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    RamsFan16's Avatar
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    Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks
    Wed, 21 Sep 2005 10:44:21 -0700

    Jim Thomas, of the St. Louis Post-Dispatch, reports the St. Louis Rams and rookie OL Richie Incognito remain far apart on contract terms. Incognito, the team's third-round pick, is seeking a market deal, but the Rams are offering a signing bonus about $117,000 less that the market on a three-year deal for a player taken in the same slot. St. Louis says they cannot afford a market deal that Incognito is seeking, because they do not have enough money available in their rookie cap to do so. Incognito remains the only player from the 2005 NFL Draft unsigned.

    ----------------------

    Maybe we took this guy to high up.

    RamsFan16

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    ReedleyRam is offline Registered User
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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Definately!

  3. #3
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    I disagree it was worth the risk and they do have options by back loading the contract with performance incentives according to his agent. The Rams rarely do that though so it will be up to them if they want to give him what he wants which is the chance to earn what the going market is through incentives.

    I am interested in this topic so thanks for the post. However we did not make a mistake drafting him this high because this guy would have been first round material if he was playing before the draft and we never would have had a chance for him in the 4th round. He has a lot of upside and even number one picks can be risky ask Cleveland. It will be a let down if we don’t sign him but I won’t be upset with the FO for drafting him. If anything I would be upset that they drafted him 3rd round and thought they could pay him less then the position he was drafted at. Maybe they could have managed their rookie pool money better and then they could have paid him the going rate. Yes he was injured but he fell to that position because of that and you cant expect to get some one cheaper then the position you draft them at.

    I am not going to say they were wrong for drafting him and I am not giving up on them signing him until its done deal that they no longer have exclusive negotiating rights. They still have about 7 months to work this out.

    Thanks again for the update RF16.

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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    ` They'd bettere sign him...IMPO he's probably the best Oline man in the draft this year!............MM and company get it done!

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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    We NEED O-LInE HeLP !!

    No two ways about it. Our Interior line is old and on the weak side. If this guy reenters and becomes a player elsewhere... You get my point.

    We can't be throwing away draft picks.. We have too many needs..

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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Richie may have been one of the best O-lineman in this draft, but that's (1) largely based on some opinions, not a general concensus, and (2) might not transfer to his play after injury.

    If he doesn't want the deal the Rams are offering, let him enter back into the draft. I think the 2006 offensive line class is probably better than the one we saw in 2005, so chances are Richie could be had on the second day, or we could pick up someone else to help out.

    I believe Incognito has a fair point about wanting the Rams to include incentives to make his contract closer to market value, but the Rams are probably thinking to the future in this situation as well. If they give in to giving a third-round pick a contract that contains incentives, then future players' agents will have an open door to demand that kind of thing in the future, even if the situation is different.

    Besides, let's not split hairs about Incognito. He may be a great potential talent, but he has injury concerns, has been out of football for discipline problems, and now has some contract dispute history under his belt. Maybe the Rams are gauging if this is the kind of attitude they want in their locker room, as well.

    We'll see what happens. I won't be screaming at the top of my lungs if he doesn't sign, but it would be disappointing since we spent a third rounder on him.
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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Quote Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN
    I disagree it was worth the risk and they do have options by back loading the contract with performance incentives according to his agent. The Rams rarely do that though so it will be up to them if they want to give him what he wants which is the chance to earn what the going market is through incentives.

    I am interested in this topic so thanks for the post. However we did not make a mistake drafting him this high because this guy would have been first round material if he was playing before the draft and we never would have had a chance for him in the 4th round. He has a lot of upside and even number one picks can be risky ask Cleveland. It will be a let down if we don’t sign him but I won’t be upset with the FO for drafting him. If anything I would be upset that they drafted him 3rd round and thought they could pay him less then the position he was drafted at. Maybe they could have managed their rookie pool money better and then they could have paid him the going rate. Yes he was injured but he fell to that position because of that and you cant expect to get some one cheaper then the position you draft them at.

    I am not going to say they were wrong for drafting him and I am not giving up on them signing him until its done deal that they no longer have exclusive negotiating rights. They still have about 7 months to work this out.

    Thanks again for the update RF16.
    How was it worth the Risk? We could have gotten a good player thats healthy with that pick and we might have wasted a pick on him in the 3RD ROUND
    RamsFan16

  8. #8
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Quote Originally Posted by RamsFan16
    How was it worth the Risk? We could have gotten a good player thats healthy with that pick and we might have wasted a pick on him in the 3RD ROUND
    How was it worth the risk?
    How often does a player who is drafted hold out for a full year? Maybe .01%. They did not know when they drafted him that they could not sign him that was probably the last thing from their mind. So you knew when we drafted him that we could not sign him. I think I recall you talking about how good he would be if we signed him.

    I would not have taken him 2nd round but to get a guy in the 3rd round that is potential 1st round material think about it. Besides if we had got someone who was healthy in the 3rd round would you expect him to start right away? None of our other picks are. Might have wasted a pick is a big MIGHT. We have a lot of time left before we lose exclusive negotiating rights.

    He is just now nearing 100% healthy we all knew this was his time line when we drafted him. You your self was pretty excited at the time. Man how quick we are to give up on people.

    So you have already declared this pick a bust before even seeing what happens with negotiations.

    Okay but if he signs you might be eating some crow.
    Last edited by STLRAMSFAN; -09-24-2005 at 10:33 PM.

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    tanus is offline Registered User
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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    i agree, the pick was worth the risk. the FO has no excuse to not sign him.

  10. #10
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Just found a little more info its older but may add a little more insight thought I would share.

    How he got hurt
    Nebraska's Richie Incognito, who projects as a center, ran a group-leading (lead all OL) 4.9 in the 40-yard dash that left coaches and executives buzzing. But later in the afternoon during some individual drills, Incognito caught his foot on the RCA Dome turf and apparently suffered a knee injury. Incognito, who left the Cornhuskers with one year of eligibility remaining, apparently had to be carted off.

    Unusual Dispute
    By Mark Maske
    Washington Post Staff Writer
    Tuesday, August 23, 2005; 5:21 PM

    It's highly unusual for a third-round draft pick still to be unsigned at this point in the summer, but that's the case for Rams center Richie Incognito.
    The Rams have offered Incognito only a $411,000 signing bonus as part of a three-year contract even though his draft slot dictates that he should receive a $528,000 signing bonus in a three-year deal.
    Jack Scharf, Incognito's San Antonio, Tex.-based agent, has offered to allow the Rams, who don't have room under their rookie salary cap to sign Incognito to a market-value deal, to make up the difference with incentives and escalator clauses. Scharf also has proposed, as an alternative, a five-year deal that voids to three seasons, enabling the Rams to squeeze a full-market-value signing bonus for Incognito beneath the cap. But the Rams have replied that they don't use such mechanisms in contracts for rookies that aren't first-round picks.
    The problem can be traced back to Incognito, who played at Nebraska in college, suffering a knee injury at the NFL scouting combine in Indianapolis in February. He was hurt pretending to be a defensive player in a "mirror" drill for offensive linemen. Incognito re-injured himself at his campus workout for NFL talent evaluators and was told by Birmingham orthopedist James Andrews that he needed to undergo surgery for a patellar subluxation.
    The Rams were interested in Incognito all along and, according to Scharf, were given regular updates on his condition. Exactly when Incognito will be able to play remains uncertain, but it could be as soon as a little more than a month into the regular season. Part of the Rams' offer was to guarantee Incognito a $135,000 salary for this season if he's unable to come back and play.
    Scharf says it's possible that Incognito will sit out the season and re-enter the draft next year. Scharf's partner, Jeff Griffin, was able to reach a contract agreement with the Rams for the team's second-round draft pick, Howard University cornerback Ronald Bartell. These discussions may have reached an impasse, however.
    One of the interesting aspects of the case is that Incognito's injury technically is categorized as a "non-football" injury--meaning the Rams aren't obligated to pay him his salary this season, under NFL rules--because it didn't occur during a game or practice. Scharf said that could have a chilling effect on draft-eligible players working out at the combine, as scouts and general managers annually urge agents to convince their clients to do.
    "They say if the players don't work out," Scharf said, "it's a waste of their time. . . . [But] this kid didn't go home and get hurt riding a motorcycle. The combine is a function put on by the NFL." . . .
    Last edited by STLRAMSFAN; -09-24-2005 at 11:58 PM.

  11. #11
    Tony Soprano's Avatar
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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    DOUBTS ABOUT INCOGNITO, read this:

    In spite of many of those problems, a number of teams thought highly enough of him to consider selecting him early in the draft. That is, until he injured his knee at his Pro Day within weeks of the draft.

    That injury scared off more teams, but not St. Louis, which made no secret of its preference for Incognito. Incognito will have his surgery done by Dr. James Andrews in Birmingham, Ala. on Thursday and is expected to miss three or four months.

    On the positive side, it would be difficult to find a more physical, tough player than Incognito in the entire draft. One Rams’ scout referred to Incognito as a female dog (in a good way) because of the way he relentlessly competes on the field.

    Martz said there is no doubt about Incognito’s desire to succeed.

    “Sitting out a year and having some of the problems that he had and of course the injury probably put his value down somewhat in the draft, but when you put the tape on and you look at him…this is a guy we are very excited about,”

    Martz said. “He will captivate you. He is very, very physical and very athletic offensive lineman. He is very tenacious. He plays with an attitude. He doesn’t block, he tries to hurt you. I kind of like that.”

    Source = http://www.stlouisrams.com/article/48345/

  12. #12
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Post Re: Status of Incognito

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by RamJackson39
    I really hope he heals well. From what I've seen, he is going to be an amazing O-Lineman.
    RF16
    I agree. He sounds like he is a great player if he is healthy
    Post Re: This Years Draft Class

    Originally Posted by dgr828I
    Can't Wait To See Alex Barron And Richie Incognito In Action.
    RF16
    I don't like Incognito. He admited to steroids.

    Post Re: Incognito last draft pick to be unsigned
    RF16
    What a waste of a pick. God dang it
    RF16
    I know but we should have waited till next year.
    RF16
    Yes UNDRAFTED FREE AGENT we could of maybe got him for. But if he can't play till next year this was a waste
    Quote by Tony Soprano
    I know Incognito is injured.. I know, but there were some experts that thought this guy was the Best O-Lineman in the draft. His injury dictated his draft position.
    RF16
    I didn't know that. THat changes my whole perspective now. Jeeze its a good idea that we took him then.

    Post Re: Len Pasquarelli with the lastest on Richie Incognito
    RF16
    Jeeze if he goes back into the draft I'm going to be poed

    Post Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks
    RF16
    Maybe we took this guy to high up.
    RF16
    How was it worth the Risk? We could have gotten a good player thats healthy with that pick and we might have wasted a pick on him in the 3RD ROUND
    Here is a laugher about Barron
    Post Re: Barron's absensce irks Martz (more details on his delay)
    RF16
    Why did we draft this ogar
    We still have 6 months left to negotiate with Incognito RF16 how many more times are you going to flip flop on him.

    Check back with me tomorrow when you are back on the wagon.

    Man I am glad you are not drafting for our needs.
    Last edited by STLRAMSFAN; -09-25-2005 at 01:28 AM.

  13. #13
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    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    The Rams Offered $411,000 For A Signing Bonus, How Much Bonus Is He Getting Sitting Home On His A**.i Wouldnt Give In To Him On Principle Alone, I Would Really Like To See Him In A Rams Uniform Playing This Year, But The Rams Should Stick To There Guns As Far As Incentives Go.

  14. #14
    STLRAMSFAN Guest

    Re: Rams | Incognito, Team Far Apart on Contract Talks

    Every one that was looking to draft him knew the timeline for his return and he is pretty much on that timeline. Everyone knowing that caused him to fall to the position he fell to. He should be paid the money his position dictates. The guy is not holding out trying to break the bank. If they decide they don’t want to pay him more then it’s on them for not paying the rate of the position they drafted at. They may get him to sign for less then his position but no team should ever expect to draft a guy and pay him less then guys that get drafted after him.
    Last edited by STLRAMSFAN; -09-25-2005 at 01:56 AM.

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