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Thread: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post


    Givens is pro-ready, he'll be starting day 1. Quick also has no choice but to start. If he doesn't, than 1) The Rams will get RIPPED for going on with another season providing s*** all for Sam, and 2) Quick obviously wasn't the right choice at #33.
    Can you answer a few questions please:

    WR is one of the tougher transitions to make from college to the NFL normally receivers breakthrough in their 2nd or 3rd year. What makes Givens so pro-ready?

    Also you said Steve Smith is a 1 year wonder (even-though his yards per catch are 11.4, 11.0, 11.3 each of the last 3 years); how do you justify Givens being so pro ready when he too only had 1 good year?

    Do you really care how the Media "rips" the rams? As much negative speculation the team will get Fisher and Co. need to put the best receivers that get the most separation from NFL CBs out there.

    How does not starting Quick day 1 automatically make him a bust? Do you believe in developing a player or just throwing him in there to see if his raw skills can compete with experienced vets?

    Listen like it or not Quick and Givens havnt proved anything vs. NFL defenses...They have never been thrown to by Bradford...They have never been part of an NFL offensive playbook...I dont see how in the world you just hand them a starting job from what you saw in their college days; they need to earn it


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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by BarronWade View Post
    Can you answer a few questions please:

    WR is one of the tougher transitions to make from college to the NFL normally receivers breakthrough in their 2nd or 3rd year. What makes Givens so pro-ready?

    Also you said Steve Smith is a 1 year wonder (even-though his yards per catch are 11.4, 11.0, 11.3 each of the last 3 years); how do you justify Givens being so pro ready when he too only had 1 good year?

    Do you really care how the Media "rips" the rams? As much negative speculation the team will get Fisher and Co. need to put the best receivers that get the most separation from NFL CBs out there.

    How does not starting Quick day 1 automatically make him a bust? Do you believe in developing a player or just throwing him in there to see if his raw skills can compete with experienced vets?

    Listen like it or not Quick and Givens havnt proved anything vs. NFL defenses...They have never been thrown to by Bradford...They have never been part of an NFL offensive playbook...I dont see how in the world you just hand them a starting job from what you saw in their college days; they need to earn it
    1) Givens is pro-ready because he is arguably the BEST route runner that came out of this draft (in competition with Blackmon and A.J Jenkins). Routes + 4.39 speed = pro-ready.

    2) Already answered why Givens is pro ready. And Smith caught 107 receptions (11.4 avg), 48 receptions (11.0 avg), and 11 receptions for (11.3 avg). 48 receptions and 11 is not #1 or #2 WR stats, not even good enough for #1 OR #2 on the Rams in 2011 or 2010.. what does that say?

    3) No I couldn't care less about the media, just stating a fact. Agreed that the best WR's need to be out there.

    4) AND PLEASE, PLEASE, FEEL FREE TO GO BACK TO MY POST AND PLEASE HIGHLIGHT WHERE I SAID IF QUICK DID NOT START DAY 1 HE WAS A BUST... PLEASE DO SO, IF YOU CAN, I'LL WRITE A MILLION DOLLAR CHECK TO YOUR NAME.

    What I said was, If he cant start, 1, we would be ripped for taking him, which is true. And 2, he wasn't the right choice at #33, where does that say he was a bust? I'm saying this because we could of had an array of WR's at #33 but we take the guy who cant even crack the starting lineup with 4 WR's who were injured last year, and another rookie?

    Thats hypothetical talk. I like I said 2 times already, think Quick and Givens/Salas start in 2 WR sets, and 3 WR sets its Givens and Quick on the outsides, Amendola/Salas in the slot.
    Last edited by sosa39rams; -05-07-2012 at 12:30 AM.


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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    This is getting quite interesting. Thanks BW, Sosa, et al.

    Good arguments -- as long as they are objective and respectful they keep the subject upbeat. I for one sure look forward to our WR corps this year! Bradford should have a better, more productive year, receivers wise.

    Alexander
    Amendola
    Givens
    Quick
    Salas
    Smith / Gibson


    BGibson >>>>>>>>>> SSmith

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    Last edited by RealRam; -05-07-2012 at 04:17 PM. Reason: Gibson

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    I don't see how Givens isn't on the roster and I certainly don't see him getting left off for Gibson or Pettis. Gibson can't get separation in his routes and has inconsistent hands. Pettis is...well, who knows what he is. He didn't show anything last year. We do know that even if Givens isn't a great WR that 1) he gives us speed that we were lacking last year and 2) he can return kicks. That automatically puts him on the roster over those two guys.

    That all said, if they want they keep six receivers I wouldn't be surprised to see them bring in more bodies.

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    1) Givens is pro-ready because he is arguably the BEST route runner that came out of this draft (in competition with Blackmon and A.J Jenkins). Routes + 4.39 speed = pro-ready.
    So Givens will be the starter because he has 4.4 speed and was successful in running college routes for 1 year?

    Tell me what gives Givens the edge for the starting position over Danario Alexander? DX also has 4.4 speed and he runs NFL routes and has shown he can beat the defense on a number of occasions just ask the SB champ Giants Defense...However DX is four inches taller so if routes and speed is what your looking for why not choose the taller more NFL proven receiver?

    Im not saying Givens wont be successful im just saying week 1 is too optimistic for him to be challenging NFL DBs on a consistent basis.

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    2) Already answered why Givens is pro ready. And Smith caught 107 receptions (11.4 avg), 48 receptions (11.0 avg), and 11 receptions for (11.3 avg). 48 receptions and 11 is not #1 or #2 WR stats, not even good enough for #1 OR #2 on the Rams in 2011 or 2010.. what does that say?
    Well I was mainly basing it on a consistency argument...and no that stat does not sound good for a #1 or #2 receiver but as long as the guy gets open on crucial 3rd down situation which he did often in NY im sure you would not complain. I am anticipating seeing him in preseason to see how well he has recovered


    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    4) AND PLEASE, PLEASE, FEEL FREE TO GO BACK TO MY POST AND PLEASE HIGHLIGHT WHERE I SAID IF QUICK DID NOT START DAY 1 HE WAS A BUST... PLEASE DO SO, IF YOU CAN, I'LL WRITE A MILLION DOLLAR CHECK TO YOUR NAME.
    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post


    Givens is pro-ready, he'll be starting day 1. Quick also has no choice but to start. If he doesn't, than 1) The Rams will get RIPPED for going on with another season providing s*** all for Sam, and 2) Quick obviously wasn't the right choice at #33.
    In the NFL it is so important to chose the right prospects...Either your the right choice or the wrong choice...Either you produce and help the team (right choice) or you dont produce and help the team (wrong choice)

    You have consistently been saying Quick is our starter right now by listing him as our WR1 (do you re-call that or would you like me to go back and highlight it) then you said he has no choice but to start (which is highlighted) and if he does not start he is was not the right choice at #33 (which is also highlighted) So you tell me if a player is not the right choice for an organization is he a gem or a bust?

    Obviously if you are NOT the RIGHT CHOICE (and you said if he doesnt start he is not the right choice) for an organization that means the organization failed to make correct pick which means the pick was a bust for that organization

    We have an experienced coach in Jeff Fisher; I dont even think Kevin Dyson in 1998 (a 1st round 16th overall) pick started week 1...Just because the guy was drafted high doesnt mean he is an automatic starter

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Thoughts on Givens vs. Smith:

    In the years that Smith put up the lower reception totals, he only played in nine games each season. Instead of characterizing him as a one hit wonder, I would characterize him as a role player for most of his career who demonstrated that at least prior to his injury, he was capable of being more than that. Again, with the big IFF...if he returns to past form, I would expect that his experience would give him the edge over Givens. If not, all bets are off. There's not a lot of point in debating Smith's hypothetical health status because we really don't have enough information to gauge where he's at, but IMO best case scenario, he's a solid #2 and worst case scenario, he doesn't even make the team. That's a pretty wide range of possibilities.

    As for Givens, speed and polished route-running are good signs, but you have to think that NFL talent evaluators didn't think he was a pro-ready starter. Otherwise, they wouldn't have passed on him during the first three rounds. That includes our talent evaluators. We passed on him three times in the second round and once in the third. Now most years, there are a few draft surprises, but it'd be betting against the odds to assume that Givens will be one of the few each year who significantly outperform draft expectations in their rookie season.
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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    SE: Gibson, Quick
    FL: Smith, Givens
    SL: Amendola, Salas

    But I think they carry a 7th.....DX if his knee holds up; Pettis, if not.
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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by BarronWade View Post
    So Givens will be the starter because he has 4.4 speed and was successful in running college routes for 1 year?

    Tell me what gives Givens the edge for the starting position over Danario Alexander? DX also has 4.4 speed and he runs NFL routes and has shown he can beat the defense on a number of occasions just ask the SB champ Giants Defense...However DX is four inches taller so if routes and speed is what your looking for why not choose the taller more NFL proven receiver?

    Im not saying Givens wont be successful im just saying week 1 is too optimistic for him to be challenging NFL DBs on a consistent basis.


    Well I was mainly basing it on a consistency argument...and no that stat does not sound good for a #1 or #2 receiver but as long as the guy gets open on crucial 3rd down situation which he did often in NY im sure you would not complain. I am anticipating seeing him in preseason to see how well he has recovered





    In the NFL it is so important to chose the right prospects...Either your the right choice or the wrong choice...Either you produce and help the team (right choice) or you dont produce and help the team (wrong choice)

    You have consistently been saying Quick is our starter right now by listing him as our WR1 (do you re-call that or would you like me to go back and highlight it) then you said he has no choice but to start (which is highlighted) and if he does not start he is was not the right choice at #33 (which is also highlighted) So you tell me if a player is not the right choice for an organization is he a gem or a bust?

    Obviously if you are NOT the RIGHT CHOICE (and you said if he doesnt start he is not the right choice) for an organization that means the organization failed to make correct pick which means the pick was a bust for that organization

    We have an experienced coach in Jeff Fisher; I dont even think Kevin Dyson in 1998 (a 1st round 16th overall) pick started week 1...Just because the guy was drafted high doesnt mean he is an automatic starter
    You're DX argument is LAUGHABLE. This guy 1) will never even be 85% healthy, 2) so far has shown no ability to create constant seperation, 3) drops passes which shouldn't be dropped, 4) can only play 30 plays a game.

    How is that starter material? You know if he is consistently starting that there is definitely something wrong in the WR corps, and that its extremely weak. DX's speed is irrelevant. He doesn't have a great burst, can't plant extremely well, and he is held back from all of this because of his makeshift knee. If he wasn't injury prone? He would have been picked in the top 15 in the draft. I still want to keep him around, a nice situational deep threat, but the chances of him ever catching 100+ passes a season? Very unlikely.

    2) Quick is a starter, like I've said several times. If he cant crack the starting lineup with a WR corps like ours, than he obviously was not the right choice at #33. That high we need someone who will be a great WR. Alshon Jeffery, Rueben Randle, Stephen Hill, and Ryan Broyles were all available at that pick. Ironically, all of those guys will be one of the top 3 WR's on their respective teams (#3 is Broyles, Randle).


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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    Quick is a starter, like I've said several times. If he cant crack the starting lineup with a WR corps like ours, than he obviously was not the right choice at #33.
    While I certainly hope he starts as a rookie, let's say he doesn't, and ends up with poor/mediocre stats as a rookie (like... let's say... 21 receptions, 272 yards and 3 TDs).

    Then, after a year of seasoning, he bursts on to the scene as a second year player and really lights it up (let's say, 119 receptions, 1,781 yards and 13 TDs).

    Would he be the wrong choice at No. 33 then, just because he didn't start as a rookie?

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    While I certainly hope he starts as a rookie, let's say he doesn't, and ends up with poor/mediocre stats as a rookie (like... let's say... 21 receptions, 272 yards and 3 TDs).

    Then, after a year of seasoning, he bursts on to the scene as a second year player and really lights it up (let's say, 119 receptions, 1,781 yards and 13 TDs).

    Would he be the wrong choice at No. 33 then, just because he didn't start as a rookie?
    I sense a disturbance in the force.
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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    We did a lot of work with this kid (Brian Quick), and we're looking forward to developing him. G.M. Les Snead

    Quick will be given time to develop... IMO the Rams passed on a receiver like Randle who is probably more NFL ready due to the level of competition. Quick has the elite measurable if he can reach his potential, he could be a great receiver.

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Looking back, the Titans with Fisher usually operated with 6 WRs.

    I'll be absolutely shocked if Steve Smith makes the Rams roster. Why? He had micro-fracture surgery before the 2010 season and has never gotten back to 100%. They signed him to a 1-year deal with a $1,000 signing bonus.

    IMO, anyone underestimating Salas as a starter on the outside didn't pay attention to how he was playing last year when he got hurt. I would say it's a virtual lock he's a starter at Flanker.
    My prediction is that this roster will rotate in and out constantly and the starters may not end up having the most receptions for their position. Quick, Pettis, Givens and DX may all see considerable time. Pettis had nerve issues it appeared to me, he'll be far better this year if he can get separation.

    * Rumor I heard on Randle was that in interviews, he came off as a class A jerk to such a level teams dropped him way down their boards.
    Last edited by RebelYell; -05-07-2012 at 05:48 PM.

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Im sure the plan is that hopefully Quick picks up enough to be an opening day player and develop into a #1 receiver. But just wanting him to be a #1 wont make it so. Im sure everyones thoughts pre-draft were that Blackmon and Floyd were the only 'probable' WR's in the draft that could be #1's for there respective teams immediately. And i think thats where Smith's value lies, giving Bradford a reliable target to pair with Amendola while either Quick or Givens get upto speed ... IMO. So while i think Smith isnt a viable longterm answer as a #1, if healthy, coupled with the fact Quick and Givens have the normal adjustment to NFL defenses, is our opening day #1.

    Not concerned if Givens, Quick struggle a bit in year 1, as long as they progress as the season goes on and not regress. Thought id have Gibson or DX being cut but decided that Pettis couldnt do it with drug's ... cant do it without.

    1. Smith
    2. Quick
    3. Amendola
    4. Salas
    5. Givens
    6. DX
    7. Gibson - Given the inexperience of the roster, id rather see 7 WR's on the roster.

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    Quote Originally Posted by RebelYell View Post
    Looking back, the Titans with Fisher usually operated with 6 WRs.

    I'll be absolutely shocked if Steve Smith makes the Rams roster. Why? He had micro-fracture surgery before the 2010 season and has never gotten back to 100%. They signed him to a 1-year deal with a $1,000 signing bonus.
    He has to play to get paid so he will give it everything he's got. $1 million base salary

    Steve Smith's one-year contract with the Rams has a $1 million base salary and another $1.5 million available in per-game roster bonuses.
    So it's a one-year, $2.5 million deal theoretically, but none of the per-game roster bonuses are guaranteed. They're valued at $93,750 apiece, and will be paid if and only if he's active on game days. Ultimately, it appears Smith was guaranteed no money on the one-year, prove-it deal. He could conceivably be cut in training camp if Smith fails to show his troublesome knee has healed. Apr 1 - 4:29 PM
    Source: Profootballtalk on NBC Sports
    Smith must feel he's ready to go or maybe it's the only deal he could get....

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    Re: The Rams will probably carry six wide receivers

    To me if Givens speed translates on the field he will be an instant starter. Even if he drops half the balls that get thrown his way teams will have to respect his speed... Remember what that Ravens rookie did to us with his speed and questionable hands? We are (or were i should say) the slowest team in the league so its no way he doesnt see the field unless he is hurt OR his speed is in question. And i have to disagree with the poster who said dx doesnt get seperatiion. When on the field he got the most seperation but couldnt come down with routine nfl catches consistantly.

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