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  1. #31
    Azul e Oro is offline Registered User
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by txramsfan View Post
    Flozell Adams you can keep off any Rams list. He has a harder time with the snap count than Barron does.
    LOL..too true,tx, and he's paid a gazillion more.

    Not to mention I'd have a hard time calling him Flozell to his face without laughing & getting my skull crushed.

    Sounds like one of the rabbit characters from Watership Down.


  2. #32
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by Fargo Ram Fan View Post
    The DEFENSE has been among the worst in the leage for the last 4-5 years. To pass on a potential difference maker like Curry for a reach at OT (when OP is still serviceable)would be INSANE. Keep OP and/or get your OT with the 2nd rounder. Pass on Curry and this team remains (deservedly so) a laughing stock on defense...and saddle up for ANOTHER long season.
    Are you saying the success of the Ram's next season is entirely in the hands of of a draft choice that has never played a down in the nfl?

  3. #33
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by HornIt View Post
    I don't agree with your premise that if Pace goes, the Rams are forced into drafting an OT with the 2nd overall pick.

    No they're not.

    I'm looking at both Super Bowl teams last year. Who were their LT's? They aren't high dollar, big name guys.

    And how much better was Pace last year than Goldberg in his two starts at LT? I didn't notice any real difference. In fact, the Rams actually won one of the only two games they won without Pace and played their best game of the season overall. Pace simply isn't the same player he once was. He's not a difference maker. But for some reason, I think he is in many people's minds, which is why they can't let go.

    Why is keeping him at a hefty salary critical? There are other options than paying an aging, often injured player who's delivering mediocre performances $8 - $9 million dollars. Sliding Baron over there and seeing what he can do is an option.

    Again, he started 14 games last season. The Rams lost 13 of them. What exactly is there to be afraid of here?

    The sooner the Rams start playing other players there, the sooner they're likely to find and develop the future at that position.

    Didnt the Rams also lose 14 games with Pace out an entire year in 07? I don't think you can guage this teams success solely on Pace. I do notice a difference when Pace is on the left side. I notice that Bulger was getting killed from up the gut not from the edge. How many more players are we going to get for Pace's 6 mil we free up? Also if we wait untill the 2nd round to draft a tackle and move Barron to the left side which most people can't satnd Barron playing right. Who is good enough in the second round that they will plug right in at right or left tackle and perform better than Pace??? I understand you can't guage a tackle solely on sacks but you have to admit it does matter. He is still in the top 10 when it comes to sacks given up. Sure Pace isnt the same guy he was 4 years ago but he's still pretty damn good. So he isnt a difference maker anymore, but a rookie will be even if he comes in the later rounds? Sure we could get lucky and get one of those guys that is drafted low but turns out really good. I'd rather roll the dice with Pace fore one more year.
    Just Fix It

  4. #34
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    To me, letting Pace go is a no brainer ...

    Free up that cap space, draft a potential LT in the draft, let him play the RT slot, plug Barron in at LT from the start, and see what he can do over there ...

    Barron could be a true stud waiting to bloom at LT. He played their in college. Who knows how he could perform with an entire offseason to prepare under his belt ...

  5. #35
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    Wink Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    And yet I still want Curry...

    does this make me a bad person?

  6. #36
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser View Post
    Didnt the Rams also lose 14 games with Pace out an entire year in 07?
    Not to quibble, but they lost 13 games in 07'. And therein lies the point. Is Pace a difference maker? Not anymore he's not.

    So what's the point in paying him like an elite LT for one more year when you can start building something new now? If this team is 8-8 next year we should all be ecstatic. So what good does it do to keep Pace for a rebuilding year when he's NOT going to be a part of the future?

    Let's get on with it. Give some new people playing time there. Start figuring out the puzzle now without these older, unreliable, overpaid players. They will be better for it two years down the road if they do. I think they believe that too, which is why Pace appears to be on the way out.

    The Rams have waited too long as it is to part with both Pace and Holt. They should have done it when they would have still brought some good value in trade, when some other team valued them at their current prices as you do Pace.

  7. #37
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    I'm sorry but I do not think we will have a better offensive line with Pace gone. Your removing a decent piece and replacing it with a bad piece in Barron. That is a negative move. That means we aren't getting better. On the right your replacing a bad piece with an unproven piece. That could be a positive or negative move. Even if its positive Bulger's blind side is still getting jacked. I'd rather have a proven vet that knows all his wily tricks then Barron who can't get a snap count down or a rookie who has played left tackle for all but three years( J. Smith).

    Oh did I mention I'm a Curry fan? I also kind of like Pace

  8. #38
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by C-Mob 71 View Post
    I'm sorry but I do not think we will have a better offensive line with Pace gone. Your removing a decent piece and replacing it with a bad piece in Barron. That is a negative move. That means we aren't getting better. On the right your replacing a bad piece with an unproven piece. That could be a positive or negative move. Even if its positive Bulger's blind side is still getting jacked. I'd rather have a proven vet that knows all his wily tricks then Barron who can't get a snap count down or a rookie who has played left tackle for all but three years( J. Smith).

    Oh did I mention I'm a Curry fan? I also kind of like Pace
    Yep, you're right. Let's let Pace anchor the left side of our line for two more years, two more years while we are rebuilding, and just when we are ready to contend, we'll go off and find a new left tackle ...

  9. #39
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by RamsInfiniti View Post
    Yep, you're right. Let's let Pace anchor the left side of our line for two more years, two more years while we are rebuilding, and just when we are ready to contend, we'll go off and find a new left tackle ...
    I guess thats where our differences apply, I think we can contend next year and make a run for the playoffs- not just rebuild. I'm not ready to throw in an unproven player or an unqualified player at one of the key positions of our football team. I just don't think that will be an upgrade over OP at any point in his career.

    I am not against drafting an o lineman, in fact I'm all for drafting a tackle in the second round if the value is there. Then in two years that second rounder can come in and contribute. Contribute to a team who just won the Super Bowl

  10. #40
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    It's easy to want to blow up the team, and start rebuilding from every position, but it simply cannot work that way. If you want to build any sort of chemistry and momentum towards the future, pieces needed to be replaced in small doses, not all at once. In that vein I feel we should keep Pace on board, because while he's certainly not the mauler he once was, finding an immediate replacement is pretty much impossible at this point, and that's a position that a team cannot afford to "get around to".

  11. #41
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by McKnight View Post
    The Titans Blew up their roster in 04 and it seemed to work Ok for them. the titans cut...Derick Mason..Eddie george..Samari Rolle..Andre Dyson. my point is it only took 3 years for them to be competitive again. every situation is different, but I think you can be successful after blowing up the roster. it will just take time.
    You're right about that, but all those players were playing positions where the average player breaks down and begins to lose natural ability quicker than that of an offensive lineman. Perhaps the Titans thought that they weren't quick enough to compete anymore, or in the case of Eddie George, his feet had simply worn down to nubs. The point being that o-lineman historically can play their position with productive results, for longer periods of time. And if we can keep an Orlando Pace on our squad while we're rebuilding, I think we're a better team for it, although I'm not ignoring Pace's injury history, but that's not for me to decide.

  12. #42
    Azul e Oro is offline Registered User
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    "finding an immediate replacement is pretty much impossible at this point"

    So what about Jake Long, Sam Baker, Clady? All rookie starting LTs last year that played well.

  13. #43
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by Azul e Oro View Post
    "finding an immediate replacement is pretty much impossible at this point"

    So what about Jake Long, Sam Baker, Clady? All rookie starting LTs last year that played well.

    Yes, but all 3 of those guys were drafted in the first round. Releasing Pace creates a hole. Why create a hole and have to take a tackle with our first pick? To me it makes no sense. Release Pace free up cap space and then draft the exact same position to use that money on. Keep Pace and let him keep that six million and fill a hole that already needs to be filled like linebacker or DT, or even wr. Create a hole save 6 mil fill then hole with said six mil. Keep Pace and fill a bigger hole and find a replacement for Pace next year. We are trying not to have to use our first pick on a OT.
    Just Fix It

  14. #44
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Well, we could keep going forever on this ,rammiser, because I think we have a fundamental disagreement on a couple of things:

    a) You think Pace is still a good value/bet as starting LT for 16 games (maybe more!) next year at 9 mill. I don't. Believe me, my heart wishes it were so but my head & eyes won't let me. Just an opinion,of course.6 million gets you a lot more than one player in 1 yr's salary cap terms as well.

    b)"We are trying not to have to use our first pick on an OT."

    I think we are trying to make our team better for next year AND the longterm by using our opportunity -hopefully the last time in a long while-of picking in the top 10 to greatest advantage, weighing the need/talent/ importance/cost/overall financial investment in certain players/positions.OT is a legit option,not a reach. We only have two OTs with starting experience on the roster right now. Both are suspect for different reasons.The hole is there, whether we like it or not.

    If that means ,per DeSpags, taking Curry or Crabtree or whomever,then I'm fine with it. I think we are in good hands for once.But I'll be very concerned if an OT isn't taken in the first or second.

    But to say that we keep Pace because anyone taken lower than our 1st rounder won't be a starter is not based on fact.

    Gaither-5th rd supplemental draft, Ugoh 2nd,McNeill-Chargers 2nd,Trueblood-Bucs 2nd,Barnes,et al
    Last edited by Azul e Oro; -03-09-2009 at 12:53 PM.

  15. #45
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    Re: Rams “trying like hell” to trade pace

    Quote Originally Posted by Azul e Oro View Post
    "finding an immediate replacement is pretty much impossible at this point"

    So what about Jake Long, Sam Baker, Clady? All rookie starting LTs last year that played well.
    But are they at the point that Orlando Pace is right now? I'd hope you say no. I'm not saying there aren't good players to be had in the draft, I'm just saying that I think it's unwise to dump a talent like Pace if we don't have to, and we can still rebuild our team in the process.

    Also, for every Long, Baker and Clady, there's a Chris Williams, Gosder Cherilus and Duane Brown.

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