Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 37
Like Tree5Likes

Thread: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

  1. #1
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    The media loves a running QB.

    So do the fans.

    Give them a Michael Vick, a Tim Tebow or... the most recent example, an RGIII, and they can't get enough.

    But, riddle me this, Batman... how many running QBs have won the Super Bowl?

    Let's define the term first.

    I'm not talking about "mobile QBs" who can scramble a bit or move their feet well in the face of a pass rush. I'm talking about QBs who, when pressured, will tuck the ball and run, or who have running plays frequently called for them.

    The QBs who have had the most success in the big game... Starr, Bradshaw, Montana, Aikman, Brady... none of them were or are running QBs.

    Others who you might find on "best QB" lists... Favre, P.Manning, Marino, Fouts, Brees, Warner... none of them were or are running QBs.

    And, yet... fans and the media always seem to want to declare the latest running QB as the "next wave" of the position.

    In the end, some things just don't change. The QB position is about standing in the pocket and making throws. That's what wins championships.

    Even if the running QBs get the most face time on SportsCenter, its the pocket QBs that bring home the ring.
    Last edited by AvengerRam; -09-16-2012 at 12:59 AM.
    Rambos likes this.


  2. #2
    mark.a is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    33
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Steve Young.

    Joe Montana.

    Brett Favre did not run a whole lot at the end of his career, but he did when he was going to super bowls.

    Of course, a QB needs to be able to throw the ball, that is a given. But the ability to make plays with one's legs, and to be mobile both within and without the pocket, is certainly a plus.

  3. #3
    DE_Ramfan's Avatar
    DE_Ramfan is online now Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2010
    Location
    Indianapolis, Indiana, United States
    Posts
    908
    Rep Power
    15

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Only two "running quarterbacks" I can think of who accomplished anything are Steve Young and Elway and I don't think either of them fall under the category of QBs who run at the first sign of trouble. And both of them are hall of famers because of their arm and not their feet.
    mark.a likes this.

  4. #4
    mark.a is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    33
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by DE_Ramfan View Post
    Only two "running quarterbacks" I can think of who accomplished anything are Steve Young and Elway and I don't think either of them fall under the category of QBs who run at the first sign of trouble. And both of them are hall of famers because of their arm and not their feet.
    Elway is another one. Aaron Rodgers had 356 yards rushing in the year he went to the super bowl.

    Certainly, a QB has to be good at throwing the ball, but the ability to pick up a first down (or even the threat of doing so) and/or extend the play with mobility is a pretty nifty thing for a QB to have in their back pocket. Also, the ability to run plays from a moving pocket, or outside of the pocket (sprint right option, etc) adds another dimension to the offensive game plan, as well as forcing a defense to account for it.

  5. #5
    39WillRunYaOva's Avatar
    39WillRunYaOva is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2007
    Location
    Maryland
    Posts
    538
    Rep Power
    8

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    RG3 isnt a pure rushing QB,he is already as a rookie a better pocket passer than Vick is to this day.He doesnt run at the first sight of trouble,he just has the ability to make,extend plays with his legs.I like this kid i think he has the talent,but when the pressure is on lets see how much he starts scrambling around.The media likes running qbs because they are just a interesting topic,they arent the norm so they get talked bout its just the culture of broadcasting really.But i wont throw RG3 in this category yet he played well within the pocket last week,ill give him this full season before i determine if i considers him a "running quarterback".

  6. #6
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by mark.a View Post
    Steve Young.
    Borderline running QB.

    Joe Montana.
    Not a running QB.

    Brett Favre did not run a whole lot at the end of his career, but he did when he was going to super bowls.
    Favre was never a running QB.

    Of course, a QB needs to be able to throw the ball, that is a given. But the ability to make plays with one's legs, and to be mobile both within and without the pocket, is certainly a plus.
    And if you actually read my original post, you'd realize that this is not a relevant point.

  7. #7
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by 39WillRunYaOva View Post
    RG3 isnt a pure rushing QB,he is already as a rookie a better pocket passer than Vick is to this day.He doesnt run at the first sight of trouble,he just has the ability to make,extend plays with his legs.I like this kid i think he has the talent,but when the pressure is on lets see how much he starts scrambling around.The media likes running qbs because they are just a interesting topic,they arent the norm so they get talked bout its just the culture of broadcasting really.But i wont throw RG3 in this category yet he played well within the pocket last week,ill give him this full season before i determine if i considers him a "running quarterback".
    He ran the ball 9 times in his first regular season game.

  8. #8
    mark.a is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Location
    CA
    Posts
    33
    Rep Power
    0

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Steve Young has the 3rd most rushing yards by a QB, and is first in rushing TD's by a QB. If that makes him a borderline running QB, then perhaps I do not understand your definition.

  9. #9
    IBleedBnG83's Avatar
    IBleedBnG83 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    maryland
    Posts
    144
    Rep Power
    6

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Steve Young was the original running QB. Only two other QB's have more rushing yards, Vick and Cunningham. Anyone who says he is not, has NO CLUE what they are talking about.

  10. #10
    IBleedBnG83's Avatar
    IBleedBnG83 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2008
    Location
    maryland
    Posts
    144
    Rep Power
    6

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    He ran the ball 9 times in his first regular season game.
    What's your point. They took advantage of ONE of his strengths. They rans some of his college plays. They had pistol formations, ran some options. But if you took the time to watch the game, he threw when he could have ran.

  11. #11
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by mark.a View Post
    Steve Young has the 3rd most rushing yards by a QB, and is first in rushing TD's by a QB. If that makes him a borderline running QB, then perhaps I do not understand your definition.
    I guess you don't.

    A running QB is one with the proclivity to run (as opposed to merely having the ability to run).

    Young would tuck and run with some frequency, but I think in the Bill Walsh offense, he was less inclined to run.

    The same could be said about Elway. By the time he won his Super Bowls, his proclivity to run was greatly diminished.

  12. #12
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by IBleedBnG83 View Post
    What's your point. They took advantage of ONE of his strengths. They rans some of his college plays. They had pistol formations, ran some options. But if you took the time to watch the game, he threw when he could have ran.
    Nine runs is a lot for a QB, and certainly suggests a proclivity to tuck and run. My point, however, was that we have one game of data, which is hardly enough to reach a conclusion regarding what type of QB RGIII will be in the long run. Right now, based upon his college proclivities and his first game, I'd call him a running QB.

  13. #13
    Rambos's Avatar
    Rambos is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Cali
    Age
    50
    Posts
    8,963
    Rep Power
    74

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    I don't know if RG3 is a running QB or a pass first QB. I do know if he keeps running that option he will be missing time due to the extra punishment he takes.

  14. #14
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,492
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Quote Originally Posted by IBleedBnG83 View Post
    Steve Young was the original running QB. Only two other QB's have more rushing yards, Vick and Cunningham. Anyone who says he is not, has NO CLUE what they are talking about.
    Actually, you're the one without a clue. Young and Cunningham ran for a lot of yards, but that was due, in part, to their longevity. Their pass to run ratio was fairly comparable (Young 4.75 to 1, Cunningham 4.53 to 1).

    The QBs I identified as running QBs (by my definition) have much lower pass to run ratios:

    Tebow: 2.07 to 1
    Vick: 3.52 to 1

    We have one game of data for RGIII, but his ratio in that game was 2.88 to 1. We'll see if that continues to be the trend or not.

  15. #15
    Nick's Avatar
    Nick is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Morgantown, WV
    Age
    31
    Posts
    19,300
    Rep Power
    153

    Re: QBs run for chatter, stay in the pocket when it matters.

    Seeing nine rushing attempts in the box score might lead someone to believe Griffin has a propensity for taking off and trying to run it himself when pressured, but what happened with Griffin on the field doesn't, IMO.

    This is a case where the stats don't tell the whole story, because many of those runs were designed run plays or Griffin trying to recover from a botched play, which doesn't fit the description of a quarterback dropping back to pass and running when pressured.

    Someone on YouTube has actually spliced together every play involving Griffin, pass or run, into a convenient eight-minute video:



    After watching the entire thing, I count only two plays that appear to be a designed pass play in which Griffin drops back and then decides to run it himself. That doesn't seem like a lot at all, at least not to me.

    In fact, it's worth pointing out that, on a third down play in the second quarter, Griffin bought time by running to the side and nearly crossed the line of scrimmage to take off and run for a clear first down, only to stop himself, reset his feet, and complete a pass to Santana Moss down the field for 27 yards. He actually displayed the exact opposite of tucking and running at the first sign of pressure; he bought time and bypassed a chance to run in order to make a good throw down the field.

    I agree with the primary argument being made in the thread - historically, it's the "pocket passers" who are consistently among the best and most successful in the league, and while "running quarterbacks" are exciting to watch, throwing the ball downfield has always been and likely will remain the quarterback's best route to success.

    Having said that, in the case of RGIII and his Week One performance, his inclination seems to be to stay behind the line and pass the ball, as many of his rush attempts were actually by design and not an example of a quarterback bailing on a pass play to run the ball himself.
    ClanRam ModCast: Episode Two
    Rams Discussion Right at Your Fingertips!



Page 1 of 3 123 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Replies: 28
    Last Post: -06-26-2012, 02:11 PM
  2. Chatter in the DC area
    By Dominating D in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 76
    Last Post: -09-20-2009, 09:11 PM
  3. Pocket Guide
    By RAMMAN68 in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -09-28-2006, 03:45 PM
  4. Bulger swaggers in pocket
    By RamWraith in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: -09-08-2005, 06:41 PM
  5. new ClanRam Chatter Room
    By RamDez in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 10
    Last Post: -07-15-2004, 09:42 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •