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  1. #16
    NJ Ramsfan1 is offline Registered User
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    "The only reason he makes a statement like that is to stir up the fans, many of whom are already prone to negativity and distrust of the organization."


    The only fan he's really stirring up, AV is you! You've made no secret of your dislike for Bernie and his articles. I think if the guy authored an ammendment to the constitution you'd find ten things wrong with it.

    No straight thinking person would think this uncertainty with Rams ownership is healthy. The timing of Kroenke's power play is particularly horrendous. And while many aspects of the team, including the draft, may go on as "business as usual", to think the organization will function at peak efficiency without a true leader is foolish. One need only to look at the past 20 years in Rams history (save for a miraculous 5 year window) to see how a clueless owner and poor leadership can hurt a franchise. General Counsel is 100% right in his assertions that this uncertainty can indeed be a problem if not resolved in a reasonable amount of time.


  2. #17
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by NJ Ramsfan1 View Post
    "The only reason he makes a statement like that is to stir up the fans, many of whom are already prone to negativity and distrust of the organization."


    The only fan he's really stirring up, AV is you! You've made no secret of your dislike for Bernie and his articles. I think if the guy authored an ammendment to the constitution you'd find ten things wrong with it.

    No straight thinking person would think this uncertainty with Rams ownership is healthy. The timing of Kroenke's power play is particularly horrendous. And while many aspects of the team, including the draft, may go on as "business as usual", to think the organization will function at peak efficiency without a true leader is foolish. One need only to look at the past 20 years in Rams history (save for a miraculous 5 year window) to see how a clueless owner and poor leadership can hurt a franchise. General Counsel is 100% right in his assertions that this uncertainty can indeed be a problem if not resolved in a reasonable amount of time.
    Well, obviously you didn't actually read my posts.

    I never said that uncertainty in the ownership situation is not problematic. Clearly, it would be a good thing for this issue to be resolved so that the new owner can start putting a plan into place to take the team to the next level. Unquestionably, we'd like these issues to be resolved sooner, rather than later.

    My beef with Bernie is that, instead of simply stating that it will be a good thing when the ownership issue is resolved, he floods the PD with doomsday scenarios.

    "Oh my God! The Rams won't be able to sign their first pick!!!"

    "Aaaah!!!! Kroenke may be plotting to move the team!!!"

    "See? The Dolphins can make a trade for Brandon Marshall and we can't!!!"

    If you enjoy tabloid histrionics, good for you.

    I find Bernie's approach to be immature, irresponsible and entirely unnecessary. The real shame of it is that he has an audience. I do too, in a much more limited sense, so I choose to present a more even keeled analysis.

    If you don't like it... simple solution. If you see a thread started by me with the word "Bernie" in the title, don't open it.
    Last edited by AvengerRam; -04-15-2010 at 11:41 AM.

  3. #18
    NJ Ramsfan1 is offline Registered User
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    Wink Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Well, obviously you didn't actually read my posts.

    I never said that uncertainty in the ownership situation is not problematic. Clearly, it would be a good thing for this issue to be resolved so that the new owner can start putting a plan into place to take the team to the next level. Unquestionably, we'd like these issues to be resolved sooner, rather than later.

    My beef with Bernie is that, instead of simply stating that it will be a good thing when the ownership issue is resolved, he floods the PD with doomsday scenarios.

    "Oh my God! The Rams won't be able to sign their first pick!!!"

    "Aaaah!!!! Kroenke may be plotting to move the team!!!"

    "See? The Dolphins can make a trade for Brandon Marshall and we can't!!!"

    If you enjoy tabloid histrionics, good for you.

    I find Bernie's approach to be immature, irresponsible and entirely unnecessary. The real shame of it is that he has an audience. I do too, in a much more limited sense, so I choose to present a more even keeled analysis.

    If you don't like it... simple solution. If you see a thread started by me with the word "Bernie" in the title, don't open it.

    Or, maybe you could not read articles written by Bernie- instead of childishly subtracting rep. points from someone who dares to disagree with you.

  4. #19
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Actually, I gave GC positive rep for his posts on this thread, and he disagrees with me entirely. You should read his posts and consider the difference in your approaches. Its an "attack the post, not the poster" thing.

    As for me not reading Bernie's articles... well, I could do that, but there really is only one newspaper that covers the Rams and he often gets the headline, so its somewhat unavoidable.

  5. #20
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    If Kroenke was planning to move the team, don't you think he would have mentioned that, as doing so would likely elimate the whole cross-ownership issue?
    I'm not so sure about that .. He can't move the team right away can he? At least not until the stadium lease allows him to?? (2014?) If he truly desires a move, he might not wish to further anger an already alienated fan base by tipping his hand early. I am not implying he does wish to move the team, as I have no idea what the guy wants to do in that regard. However, if he is looking at relocating the Rams down the road, now might not be the best time to divulge it ..

    Agreed on the Rams passing on Marshall ..

  6. #21
    NJ Ramsfan1 is offline Registered User
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Actually, I gave GC positive rep for his posts on this thread, and he disagrees with me entirely. You should read his posts and consider the difference in your approaches. Its an "attack the post, not the poster" thing.

    As for me not reading Bernie's articles... well, I could do that, but there really is only one newspaper that covers the Rams and he often gets the headline, so its somewhat unavoidable.

    Well, I didn't attack you in any way, AV- I merely said that really you were the only one who seemed bothered by this article. Now I was a bit facetious, but it is obvious that you really dislike this guy (Bernie). I would not nominate Bernie for the Pulitzer, but his articles aren't half as bad as you'd lead us to believe.

    My opinion.

  7. #22
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by MauiRam View Post
    I'm not so sure about that .. He can't move the team right away can he? At least not until the stadium lease allows him to?? (2014?) If he truly desires a move, he might not wish to further anger an already alienated fan base by tipping his hand early. I am not implying he does wish to move the team, as I have no idea what the guy wants to do in that regard. However, if he is looking at relocating the Rams down the road, now might not be the best time to divulge it ..

    Agreed on the Rams passing on Marshall ..
    Actually, to correct myself somewhat, the only way moving the team would solve the cross ownership issue would be if he could somehow move the team to Denver, which he obviously can't do.

    In the end, there is nothing in Kroenke's announcement that should cause one to conclude that he has designs on moving the team. The most likely scenario appears to be for Kroenke to "sell" his Denver clubs to his son and to keep the Rams in St. Louis.

  8. #23
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by NJ Ramsfan1 View Post
    you were the only one who seemed bothered by this article.
    You mean me and the people who posted (before you) that they too had an issue with Bernie's article.

  9. #24
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Actually, to correct myself somewhat, the only way moving the team would solve the cross ownership issue would be if he could somehow move the team to Denver, which he obviously can't do.

    In the end, there is nothing in Kroenke's announcement that should cause one to conclude that he has designs on moving the team. The most likely scenario appears to be for Kroenke to "sell" his Denver clubs to his son and to keep the Rams in St. Louis.
    Thanks for correcting that. I had to say a little "hunh?" when I first read your post.

    As for the move. While it's true that nothing Kroenke "said" implies that he has any intention of moving the team, there is also nothing in what he said that would lead anyone to conclude that he wouldn't move the team. Why would he do that? Was it intentional? I can think of a couple of reasons right off the top of my head. As for intentional, probably so. Here's my reasoning.

    1) If Mr. Kroenke intends to keep the team in St Louis, he'll want a new stadium (or at minimum a major renovation). The lack of commitment to stay might loosen the purse strings with the legislature for funding. While he has strong ties to MO, he has strong ties in Denver and LA as well (Denver will never happen).

    2) As stated by a previous poster, why would he want to stir up the "move" issue before he even controls the team's destiny. It wouldn't be prudent. His statement of intent was very carefully worded (by his attorney no doubt). He didn't get to where he is by being stupid, or tipping others off to his intentions prematurely.

    3) Stating an intention to move the team would put the current majority owners in a bind. On one hand, they want to sell the team (now). On the other hand, they've stated that they want new owners that will keep the team in MO. Mr Kroenke doesn't want to make them look bad.

    As for moving the team at all, I see that as a business decision. As I stated earlier, Mr Kroenke also has ties in the west. I believe that he had some discussions with John Elway about teaming up to bringing an expansion team to California before the NFL nixed the idea. The increased revenue the team would enjoy from the propsed new stadium complex in L.A, plus increased revenue from TV contracts in the 2nd largest market in the country, plus the draw the location might have on potential FAs in the future , would be very inticing for an owner intent on creating and maintaining a winning organization. I'm not advocating a move. I just can see how it would be a very good business move.

    So, while Bernie might be "stirring the pot", his point isn't without any merit.
    That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!!

  10. #25
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Another possibility is that he simply didn't see any reason to address the issue at this time and there's no hidden meaning at all.

  11. #26
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Another possibility is that he simply didn't see any reason to address the issue at this time and there's no hidden meaning at all.
    Pretty safe assumption since he has been a partial owner of the team in its entire time in St. Louis.
    "The disappointment of losing is huge!"

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  12. #27
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    Re: Leave it to Bernie to turn the Kroenke issue into a soap opera.

    Quote Originally Posted by avengerram View Post
    another possibility is that he simply didn't see any reason to address the issue at this time and there's no hidden meaning at all.
    absolutely
    That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!!

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