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  1. #31
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Most here are smarter than me when it comes to the actual game so why Pisa and not Draft?

    I know Pisa was scheduled to make about 1.5 million more than Draft but he is 6 years younger than Draft, dwarfed Draft in all stats last year and Draft is scheduled to be a free agent next year anyway. This will more than likely be his last year as a Ram.

    I still trust Billy D and Spags but I'm still curious about this one.


  2. #32
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    I don't think this is incredibly shocking. It kind of came out of the blue in terms of timing, but I believe we had a thread here during the offseason about Pisa as a possible cap casualty.

    I believe his 2009 cap number was over $4 million; his salary was $3.25 million. That's a lot to devote to the team's 4th LB (assuming Draft slides back over to starting SAM linebacker w/ Laurinaitis' addition in the middle), and the Rams still have to find money (and possibly cap space) to sign their rookies. Plus, there may be other veterans released or available that could be enticing at areas where they'll likely contribute more.

    Pisa, IMO, was basically a WILL linebacker. He doesn't have the versatility of a Chris Draft or Will Witherspoon, and with Witherspoon shifting to the weak side, Pisa was basically doomed to a back-up role. After Pisa failed to hold up physically during his previous stint on the strong side, I was not very confident in him doing it this year, and it seems the coaches also were not wowed by him in that alignment during minicamp since he's been released.

    To those who are saying, "Couldn't we have traded him for a pick?" I would respond by asking, do you not think the Rams tried? Do you honestly believe that the Rams didn't have some kind of feelers out in the league to see if anyone was going to bite on Pisa? Let me also ask you this - if no one in the league was going to trade for Torry Holt or Orlando Pace, what makes you think they're going to give up compensation for Pisa Tinoisamoa?

    Draft will be a package player and will come off the field in passing situations. He's versatile enough to sub in for Laurinaitis @ MLB or Witherspoon @ WLB if they need it. Those two will see more snaps, and rightly so, because they're talented players who can stay on the field in passing situations. The Rams also have some youth at the position in Vobora, Chamberlain, and Culberson. So even without Pisa, the Rams have six linebackers, including three starters, not including a possible camp standout who could challenge for a back-up spot if necessary.

    With those six guys already penciled in, the Rams may feel they can't justify over $4 million against the cap for a back-up player. I have a hard time seeing that as an unreasonable position to take. And who knows, they could possible add another veteran as the season draws near if they feel they need it. Surely that vet will cost less than $4 million against the 2009 cap.

    I love the fire and passion and work ethic Pisa brings, but if this coaching staff and front office feel Pisa is too expensive to carry on a defense where he may not be a schematic fit, it's hard for me to argue otherwise at this point. Here's hoping he goes to a team that values speed and athletic ability over size and strength, and continues to have a good career.

  3. #33
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post

    Wha-wha-whaat!?!?!

    Wow. I am very surprised by this move. Given that this essentially leave the Rams with only six LBs (Witherspoon, Laurinaitis, Draft, Culberson, Vobora, Chamberlain), I've got to believe that the Rams have their eyes on a veteran.

    Napoleon Harris? Nate Webster? Dontarrious Thomas? Jason Babin?

    Someone else? Another trade?

    I'm perplexed.
    How about Larry Grant?
    he has some good measurables. He played with james at the ohio state university.
    Was he any good shower beers???

  4. #34
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    Sure. Let's cut our top tackler from last year. Sounds good.

    And if this is a cap thing, I will be interested to see where those savings go.
    Oh well........In DeSpags We Trust.
    This is nuts!

    I've said in other threads that I would ride the Devaney/Spags train and trust them.

    Well my trust is wearing thin.

  5. #35
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Quote Originally Posted by laram0 View Post
    This is nuts!

    I've said in other threads that I would ride the Devaney/Spags train and trust them.

    Well my trust is wearing thin.
    Why? because we've lost a bunch of games? oh wait no, we haven't played yet. They get the offseason free of questions IMO. If any of us knew more about these players then Spags or Devaney then we would be making a living from football, not wishing we could make a living out of football

  6. #36
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    It strikes me as interesting (and a little amusing) that before this happened people spent alot of time saying they didn't like Pisa or weren't sure how he'd fit into the team. Then he gets cut and it's like someone shot the family dog.

  7. #37
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    maybe there`s some sort of hawain curse on him like there is supposed to be on Keanu Reeves after his father killed a sacred animal or something...

    although he has been a stand out for us at times..if you look at when we drafted him..our team has been goin downhill ever since..im not saying he`s to blame but like i said, maybe there`s some sort of curse and now he`s gone the curse will go too...

    *just a whole lot of bourbon drinking and wishful thinking....*

  8. #38
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Damn this is a shocker, not because pisa is gone just that they did it so fast. Someone finally realized hes overpaid and not very good. I thought we would get rid of him next year just because we need depth at the moment for our LB's, but that doesn't make this a bad move. I'm excited to see vobora and culberson. Spags probably watched a little tape on pisa and realized this guy can't shed a block,"how the hell can i put this guy in". I'm really going to miss his tackles after 8-10 yard runs. damn he was bad.


    I LOVE DESPAGS!!!!!!!!!!!!

  9. #39
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    This is no suprise for me.We are in the process of rebuilding and with a player of his small stature (220ibs) and earning such a big contract, coupled with his less than stellar play. He had to be replaced.

    This is a good sign for me. One that all good coaches i believe would do.
    Pisa was a true warrior whilst with the rams and should find a niche with another organisation somewhere. Just not this one.

    A lot of his tackles were not upfield enough for me, it could be argued that the Offenses we faced intentionadly run at Pisa, taking advantage of him in the run game.
    Lets hope SPAGS already has a player in mind
    Hopefully hes on the roster now, but I doubt it.
    Dont be angry Ram fans, just keep fingers crossed.

  10. #40
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    ...You know it HAS to be a money issue...
    The fact is we DON'T know that it was a money issue. It could have been a health issue, an attitude issue, or any other issue that this new staff perceived. We may never know. Generally speaking, these things don't just hit us out of the blue. When a team is shopping their leading tackler, somebody usually sniffs it out and reports it. It certainly is an interesting move. Especially from a depth standpoint.

    As with the draft, I will trust in the judgement of our new FO and Coaching Staff.
    That's my story, and I'm sticking to it!!

  11. #41
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Being the leading tackler of a 2 & 14 team doesn't say much to me. He is not a Pro-Bowl LB. He has always been a tweener who played hard. Many of the treads on this board have pointed out who the team needs to get bigger everywere. Is this a shocking move, just depends if you overvalue him as a player because you like him. Ultimately, the defence needs to be upgraded and no one should have been thinking the were not replaceable.
    "I was the originator of smack. Some guys rattle with smack; with other guys it rolls right off their shoulders like nothing. "
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  12. #42
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Wait, so there was a market to trade Brian Leonard but no market for Tinoisamoa? I'm not buying that.

  13. #43
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    From Mike Sando's NFC West blog on ESPN:
    Cutting Tinoisamoa continues Rams' roster churn

    May 8, 2009 1:33 PM

    Posted by ESPN.com's Mike Sando

    The Rams' decision to release linebacker Pisa Tinoisamoa reduces his 2009 salary-cap charge from $4.257 million to $2 million. The move also reflects a continuing roster overhaul under general manager Billy Devaney and head coach Steve Spagnuolo.

    The team announced the move Friday.

    Rams linebackers now include: James Laurinaitis, Will Witherspoon, Chris Draft, Quinton Culberson, K.C. Asiodu, Chris Chamberlain, David Vobora, Larry Grant and Dominic Douglas.

    The move pretty much affirms Laurinaitis, the team's second-round choice, as a likely starter in 2009. Laurinaitis ran with the third team during the post-draft camp, but the Rams took a similarly conservative approach with first-rounder Jason Smith as well. I wouldn't read much into how they lined up in that camp. Looking at the roster, it's tough to find anyone likely to beat out Laurinaitis based on what we know so far.

    Witherspoon and Draft will presumably be the other starters. Draft has played the middle this offseason, but it's unclear how each position will shake out in the short term. We can expect additional roster moves as the Rams determine which players best fit into the new systems on both sides of the ball.
    And from Jim Thomas...
    Updated: St. Louis Rams release Pisa Tinoisamoa
    By Jim Thomas
    St. Louis Post-Dispatch

    Coach Steve Spagnuolo likes bigger linebackers, and one thing Pisa Tinoisamoa lacks is size. The Rams have released the veteran linebacker, who led the team in tackles last season with 135, but really doesn’t fit into Spagnuolo’s overall vision for the defense at 220 pounds.

    With the move, Chris Draft likely will move over to man the starting strongside linebacker position and second-round draft pick James Laurinaitis becomes the starting middle linebacker.

    “This was a difficult decision based on a lot of factors,” Spagnulo said in a statement released by the team. “I have a great deal of respect for Pisa and wish him all the best.”

    Tinoisamoa, 27, was a second-round draft pick by the Rams out of Hawaii in 2003. That season, he became the first rookie in franchise history to lead the team in tackles. He registered 121 stops for the Rams’ 2003 NFC West division championship squad. He also led the squad in stops in ‘04 (with 145) and ‘05 (with 134).

    At his best, Tinoisamao played with speed and passion. He could go sideline to sideline, and wasn’t afraid to take on blockers _ be they fullbacks or 330-pound blockers. But he had a tendency to overrun plays, and while willing, frequently would get wiped out by those bigger blockers.

    Hand, knee, shoulder, elbow, and ankle injuries struck in ‘06 and ‘07, forcing Tinoisamoa to miss 12 of 32 games. But he stayed healthy last season, playing all 16 games for the fourth time in six NFL seasons.

    Tinoisamoa was scheduled to be an unrestricted free agent following the 2006 season, but five games into that campaign he signed a $24.7 million contract extension through 2011. This coming season, TInoisamoa was scheduled to make a base salary of $3.25 million and count $4.25 million against the cap.

    Releasing him frees up $2.25 million in cap space. Once they sign their rookies and pay off some incentives and escalators that kick in on other contracts, the Rams would have been tight against the cap prior to Tinoisamoa’s release.

    Tinoisamoa basically became a man without a position when the new coaching staff decided to switch Will WItherspoon from middle linebacker to Tinoisamoa’s weakside linebacker spot earlier this offseason. With Laurinaitis and Draft in the middle that left only the strongside position for Tinoisamoa.

    The strongside position frequently requires the linebacker to take on tight ends, and at 220 pounds, Tinoisamoa is far from ideal size for that role.

    Barring the addition of another veteran in free agency, the Rams are paper thin at the position, at least in terms of proven talent. Current backups Larry Grant, David Vobora, Chris Chamberlain are fringe players. Quinton Culberson opened the 2008 season at strongside linebacker, but played poorly and was replaced by Draft in the lineup after just three games.
    It must've been a combination of his salary and Pisa not fitting into Spag's system for whatever reason. Devaney has said that we want to get bigger on defense and Pisa was playing linebacker in a safety's body.

    I'm gonna miss Hawaii 5-O. He was always one of my favorite players. I'm glad he'll get a chance to start somewhere else in the NFL.
    Last edited by evil disco man; -05-08-2009 at 04:07 PM. Reason: added Jim Thomas article

  14. #44
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    Quote Originally Posted by Milan View Post
    Wait, so there was a market to trade Brian Leonard but no market for Tinoisamoa? I'm not buying that.
    Apparently, nobody was buying Pisa.

    The difference is that Leonard had a small cap #, while Pisa's cap # was significant.

  15. #45
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    Re: Pisa no longer a Ram ...

    This isn't all that shocking. He was undersized and like JimThomas said his exuberance would get the best of him by overrunning plays on occassion.

    He may been the most expensive 4 LB in the league and that sealed his fate.

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