because they are just no damned good or because he & his staff couldn't motivate & teach them.Tye Hill never turning around his freaking head when he was in position to make a play. The stories about Pisa getting hurt & underachieving because he had poor technique.Examples abound. I just don't believe they are all busts. I agree that some have flaws that are beyond a coach's ability to fix but there's not much that I have seen in 3 years that gives me hope that he can scheme, motivate, or teach a way around any of the fixable ones.

    You are also right that a coordinator gets too much credit/blame for performance that has to do with personnel choices but what the heck is he responsible for if not the scheme,motivation/cohesion,and teaching?

    And that's not even to mention the many situations he handled questionably on the offensive side as HC. The SJ injury situation glares. The Cogs situation rankles. I'm sure you have your own favs.


    I'm always scathingly critical of The PD's coverage.I read the articles to either get my blood boiling early in the morning or to get a cheap laugh, not as a way to analyze the team or coaching performance. Nonetheless, the inconsistent info filtered through these PD boneheads about exactly how much influence Haz had on all aspects of his unit is relevant and confusing.I don't see how you can glean that from watching games.

    And, of course, it makes no sense for the man himself to take any responsibility for the defense as he makes his apparently highly-motivated campaign for HC.I understand it cynically but it pisses me off when he presents himself as a straight shooter, the-BS-stops-here kind of guy. The extreme spin on that, to me, is that he's either a self-serving egotist or a fool who doesn't really see the big picture in the clearly analytical way I want in a coach.The truth lies between in all probability.
    Last edited by Azul e Oro; -12-31-2008 at 05:21 PM.


  2. #47
    Curly Horns's Avatar
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Gee, Azul, you leave a lot to respond to. I don't like spending this much time typing bout stuff that can be looked at in more than one way, rather than always the negative view. Anyways....

    Yes, Azul, I despise most of these players on defense, (not personally - you know - i'm sure they are good enough guys), just as players on the field.

    Maybe you have not seen evidence of improvement because for the most part it is the same players or same type of player.

    Maybe it is easier to cut through the BS by taking one player at a time rather than grouping them all together and making wide-sweeping generalizations that speak to haslett not being able to teach, or motivate. And you have to keep in mind that it is impossible for the head coach (or the coordinator) to do it all. He has to rely heavily on his assistants and position coaches.

    Let me just do the starters on the D-depth chart:

    Glover - He sucks, he's old, he gets pushed around like a rag doll. sure haz brought him in, but that's most likely all zyg would give or what they could afford. I'm sure has would love to have a young stud to replace glover in a heartbeat.

    Little - what can one say here? all contingent on injuries with him. definately past his prime, more of a situational guy at this point in his career. bottom line: I don't see how you can blame haz for what little has become.

    Carriker - injury set him back this year. i'm not seeing how haslett has been detrimental to his continued development.

    Long - Cmon - Haslett is ruining this guy - don't think so.

    Bartell - the games I've been to in person I've been able to witness Bartell getting extensive coaching on the sidelines after every series. I think he has improved under haslett.

    F. Brown - hmmm....see glover - I don't think you can say haslett is harming his abilities. In fact haz is prob getting the most that can possibly be gotten out of him.

    Pisa - high motor, prob a great person, but he makes dumb mistakes all the time and he always has under every coach. so I don't see blaming haz for pisa's shortcomings. no coach yet has been able to get any more out of him than haslett.

    spoon - injury this season. he's out of position. stupid not to have a thumper in the middle and let this guy play the will spot. is that haslett's fault? what else has he been given by zyg?

    Draft - hmmm.....see glover.

    chavous - see glover again

    atogwe - He gets better every year, one of the few bright spots.



    I dunno, when I do it this way I just don't see why haslett gets so much of the blame.

    As far as the SJ injury, maybe he should have been out of the game, geez he gets hurt so easy. He was out of shape, missed camp because he was being a "me person". GC was correct, it ended up costing the Rams in the form of him being out of shape and behind the curve on the start of the season. All of this is haslett's fault? If that's what you think then I can't argue much more against this one.

    Cogs? What the hell is haslett's fault. He's been doing everything he can do with the guy. Giving him chance after chance. one of the few players along that O-line.

    Honestly I don't care about what the guys at the PD write in the way of how I view the performance of the players on the field. I read the articles here at the site, but I just don't have the time to sit around and analyze or read things into them in the way of how a player goes out and performs on the field. I really don't think it is that important or changes how a guy plays on sunday. he can either play or he can't. what bernie writes is never going to change that fact.

    I'm not sure what exactly you want in a head coach. personally, I think there is entirely too much emphasis placed on the head coach by fans. I want players, I want a GM that knows talent and can aquire talent. That's not to say you don't need a good head coach to teach, motivate and bring everyone together, but I think the most important part of a TEAM is the quality and chemistry of the roster. Right now one could make an arguement that bill belichick is the best head coach in the NFL, but other than pats fans, the rest of the fans would call him a cheater, when in fact he is simply the best teacher and leader. you can't win by trying to please all the fans - you just can't. in the fanatic world the head coach has always made the players and the fans have always known more than the head coach thereby creating a no-win situation.




  3. #48
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter View Post
    I



    Hey, great answer to the questions and comments I posed to you.....don't ya think? eh, well maybe you don't.

    I have never said that I think retaining haslett is a good idea. Besides that, I'm not the one you need to convince one way or the other.

    I will say this:
    If I'm devaney and I'm relying on what you have written, here at this site, to convince me one way or the other, then I'm in deep **** and an idiot for even listening to you to begin with.

    I have read a few good posts here from other members, (BBQ and Goldenfleece), that speak to being fair when judging haslett, however I have not read one decent post from the haslett haters that is even remotely convincing towards getting rid of haslett.

    That's not to say that haslett should not go, it's just to say no one here has written anything that is remotely convincing. in the end, I really don't give a crap because I know devaney is going to make the decision. With all the people surrounding him I think I trust he will make the call that is best suited for the Rams over the next few years.
    Jim Haslett

    Overall: 45 - 51
    Playoffs: 1 - 1

    YearTeamSeasonPlayoffs2000NOR10 - 6 - 01 - 12001NOR7 - 9 - 0- 2002NOR9 - 7 - 0- 2003NOR8 - 8 - 0- 2004NOR8 - 8 - 00 - 02005NOR3 - 13 - 00 - 0

    Ok, there is Haslett's record in New Orleans. His teams were never great, mostly average but horrible in the end. Also, his teams were more offensively minded than defensively so - even though defense was supposed to be Haslett's side of the ball. So there is your data on Haslett as a head coach. Basically, it confirms that Haslett is an "average" head coach and a worse defensive coordinator. Also, it should be noted that Haslett's best year with the Saints was his first year taking over Ditka's team and it went down slightly from there and never got better. That is 6 years worth of "data" on Haslett that cannot be refuted. You have another three years of "data" on Haslett as DC and HC with the Rams.......

    Since you accuse me of not bringing any "facts" to the table being a "Haslett Hater" - please notice all the facts I just brought. Feel free to do with them what you will. If you want an "average" head coach, then Jim Haslett is the perfect guy for you Ferter....

  4. #49
    Falconator Guest

    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter View Post
    I.
    Hey, great answer to the questions and comments I posed to you.....don't ya think? eh, well maybe you don't.

    I have never said that I think retaining haslett is a good idea. Besides that, I'm not the one you need to convince one way or the other.

    I will say this:
    If I'm devaney and I'm relying on what you have written, here at this site, to convince me one way or the other, then I'm in deep **** and an idiot for even listening to you to begin with.

    I have read a few good posts here from other members, (BBQ and Goldenfleece), that speak to being fair when judging haslett, however I have not read one decent post from the haslett haters that is even remotely convincing towards getting rid of haslett.

    That's not to say that haslett should not go, it's just to say no one here has written anything that is remotely convincing. in the end, I really don't give a crap because I know devaney is going to make the decision. With all the people surrounding him I think I trust he will make the call that is best suited for the Rams over the next few years.

    Ferter,

    You want facts?
    You want the truth?
    YOU CAN'T HANDLE THE TRUTH!!!!!!

    alright here goes. We will look at Jim Haslett's record. The "record" is dispassionate and speaks for itself

    Head Coach:
    Saints: 45-51....his best season with the Saints was the first one at 10-6. From there, he went downhill and was basically a .500 coach until his last year when they went 3-13. Yes, that was the Katrina year and he deserves a little benefit of the doubt for that year but basically even if you remove that year he was an "average" head coach.

    Rams: 2-10......Haslett won the first two contests and then lost 10 in a row from there. Very inspiring!

    Defensive Coordinator/Rams:
    I don't have any stats on Haslett's record as a defensive coordinator on where his defenses ranked but I know it was bad - real bad in the three years he was the DC......I'm sure some of you guys could tell me but my guess would be that his "average" defensive ranking in the league in total defense during this time was probably around 25th or worse out of 32 teams - am I right?


    So, Ferter - that is as "vanilla" an analysis of Jim Haslett's record as you can get......If you can find "hope" in that record and feel that Haslett should be the Rams head coach - have at it!

    Bottom-line, if the St. Louis Rams want to be "average" then Jim Haslett is your man!

  5. #50
    Curly Horns's Avatar
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Falconator,

    What I want or better yet what I would like, is for you to write something that would convince devaney. I doubt you can honestly say that you would feel confident that you could send any of the negative rhetoric, that you have written here, to devaney and he would strongly consider it as convincing evidence to discard haslett from further consideration.

    Oh, and i'd also like you to answer my questions from earlier in this thread. the one about why you care and why you are so anti-haslett to begin with.

    I'm going to scratch the Katrina aftermath season. Personally, I think life and the tradgedies one often encounters in life are more important than a freaking game.

    Having said that, I look at haslett's record as 42-38 - which, as you stated, is slightly above average.

    Now how can we sit here without also looking at the roster for those years. personally, I can't recall the personnel from every season. I do know the saints never had an over abundance of playmakers on those rosters.

    I'd venture to say that for the majority of those seasons the saints quality of personnel was just slightly above average. I'd also venture to say that haslett squeezed as much out of those rosters as any other head coach could have.

    But hey, you go on with your bad self and keep thinking it's all about the head coach. in the meantime i'll trade all-pro players for head coaches all day long and whup your ass on the field more times than not.

    Personally, I'm not vehemently opposed to haslett returning. I don't think he is as bad as you (and some others) are so desperately trying to make him out to be. Having said that, at this point I would also be happy with Frazier or Ryan, but neither of these guys has any kind of head coaching record from which to judge. At least haslett has a record as a head coach. Even devaney knows the biggest name in coaching is capable of losing - since he was asked and then quoted as saying the following:

    If that's the case, would Devaney be willing to pay Cowher $8 million a year to coach the Rams?

    "Whoa now," he said. "I'm not going to recommend that (kind of) guy. In case he bombs out: 'We just paid this guy $8 million and we win two games next year.' I'm not going there.



  6. #51
    Azul e Oro is offline Registered User
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    We actually agree on most things, Ferter, esp about the whole thing being murky and/or subjective.

    I did give a couple of examples of specific players in Hill and Pisa who I think are not bums-your word-and just the briefest of thumbnails of the coachable flaws that make them look bad and the team look worse than it is.

    And you are really going out of your way to spin things for Haslett to blame everyone else for players like Chavous and Glover whose praises he has constantly sung over the years.

    I love C. Long but if you think he played the run well,then we do see things v. differently. Just look at the last game where he repeatedly played pass and left Pisa on an island. The rookie wall and all that but I'd hope to see him being smarter as the season wore on.

    I agree about Bartell &, to a lesser extent, Atogwe. OJ makes way too many mental errors at this stage.He either doesn't understand where he's supposed to be or hasn't had it taught to him.I really don't believe forcing fumbles is the most important quality in a safety. He does have plenty of upside but whether it's despite Haz or because of him...

    My problem with the SJ issue was not so much the decision to keep him in the Dallas game- not smart but bad luck as well- as it was the mishandling of his recovery & return. We really could have made a game of it vs The Cards if Haz hadn't taken SJ's self-diagnosis at face value, considering the other RBs injury/inactive status. And SJ aggravated the leg,to add weeks of insult to the original injury. That is bad communication & strategy, long and short term.He screwed up in similar fashion with the QB situation in NO.Bad sign.

    I totally agree that a GM and a plan and proper talent evaluation are paramount.

    I'm not sure I understand your point about Belichick. Are you saying the team he coaches is successful because of the quality/chemistry of the talent he is given or because he's a great teacher and leader (motivator? communicator? game day tactician?).

    I think the answer is pretty obviously both. Add luck and a smattering of cheatritude. Mix well. Not one of my football friends wouldn't take him as HC for their team even though they disapprove of the dirty-ops stuff in general. Would you?

    Maybe that's a "Don't Ask, Don't Tell" question for a Rams fan.I sure don't want to have to answer it.

    The interconnected puzzle of success in movie making was once famously described as " Nobody knows anything".I think it's true for sports as well. That's what makes playing fantasy football gods so eternally fun. There is no definitive recipe. Doesn't mean the factors can't be discussed,analyzed, and theories offered.

    You can't seriously be suggesting that we just defer to his greater knowledge because he got hired by The Rams and The Saints? Nuh-uh. Can't do it.

    Ironically, I think you hint at one of the best arguments against Haslett; Joe Fan's perception of him as a tough football man's man. Looks even better in comparison to Limpehan.Ethical issues aside, Belichick has the record to back his rep and minimize the damage the negative stuff might have done. Haslett does not.Maybe he can provide the substance to justify the Central Casting image but it hasn't happened yet,imo. Charisma is a good quality in a leader but it can hide some serious flaws,too.

    Dunno who would be better if all other things were equal. How could anyone? And who cares? Sounds like an after-the-5th-beer bar conversation to me.



    I try to base my comments on hard facts as much as possible and, in Haz's case, I don't think they bode well but of course it's just a fan's opinion. You make many valid points but I disagree that the balance of evidence as far as we can understand it make him anything more than a middling choice.
    I want more.

    Time to get a little shnockered.
    Happy New Year to all.
    Last edited by Azul e Oro; -01-01-2009 at 06:07 AM.

  7. #52
    Tony Soprano's Avatar
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    .
    Haslett is a Cellar-Dweller.

    If you make him Head Coach - just see how difficult it'll be to attract any talent whatsoever after 3 more years of losing upon the last 3-4.

    No one will want to come anywhere near St.Louis - from Free Agents to any remnants on talent on the roster.

    Personally, I see the insidious creep of accepting mediocrity (and worse) already.



  8. #53
    Falconator Guest

    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter View Post
    Falconator,

    What I want or better yet what I would like, is for you to write something that would convince devaney. I doubt you can honestly say that you would feel confident that you could send any of the negative rhetoric, that you have written here, to devaney and he would strongly consider it as convincing evidence to discard haslett from further consideration.

    Oh, and i'd also like you to answer my questions from earlier in this thread. the one about why you care and why you are so anti-haslett to begin with.

    I'm going to scratch the Katrina aftermath season. Personally, I think life and the tradgedies one often encounters in life are more important than a freaking game.

    Having said that, I look at haslett's record as 42-38 - which, as you stated, is slightly above average.

    Now how can we sit here without also looking at the roster for those years. personally, I can't recall the personnel from every season. I do know the saints never had an over abundance of playmakers on those rosters.

    I'd venture to say that for the majority of those seasons the saints quality of personnel was just slightly above average. I'd also venture to say that haslett squeezed as much out of those rosters as any other head coach could have.

    But hey, you go on with your bad self and keep thinking it's all about the head coach. in the meantime i'll trade all-pro players for head coaches all day long and whup your ass on the field more times than not.

    Personally, I'm not vehemently opposed to haslett returning. I don't think he is as bad as you (and some others) are so desperately trying to make him out to be. Having said that, at this point I would also be happy with Frazier or Ryan, but neither of these guys has any kind of head coaching record from which to judge. At least haslett has a record as a head coach. Even devaney knows the biggest name in coaching is capable of losing - since he was asked and then quoted as saying the following:

    If that's the case, would Devaney be willing to pay Cowher $8 million a year to coach the Rams?

    "Whoa now," he said. "I'm not going to recommend that (kind of) guy. In case he bombs out: 'We just paid this guy $8 million and we win two games next year.' I'm not going there.


    Ferter,

    to answer your question: Why do I care if Rams hire Jim Haslett or not?

    Well, of course everybody knows I'm a Falcons fan - so, at the end of the day, if Rams want to hire Haslett and screw up their team - I won't lose a lot of sleep over it.

    Honestly, I really enjoyed "the process" of last year's Falcons offseason and watching a roster in shambles and a team in shambles get "re-made" from the top-down. Like most of you, I think it would extremely rewarding to be a GM and get to re-make a team.....most of us are "armchair GM's" and while we may not know what we are talking about - its fun to do and just a hobby I guess.

    So, it looks like my "Falcons" are fixed. I got to this Rams board during the draft last year basically trying to find out what the real Rams fans thought the St. Louis Rams would do with their #2 pick overall since it was in front of my beloved Falcons pick at #3......then I enjoyed the messageboard and most of its members and kind of "hung around". Now, I find myself "genuinely interested" in how this Rams offseason plays out. Because the Falcons just went through it 365 days ago and the plot had many twists and turns (we got this new GM- Thomas Dimitroff (we all said "who?", we got this new HC - Mike Smith - again "who?" and then we had the draft that many people questioned. Most people liked the Michael Turner signing......so, Falcons re-made 60% of their roster in one off-season and went from 4-12 to 11-5. Ravens and Dolphins had similiar turnarounds.

    One thing each one of those teams did was make "bold moves" and hired head coaches with fresh ideas, energy and leadership.......Not a retread head coach in the bunch.

    Again, I tell you to quote a line from Dennis Green, "He is(Haslett) who we thought he is"........if you get Haslett as head coach, you know what you are getting - he's a "middle-of-the-road" head coach who does not aspire his teams to greatness. The guy has had a long, long track record to review. The fact that he has coached over 100 NFL games (47-61) and you Ferter want to throw out his worst Saints season and this year with Rams and say he's (42-38).....well fine, do that. I think Haslett has won one playoff game in his tenure as well......OK......

    If I was Billy Devaney (and I'm sure your glad I am not), I would rather interview many, many candidates and probably even take an assistant NFL coach who has had a good track record and has leadership qualities in spades - where his players respect the coach, would run through a wall for the coach, where the players like the coach but know their is a "line" and that the coach is a disciplinarian as well.

    I would rather take an assistant that is extremely impressive and with a good track record - than taking Jim Haslett where I know what I'm getting. I don't think the team will ever be "great" with Jim Haslett as head coach. And, by the way, I think this message/post would resonate with Billy Devaney. Its not a negative diatribe on Jim Haslett - its factual and the arguments on how to select the new head coach are logical. Besides, as many have said, Billy Devaney played "a part" in the Atlanta Falcons coaching search.

    I think Devaney was very pleased with the coaching hire of Mike Smith in Atlanta (even though Thomas Dimitroff made the pick) and I think Devaney would like to get a new head coach with a lot of the same traits as Mike Smith......Mike Smith is "fiery" but also very disciplined in his approach. Smith believes in a very physical football team that runs the ball and can stop the run(Falcons did not do that very well this year and it will be an offseason emphasis). Smith is not aloof and is very approachable by his players, by fans and by the media. Also, Mike Smith "built a great coaching staff" which is important as well. Falcons players love Mike Smith but more than that, they respect him and know that he is disclipinarian. Smith never calls out players in public and you never hear Smith bash his players - but he will deal directly with the players in private if need be. Smith has very low tolerance for undisciplined players and troublemakers (they got rid of malcontent DeAngelo Hall quickly).

    I really doubt that Devaney keeps Haslett.......he is the "fall-back" position if everyone else tells him "no".
    Last edited by Falconator; -01-01-2009 at 10:07 AM.

  9. #54
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Soprano View Post
    .
    Haslett is a Cellar-Dweller.

    If you make him Head Coach - just see how difficult it'll be to attract any talent whatsoever after 3 more years of losing upon the last 3-4.

    No one will want to come anywhere near St.Louis - from Free Agents to any remnants on talent on the roster.

    Personally, I see the insidious creep of accepting mediocrity (and worse) already.

    We agree again- must be a Jersey thing. Haslett never impressed me when he was with New Orleans, definately didn't impress me as DC with the Rams, and his 2-10 record as HC speaks for itself. Devanney can't seriously be considering him as a canidate, but after bringing back Linehan for a 3rd season, I wouldn't be shocked it he was.

  10. #55
    clarasDK is offline Registered User
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    I am not willing.

    Bad performance as D coordinator, bad as HC. And absolutely nothing special when he was HC for the Saints either.

    I think we need to change the coaching staff to show the players that the Rams are willing to make the change back into a winning organisation.

  11. #56
    fearsome foursome is offline Registered User
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    I'm surprised at how many are ready to give an assistant coach his "first shot" at the head coaching job. While that has worked out many times in the past , it doesn't always. Remember Scott Linehan? Many head coaches are more successful the second time around. This is also true of many business owners, it was in my case I know. Sometimes you become a better coach, manager, etc for having failed the first time. The good ones learn from their mistakes. I think Haz learned from his experience in New Orleans and from Linehans' expreience as well. He knows a lot about what NOT to do now. Does that make him our best hope for the future? I don't know. Personally, I like Shanahan. I hear that he might not be that expensive since he still has contract money owed to him by the Broncos (and the Raiders but that's another story). There are a lot of good assistants out there that will make good head coaches and some that will not. Are you willing to be their testing ground? Is change good just for change sake? We need a new direction for sure and I think Devaney is taking us in one. I just don't think that Haslett should be tossed aside because of his record here recently. It would make sense to keep him. OK Haslett haters, PILE ON .

  12. #57
    RAMarkable is offline Registered User
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Falconator,

    You posted the following quote from Dennis Green "He is (Haslett) who we thought he is....", then you kinda dropped it from there. Could you please elaborate on what Green was trying to say and maybe explain the context that generatd this comment? I'm not really sure what point he (or you) are trying to make.

    WHAT SAY YE?

  13. #58
    Falconator Guest

    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by RAMarkable View Post
    Falconator,

    You posted the following quote from Dennis Green "He is (Haslett) who we thought he is....", then you kinda dropped it from there. Could you please elaborate on what Green was trying to say and maybe explain the context that generatd this comment? I'm not really sure what point he (or you) are trying to make.

    WHAT SAY YE?
    RAMarkable,

    you have seen the "Coors Light" commercials with Dennis Green, right?......

    its kind of a joke but my point was and is - Jim Haslett's record speaks for him - he's an "average as grits" NFL head coach and there is nothing inspring about what he did at New Orleans or what he has done at St. Louis.....

  14. #59
    Curly Horns's Avatar
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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Falconator,

    Good post, now I'm getting more than "haslett sucks" out of you. Thank you for answering the questions. Now I know where you are coming from.

    Personally, I'm not an armchair or wannabe GM. I'm just a lifetime Rams fan that played football from a young age through high school. I love the game - always have always will.

    I'm happy with letting the GM do his job and then I like to evaluate the product he puts on the field. It's not my job to solve problems or build a team. I don't have the time to focus on "what if it were my job" - but I do like to voice my opinion on some of the bonehead moves the Rams FO has made over the years.

    I focus on the players rather than the head coach. I'm not a Rams head coach fan, rather, I'm a Rams players fan. That's not to say I don't get upset when I think the head coach (DC or OC) is making bonehead calls or running the team in an inept manner.

    I'm a firm believer that the players are the most important part of the game. Ultimately they make the plays that win or lose games. That is not to say the head coach is useless. Some coaches are better than others at taking a player or players and making them better. But at the NFL level I'm not so certain there is a huge gap with these skills among the coaching fraternity.

    There are all kinds of examples of the cycle of success among numerous coaches. Let me just cite a couple from your own falcons team. This year you have a very good O-line. It just so happens that your O-line coach was with the Rams last season. Sure the Rams had injuries along the line, but this coach could not get any continuity or make any of the guys better than they were. Bottom line the offensive line sucked big time. Was it all paul boudreau's fault? I mean he was the O-line coach, had to be his fault, right? And how about the falcons defense this season? mike smith had a ton of success with the jags as far as where his defenses were ranked. Yet now, as head coach with the falcons the defense does not look near as good in the rankings. Rush(25th) Pass(21st) Total Yards(24th) Pts(11th). Very low numbers considering what mike smith defenses have had in the past. These are just two examples and there are 100s more if not 1000s throughout the history of the NFL.

    I trust devaney will make a good call with the head coach. I'm not overly concerned about it. I just find folly with many of the other Rams fans that think a head coach is a magical God and yet they can not even put into decent words why one guy is a God and the next guy simply sucks.

    I WANT PLAYERS. The Rams need football players - more than anything else they need players. I'm tired of watching these Rams every Sunday. They are damn well horrid, especially the middle of the D and the O-line. They are soft candy ass bums. I'm not sure how the majority are playing at the NFL level.

    Get some players, devaney!!!




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    Re: Jim Haslett as St. Louis Rams coach ... are fans willing?

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter View Post
    I look at haslett's record as 42-38 - which, as you stated, is slightly above average.
    Something wrong with your numbers (seeing that I'm a big stat guy). Other than his first year as HC of the Saints team, Haslett hasn't shown me anything to inspire me that he should be retained as our head coach and be the architect of our rebuilding years.

    NOR2000 10-6
    NOR2001 7-9
    NOR2002 9-7
    NOR2003 8-8
    NOR2004 8-8
    NOR2005 3-13
    STL2008* 2-9
    Total = 47-60
    But hey, you go on with your bad self and keep thinking it's all about the head coach. in the meantime i'll trade all-pro players for head coaches all day long and whup your ass on the field more times than not.
    I'm assuming by the poor sentence structure, given the preceeding sentence, that you meant to say you would trade head coaches for all-pro players all day long. Yeah, that worked for Dan Snyder didn't it. The absurdity of your challenge, given all of the examples to the contrary where coaches have lifted average players to accomplish great things, makes one wonder where your hostility is directed?
    Last edited by bigredman; -01-01-2009 at 04:44 PM.
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