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Thread: Martz guys

  1. #46
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Smile Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter
    LOL

    Funny how this can now go.

    If a player works out we could assume that player was picked by Martz. If a player does not work out we could assume that player was picked by the FO.

    Or we could just assume that Martz never had a say in personnel.....yeah right.
    LMAO
    LOL
    I could not agree more.

    I wonder was it the FO that picked all the Probowlers when Vermeil was here or was it Vermeil?


  2. #47
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    Re: Why did Martz start the season with 4 of 5 OL who were Vermeil guys ????

    Quote Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN
    Thank god for the second RT in the draft to be Barron and fall to us.
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce
    Barron was a LT. We converted him to RT.
    Quote Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN
    I figured that was common knowledge that he played LT the majority of the time but he also played a little RT and I think everyone knows we drafted him as a RT. It was not that far of a stretch to think we could convert him into a RT.
    I was just pointing out that in your post you made the error saying Barron was a RT. Nowhere did I say anything about him not being able to be converted.
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce
    Tre was running great against an awful NYG run defense. 5.8 YPC yet he only gets 13 carries. I can't wait until the Rams abandon you, Schotty.

  3. #48
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Martz guys

    Fair enough you and me just looked at it two different ways you looked at it from his college days and I looked at it as our second option at right tackle I understand my post was not clear in that regard. That was my mistake.

  4. #49
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    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN
    Fair enough you and me just looked at it two different ways you looked at it from his college days and I looked at it as our second option at right tackle I understand my post was not clear in that regard. That was my mistake.
    It's all good :up:
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce
    Tre was running great against an awful NYG run defense. 5.8 YPC yet he only gets 13 carries. I can't wait until the Rams abandon you, Schotty.

  5. #50
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    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter
    LOL

    Funny how this can now go.

    If a player works out we could assume that player was picked by Martz. If a player does not work out we could assume that player was picked by the FO.

    Or we could just assume that Martz never had a say in personnel.....yeah right.
    I remember Martz being quoted after the draft, saying Curtis would "light the NFL on fire." I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he was a Martz pick.

  6. #51
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by Evil Disco Man
    I remember Martz being quoted after the draft, saying Curtis would "light the NFL on fire." I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he was a Martz pick.
    Either Martz is doing the picking or he is not some people try to say all good picks are Martz brilliance and all the bad ones are the FO.

    From 2000-2005 under Martz we have 0 ProBowlers come out of the draft so far.

    The 7 drafts prior to Martz we had 7 ProBowlers.

    From 1993-1995 we had three consecutive drafts produce 3 ProBowlers (Bettis 93 (rd1), Bruce 94 (rd2), Carter 95 (rd1).

    1996 we had none although we drafted three guys still playing good today Eddie Kennison (rd1), Ernie Conwell (rd2), and Fred Miller (rd5))

    From 1997-1999 we had three consecutive drafts produce four ProBowl players.
    1997
    Pace (rd1)

    1998
    Little (rd3)

    1999
    Holt (rd1)
    Dre Bly (rd2) Martz chose not to resign. He went to ProBowl the last two years with Detroit. Has 4 INTs in 6 games this year.

  7. #52
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Martz guys

    As for Curtis he was not a suprise pick coming out in the third round at #74 over all he had great numbers.

    In two seasons for the Aggies, caught 171 passes (school-record) for 2,789 yards (second in school history)…earned all-America second-team, all-Independent, and National Independent Offensive Player of the Year by The NFL Draft Report and Sports Xchange as senior…ranked seventh in nation with 114.36 yards/game average and ranked 12th in country with 6.73 rec./game average…led team with 74 receptions (fifth-best season total in school history) for 1,258 yards and nine touchdowns…earned Associated Press all-America third-team selection as junior…finalist for Biletnikoff Award, given to nation’s top receiverconsensus all-Independent first-team pick…led country with 9.1 rec./game average and ranked third with 139.2 yards/game averageset school season-records with 100 receptions for 1,531 yards and 10 touchdowns, breaking previous marks of 92 catches for 1,400 yards…his 10 scoring grabs rank sixth on Aggies’ season-record list.

    It was a solid pick by Martz he made the pick they should have in that position.
    Last edited by STLRAMSFAN; -11-03-2005 at 01:16 AM.

  8. #53
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    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN
    When the HEAD COACH sets down with the candidate for defensive coordinator they should discuss the philosophy and type personnel that the HEAD COACH wants and see if they are on the same page. The HEAD COACH should then be able to come up with the REQUIREMENTS of the D coordinator position prior to hiring him. The HEAD COACH after hiring the D coordinator would then be responsible as the D coordinators BOSS to see that those requirements are carried out. They should also discuss the type of personnel they think it would take to install that philosophy they mutually agreed on before he was hired. When discussing personnel issues the HEAD COACH has the ultimate decision on what players to bring in not the D coordinator. Once he is hired the HEAD COACH still has the final say he is the BOSS of the D coordinator.

    The HEAD COACH should lay out a road map with the potential candidate of the philosophy and goals you want to obtain. I would not hire a guy because he is my buddy (Marmie). Also as HEAD COACH if you are changing PHILOSOPHY on what you want each time you change D coordinators then that’s your fault if you don’t have the personnel. Case in point they could have brought in some one more in line with the D they had instead of Lovie. Then when they went to Marmie they could have went with someone more like Lovie. Every time Martz changes coaches he drastically changes Philosophy and type coaches he seeks. Then he changes the requirements of the position.
    Only Parcells and Bellichek have that type of clout in the NFL STL. No other coach has that kind of juice. Also on the Bly deal, the money wasn't there for him at the time. Remember, that was when Warner was up for a contract and we were going to have to pay Warner big bucks for what he did.

  9. #54
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    Re: Martz guys

    As for Curtis he was not a suprise pick coming out in the third round at #74 over all he had great numbers.
    The surprise is not where he went. Most draft boards had him as the 10th-12th receiver off the board, and we took him as the 10th. The surprise was Martz stating Curtis was the #2 receiver on the Rams board. Several mock drafts had the Rams picking Taylor Jacobs with their 2nd round pick or even some had Martz taking Bryant Johnson in the 1st. But instead they waited for Curtis in the 3rd. I'd say the smart move there would be knowing the rest of the world saw Curtis outside the top 10 receivers and not jumping to take him too early, which of course opened the door for Kennedy and Pisa.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  10. #55
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    Re: Martz guys

    some people try to say all good picks are Martz brilliance and all the bad ones are the FO.
    Actually, nobody has said this. If you can show me where anybody on this board has made this statement, I will apologize, but I've never seen anyone claim all good picks are from Martz and all bad picks are the FO.

    For example, I'd attribute (just my own speculation, of course) some horrible picks to Martz, such as Canidate, Travis Scott, and Eric Crouch. But he's made his share of good picks IMHO as well........Curtis, Fitzpatrick & Incognito (time will tell on these two), Holt (some will say DV, but I believe Martz was the driving force on this one).

    Bottomline though with most picks is that we have no idea who wanted who. What's apparent is that Martz is not the end-all voice when it comes to decisions. We've seen now that Zygmunt seems to have some level of veto power over Martz, so who knows who wanted who for most picks?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  11. #56
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    Re: Martz guys

    I love the comparison of "no Pro Bowlers" during the Martz years as compared to seven "Pro Bowlers" in the seven previous years.

    Talk about skewing the analysis.

    Never mind that...

    During the 92-99 years the Rams were picking at the TOP of the draft every year.

    Or that some of the players drafted since Martz took over have been in the league less than 3 years and still may make the Pro Bowl (does anyone doubt that guys like Steven Jackson, Pisa Tinoisamoa, Jimmy Kennedy, Adam Archuleta, Ryan Pickett and Alex Barron could someday make the Pro Bowl?).

    The drafts under the Martz years have had some big misses, no doubt (though, as some have noted, Martz is not solely responsible for all those picks).

    But there have been some solid choices as well, coupled with some FA finds and trades that have helped the team significantly (Bulger, A.Williams).

    I don't think that "no Pro Bowlers" tells the whole story.

  12. #57
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    Re: Martz guys

    What's funny is, when people mention that Bulger was a Pro Bowl MVP they make off the cuff remarks. However, when the Rams don't draft a Pro Bowl player it suddenly becomes a benchmark.

    Guess it's true what they say, one mans trash is another mans treasure.

  13. #58
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    Re: Martz guys

    I remember Martz being quoted after the draft, saying Curtis would "light the NFL on fire." I don't think it's too much of a stretch to say he was a Martz pick.
    Well for that matter it is probably not a stretch to say that the QB from Nebraska (albeit I have no direct qutoes to give you) was a Martz pick. My point was, with the recent revelations about personnel, it is anyones guess as to who picked who.


    some of the players drafted since Martz took over have been in the league less than 3 years and still may make the Pro Bowl (does anyone doubt that guys like Steven Jackson, Pisa Tinoisamoa, Jimmy Kennedy, Adam Archuleta, Ryan Pickett and Alex Barron could someday make the Pro Bowl?).

    The drafts under the Martz years have had some big misses, no doubt (though, as some have noted, Martz is not solely responsible for all those picks).

    But there have been some solid choices as well, coupled with some FA finds and trades that have helped the team significantly (Bulger, A.Williams).

    I don't think that "no Pro Bowlers" tells the whole story.
    Basically I agree with all of this, however, as long as they continue to play, I have no doubts that the guys you listed could make the pro bowl. I do have doubts that Pisa or Arch will in fact make the pro bowl.




  14. #59
    evil disco man's Avatar
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    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter
    Well for that matter it is probably not a stretch to say that the QB from Nebraska (albeit I have no direct qutoes to give you) was a Martz pick. My point was, with the recent revelations about personnel, it is anyones guess as to who picked who.
    Eric Crouch was a pure Martz pick, a huge reach looking to fill Az Hakim's shoes, I don't argue that. Some of the moves Eric Crouch had [check out his 100+ yard run against Missouri if you ever get the chance] made me drool, but it's too bad he turned out to be a wuss who couldn't take hits and handle NFL workouts. Randel-El was in the same category as Crouch but wound up getting picked earlier in the round [if I remember correctly].

    Completely agreed that it will never be clear as to who picks who, and it doesn't really matter much to me. I know Armey has a great eye for talent [see: London Fletcher], and Martz has had a few decent picks, but I guess my point is [if I do have one] that there is no concrete way to draft. Everyone has made stupid picks.

  15. #60
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Martz guys

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    During the 92-99 years the Rams were picking at the TOP of the draft every year.
    3 of the 7 ProBowlers were picked after the first round and one was picked in the third round.

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