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    RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    RamView, August 24, 2007
    From The Couch
    (Report and opinions on the game.)
    Preseason Game #3: Raiders 20, Rams 10

    The Rams' symbolic glass may be half-full. You'd rather have a bad game now than in September. Tonight, though, the Rams dropped the glass and broke it, poured the drink on the floor and set themselves on fire, laying a rotten egg in Oakland instead of getting in a groove for the regular season. This team is not ready to play the Dillon Panthers in September, let alone the Carolina Panthers. OK, that's the pessimist's take. The realist's take, though, is that this team has a LOT of work to do by September 9th, much more than expected.

    Position by position:
    * QB: Marc Bulger was recently named St. Louis' most eligible bachelor, but he'd probably like to divorce himself from tonight's ragingly inconsistent (8-21-109) performance. He started out great, getting time to throw and delivering his first pass near-perfectly to a diving Isaac Bruce for 39. Unfortunately, the opening drive and many others would bog down with Marc throwing the ball away under real or imagined pressure. Certainly, there were times where Oakland was legitimately harassing Marc, and/or had everything covered downfield, and it's good that Marc threw the ball away rather than forcing one up and getting it picked off. But there were just as many times where Marc threw it away without the Raiders really having closed in on him yet. And he made a lot of goofy back-foot throws without the pressure really being there to force such an awkward throw. Marc Bulger looked for all the world like a rattled QB tonight, and it's troubling to see the starting QB that uncomfortable in the pocket heading into the regular season. It sure looks like Marc could use some more field time. Yes, there were mitigating circumstances. He didn't have Steven Jackson to check down to, or Torry Holt to throw to at all. But you know what? There will be mitigating circumstances every game this regular season, too. For $60-plus million, Marc's got to show better composure than he did tonight. Gus Frerotte (10-18-108) could get a lot more comfortable in the pocket since the #2 line mostly had its way with the Raiders' #2's. Once again he was the only QB to lead the Rams to a QB. He's very smooth, and his reputation as the best backup QB in the league looks deserved to me. I missed Ryan Fitzpatrick's (3-5-27) best play, a 30-yard scramble in the 4th. Unfortunately that was also his worst play, as he fumbled out the back of the end zone. Oakland took over and held the ball the final 8:20.

    * RB: There wasn’t much to learn about the Ram ground game tonight. They passed nearly three times as much as they ran. Steven Jackson was again in for one play and put back into mothballs the rest of the night. This practice is as inexplicable as batting the pitcher eighth. Just leave him on the bench! What is the point? The clear highlight of the night on either side of the ball was the professional debut of the LEONARD LEAP. Brian Leonard (6-20) cut back right at the start of a run in the 1st and vaulted over a Raider defender in the open field en route to a 15-yard gain, to the delight of even the Oakland crowd. Unfortunately that was Brian's only significant gain of the night. If any other back was "featured" this week, it was Travis Minor (6-26), who showed about what Rich Alexis did last week. Good speed; can pick his way through traffic. I'd pick Minor to be the #3 RB, but it's not like I'm ready to start a movement for him or anything.

    * WR: One of the Rams' few bright spots was the play of the ageless Isaac Bruce (4-77). Oakland has one of the best secondaries in the game, and the Rams played without Torry Holt, but they could barely slow Isaac down. He opened the game by splitting two DBs down the sideline and making the 39-yard diving catch of a younger man. He caught a 22-yarder and a couple of short passes in the 2nd to set up the Rams' FG. Drew Bennett (3-37) started alongside Bruce. I thought Bennett was supposed to be the newest deep threat? I'm not seeing it so far. Dane Looker (3-37) got a good long look, and though he dropped a ball he shouldn't have late in the 1st half, it was still important that he got out on the field to show his capabilities as a receiver. Because Marques Hagans (2-17) ain't going anywhere, with another nice catch tonight for the Rams' ONLY TD. Dante Hall (2-27) looked good in a surprising amount of action at WR. The game plan again barely called on the TEs, though Joe Klopfenstein did contribute a false start and a drop.

    * Offensive line: Bulger wasn't sacked, and he wasn't hit hard tonight like he was last week. The only sack the line allowed was one of Fitzpatrick in the 4th quarter. Yet the Rams' starting offensive line was one of the biggest disappointments of the night. They created almost no running room. The Raiders got pressure on Bulger almost every pass play. Brett Romberg could not handle Terdell Sands at all, or Tommy Kelly. If tonight was really the tiebreaker for the center position, Andy McCollum won it, as he held firm in the middle of the second unit. Tackle play was VERY disappointing. Alex Barron looked as bad tonight as he'd been good the rest of this preseason. He was completely dominated by Derrick Burgess. And the rare times Bulger didn't feel heat coming from that side, he felt it from Orlando Pace's. Orlando's play this preseason has been nowhere close to his previous standard. He's false-starting, he's getting smoked by even ordinary guys with speed. I hope it's because it's preseason and he's just going through the motions. If not that, Orlando Pace as we've known him is broken. Claude Terrell started at RG for Richie Incognito and flip-flopped with Milford Brown. Brown missed a bigtime block and got Leonard thumped in the 2nd. The twos won their matchup pretty easily in the second half. Unlike Bulger, Frerotte had all night to unload many of his throws. But it's the ones who will face the likes of Julius Peppers, Kris Jenkins, Bryant Young, and Demarcus Ware, among others, the first month of the season, and they do not look ready for the job.

    * Defensive line/LB: Strangely, on a night where one of the worst offenses in the league ran up and down the field like a 9-on-7 drill, the Ram front seven was probably the team's bright spot. Pisa Tinoisamoa may have been the star of the game, JACKING UP Lamont Jordan for a 2-yard loss in the first, forcing a Jordan fumble at the 2 in the 1st to save a TD, and stuffing Jordan at the 10 for a loss in the 2nd, which helped set up a FG attempt that Sebastian Janikowski missed. The Ram defense actually kept this from being a 30-10 or 34-10 game, when you think about it. And if Pisa can deliver this kind of physical play consistently, like he did his rookie season before he broke more of his bones than Evel Knievel, that's a big plus for the Rams D. The Rams delivered four sacks on the night; Victor Adeyanju flushed Daunte Culpepper into James Hall and Cliff Ryan for one in the 1st. In the 2nd, Le'Roi Glover and Claude Wroten stunted and Glover steamed in all alone to sack Josh McCown. Eric Moore clobbered McCown to force a fumble in the 3rd and split the last sack with Jeffrey Dukes in the 4th. The defense stepped up in the turnover department, finally, with the two forced fumbles. Will Witherspoon recovered a fumble and knocked down a pass.
    Unfortunately, that's leaving out a lot of the bending and breaking the Ram defense did. The Raiders ran for 172 yards; there were too many plays where Pisa would lose containment, or Chillar would overplay and leave a big cutback lane, or plays like the Raiders' first run, where Hall and Glover both got pancaked. Culpepper kept a couple of scoring drives alive with scrambles. The Raiders convered 2 of 3 4th downs. Pass rush again wasn't consistent. Adam Carriker wasn't a factor. He had no tackles and seemed to be getting handled one-on-one whenever I iso'ed on him. And they gave up 49 to Jordan on a simple screen to set up a TD right before halftime. Witherspoon looked out of position and cut Ron Bartell off, OJ Atogwe overran it and the Raiders did a good job blocking Tye Hill and Corey Chavous downfield. The defense, especially up front, outperformed the offense, but certainly weren't without their usual flaws.

    * Secondary: The key statistic tonight: FIVE DPI's on the Rams for 127 yards. Some of it looked like crap calls. Tye Hill in particular seemed to be getting called for close coverage more than anything else. But referees seem to have gotten so locked in on whether or not the defender is getting his head turned, little else seems to matter, and Ram DBs need to get that fundamental right. And that includes you, Corey Chavous, and your pathetic DPI in the second. That was some poor veteran play right there. You, too, Unca Fakhir Brown, for your DPI in the 3rd. How are these guys going to cover Steve Smith or T.O. when they can't handle Jerry Porter and Ronald Curry? Chillar committed a DPI the first play of the game and really looked like a liability covering the TE. The door is open there and may be letting in a Draft, no? Though he made other good plays to knock down passes, and I still think his future as a shutdown CB is bright and coming soon, Hill's most likely to be remembered tonight for the Curry TD where he had him all alone in the middle field but slipped off him like he was trying to grab a greased pig, giving up the score. Ron Bartell got lucky on a quick screen to Curry in the 1st, overrunning it but hooking Curry's jersey by a fingernail to stop him for a loss. I'd like to think the secondary would have fared better with a different officiating crew. Guess we won't find out now till September 9th, though I'd certainly rather know sooner.

    * Special teams: Another sorry special teams spectacle was on exhibit in the 4th quarter. Right after the Rams had cut the lead to 20-10, they gave up an 80-yard kick return to Chris Carr. The next time the Rams punted, Johnnie Lee Higgins took it back all the way, but the Rams drew a penalty to take it off the board. We'll have to hope very few of the guys associated with those two fiascoes are actually playing on Rams special teams in September. The Raiders didn't give him much to return, but Dante Hall did bring his only kick return across the 30, which is banner news around here. Jeff Wilkins hit a short FG and his kickoffs were good and deep. Donnie Jones averaged 42.2 a punt, but the Rams did not give him a five-year contract to shank kicks off the side of his foot. He's already had a couple of those this preseason.

    * Coaching/discipline: I guess I really don't understand what Scott Linehan is trying to get out of a preseason game. The Rams are supposed to be a run-first team, yet here they are passing 2 or 3 times as much as they run. They are likely to keep 4 tight ends on the roster, supposedly to become a bigger part of the offense, and they attempt maybe 4 passes out of 44 to them in a game Torry Holt sat out. I'm fine with Steven Jackson getting the LT treatment but really don't understand why he's in for the first play of the game. I'm not fine with the performance of the starting offense. No TDs in three weeks, yet they weren’t sent back out after halftime to work out the bugs, and we'll probably see none of them next week against Kansas City. I'll go on record right now as being against that. Rams Nation doesn't need its offense still trying to find its way the first few weeks of the regular season like it did last year.

    One offensive twist I saw was the recurrent use of the four-wide formation, but with Randy McMichael in the slot. Didn't figure to see much of that this season, and we probably won't; I can't remember the Rams completing a pass out of the formation. On defense, Jim Haslett brought a lot of blitz, and Oakland beat a lot of blitz. Two of the game's big plays, the 49-yard Jordan screen and the Curry TD, both beat blitzes. Haslett was too cute with way too many zone blitzes tonight, too. I root for Leonard Little but I don't need to see him trying to cover wide receivers. And if Haslett blitzes on 3rd-and-14 in the regular season like he did on the Curry TD, I am personally going down to the sidelines and teaching him the fish slapping dance. And I get the big fish.

    So the big question is, how much do you make out of a preseason game? If this were the regular season, it would be definitely time to go to DefCon 1. The offense is badly out of sync, the offensive line can't block and the $60 million QB has gone skittish. The special teams appear to have had their one good game for the year and have gone back to pathetic as usual. The defense had a couple of positives, but they still got moved on by last year's worst offense. Their strategy is open to question. So's their focus, since they had to burn a timeout before the first play of the second half. And you can't be happy with a team that commits 10 penalties for 157 yards and makes the Oakland Raiders look like choirboys in the process with 8-60. Losing the penalty battle to the Raiders is like losing a popularity poll to Congress. Or Michael Vick.

    Then again, the starting offense didn't score a TD last preseason, either. I guess tonight was fine if you're happy to go 8-8. If your aspirations are higher, you deserve to be concerned, but realize there's still two weeks' worth of game plan and personnel changes to take place yet to iron out some of the problems. My opinion is, if we're not supposed to be concerned at all about rancid preseason performances, the NFL shouldn't invite us to watch preseason or pay full regular season fare for it. The league and its teams need to realize somewhere along the line that fans don't want to see their team playing poorly, whatever the venue.

    * Waiver bait: Though it may well be inaccurate, I'll go from the 86-man roster listed at stlouisrams.com and project 11 cuts to get the Rams down to 75 for Tuesday: K Kevin Lovell and P Fred Capshaw since Wilkins and Jones have taken over; QB Brock Berlin since Bulger could use the extra reps; C Dave Pearson, FB Brad Lau, TE Mark Anelli, WR Rasheed Marshall, WR Nate Morton, CB Harrison Smith, T Drew Strojny, and last but not least, RB John David Washington. Particularly with the skill players, it was supposed to be a bad sign if you weren't on the field much tonight. Washington is a shoo-in to make the practice squad, though, so Georgia has an excuse to invite Denzel to games.

    * Upon further review: Pete Morelli's crew sure wasn't reluctant to call long, game-changing pass interference penalties on the Rams, and repeatedly. The Rams were called five times for a whopping 127 yards. Some calls I was fine with, others should have no-calls, with contact going on both ways. And I'm still not sure what Tye Hill even did the first time he got flagged. With all the calls against the Rams, it didn’t seem right that Hagans got mugged on 3rd down in the 3rd without a call, though the Raiders were called for defensive holding away from the play. Barron saved Bulger from certain doom in the 2nd with a blatant hold that was not called. My loudest question is why Higgins wasn't penalized in the 1st for taking off with a punt that he had clearly signaled a fair catch for. In the end I can't give Morelli and company a good grade without being convinced the majority of those DPI calls were calls that had to be made.

    * Cheers: Earlier this week, the Rams announced there were still 1,800 tickets left for the season opener against Carolina. After tonight, that number's probably climbing. Every time Bulger threw a wild pass, or the worst offense in the league last year walked right down the field on the Ram D, I thought, way to sell those remaining tickets, guys! I liked the announcing work of Martin Kilcoyne and D'Marco Farr. They weren't pulling punches about how bad the Rams looked. Farr added a lot to this broadcast with his perspective as a former defensive lineman in illustrating where plays were breaking down or succeeding on the defensive front. I enjoy the analysts best who can be a teacher as well as a mouthpiece, and wish Farr had a telestrator so I could better absorb the info he was pointing out. D'Marco's biggest fault was making too much of a deal out of the Rams scoring in the second half. He made it sound more important for the twos to score than it was that the ones sputtered. The local Fox crew had problems keeping up with kickoffs and didn't seem to display down-and-distance. And Kilcoyne's one fault was that he rarely gave the distance covered by the last play. Fortunately, I was able to keep track of those courtesy of McAfee Coliseum's very loud PA announcer, who intruded all over the televised broadcast. Nice work, fella. Kilcoyne did manage to wait six touches by Justin Fargas before mentioning the inevitable "Huggy Bear" trivia. Good restraint. Some week this regular season when KTVI doesn't buy out remaining tickets to get a game on TV locally, remember that they paid to fly anchorwoman Sandy Miller out to be on the sideline tonight for an interview / infomercial for the new 10:00 news. She's cute, but that was shilling above and beyond the call.

    * Who’s next?: Though I believe the starting offense should be in at least a quarter, it looks for now like the Rams intend to go Scrub City, <sarcasm> flaunting the hallowed tradition of the Governor's Cup </sarcasm>, when they host the Kansas City Chiefs Thursday night. With little of note likely to happen, there's little to preview. For the Rams, the battle for center may still be ongoing, so that could be worth watching. I would like to see the special teams not give up any big plays and for Donnie Jones to go a whole game without yakking one off the side of his foot. Maybe Greg Olson could even call for a throw or two to some of the tight ends? Just wondering. There are also several defensive depth issues left to resolve, so there's something to watch on that side of the ball as well. I for one really need to see a good game out of the secondary to feel good about facing Steve Smith & Co. on September 9th.
    The Chiefs have their own interesting problems. They may not have settled on their starting QB by Thursday night. What I've seen of Brodie Croyle and Damon Huard has been all bad. They just got Larry Johnson in camp; it remains to be seen if they want to expose him in a preseason game. The Chiefs, of all teams, are likely going to be carried by their defense if they go anywhere this year. No, really. They've gotten a lot better on that side of the ball. Not that we'll likely see any of their key players…
    We know this week's game is the most meaningless of the preseason games, even as we struggle to determine what to really make of these glorified scrimmages. Neither the Rams nor Chiefs may even put an Opening Day starter on the field Thursday night. But it's still football (and the game's still full-price); I'll be there. Viva la preseason.

    -- Mike
    Game stats from nfl.com


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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Good job as usual, MFrank! We're all scratching our heads trying to figure out just how concerned we should be as well. I guess we'll find out soon enough.

    Go Rams!!!

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Some of the serious positives that I took away from the game were

    1. Jon Alston is all over the field he had 10 tackles and the energy that he plays with is what will get him on the field. I would not be suprised if Alston became our starting WLB and Pisa moves to the SLB.

    2. The young DTs. Wroten looks explosive and powerful against the Raiders starters and Carriker and Ryan looked great against the run on one play they both pancaked the OL across from them.

    3. Brian Leonard is going to be exciting to watch.

    4. TE Aaron Walker is going to get Dom Byrd cut in a hurry he is huge and can catch.

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    TEs, though Joe Klopfenstein did contribute a false start and a drop
    Yep he is looking sad...Walker is looking better to me every week, he blocks and catches the ball.

    Nice post... Keep them coming you have a short week we play Thursday.

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Apparantly Bulger isnt the only starting QB that is "skiddish" during this pre-season. Bulger is fine, It's pre-season and the same statements were being made of him last year in a thread that has been posted again if your interested in reading over it. All the same sky is falling crap was also spewed in that thread. We finished 8-8 and can you honestly say this team did not improve it's personell this off season? Check out these numbers 10-19 145 yds and 1td 2int's, that was Brady last week. 7-10 for 40 yds and 2 int's, that was Pennington last week. 11-18 for 122yds and 1 int, that was Romo's stat line last week. 4-8 for 47 yds and 1 td 50% completion percentage, guess who that was? That was Culpepper last night, not exactly tearing our d to shreds right? Heres another stat line for you, 18 carries for 41 yds and a td, 2.3 yds per carry. Guess who that was, you guessed it that was Lamont Jordan. We can't hang our hats on the preseason because if we are I'll take those stats for our defense in every game because we wont get called for 6 Pass interferance calls. It was a poor performance score wise but did our defense really play that bad? I dont know about you but I'll take 2.3 yds per carry and 50% completion ratio all day long. It was pretty obvious to me that Incognito is a very important part of the o-line because the interior looked like swiss cheese without him. I'll take my chances in a regular season game with Holt,Jackson,Bulger,Bennett,Mcmichael, and Leonard over the Raiders any day. They can have the pre-season wins and stats because it means NOTHING. I can't give an honest judgement of this offense in pre-season let alone a pre-season game where 3 very vital parts of our offense dont play. If you took the Raiders best rb and best wr and best guard out of their offense last night how good would they have looked, because with them they still only managed 2.3 yds per carry and a 50%completion ratio with all their starters. Bulger is not skiddish or squeamish or he doesnt have happy feet. He has a condition called "PLMMITPSIF", this is a very contagious condition that strikes many players during the pre-season. It is "Please Let Me Make It Through Pre-Saeason Injury Free" and can be very harmful to pre-season performance. Some people perform when it matters and Bulger has a track record of performing just fine. Now we are looking at his stats in pre-season or how he looked and wondering??? Not me Bulger is fine and when we BEAT the Panthers in week one everyone will see that pre-season means NOTHING!
    Just Fix It

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Quote Originally Posted by Country View Post
    Some of the serious positives that I took away from the game were

    1. Jon Alston is all over the field he had 10 tackles and the energy that he plays with is what will get him on the field. I would not be suprised if Alston became our starting WLB and Pisa moves to the SLB.

    2. The young DTs. Wroten looks explosive and powerful against the Raiders starters and Carriker and Ryan looked great against the run on one play they both pancaked the OL across from them.

    3. Brian Leonard is going to be exciting to watch.

    4. TE Aaron Walker is going to get Dom Byrd cut in a hurry he is huge and can catch.
    I agree almost 4 for 4. I meant to mention Claude Wroten, I also thought he played well. All indications are they'll keep 4 TEs so I'm guessing Walker and Byrd are both safe, but I also think Walker's ahead if they would keep only 3.

    --Mike

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser View Post
    Apparantly Bulger isnt the only starting QB that is "skiddish" during this pre-season. Bulger is fine, It's pre-season and the same statements were being made of him last year in a thread that has been posted again if your interested in reading over it. All the same sky is falling crap was also spewed in that thread. We finished 8-8 and can you honestly say this team did not improve it's personell this off season? Check out these numbers 10-19 145 yds and 1td 2int's, that was Brady last week. 7-10 for 40 yds and 2 int's, that was Pennington last week. 11-18 for 122yds and 1 int, that was Romo's stat line last week. 4-8 for 47 yds and 1 td 50% completion percentage, guess who that was? That was Culpepper last night, not exactly tearing our d to shreds right? Heres another stat line for you, 18 carries for 41 yds and a td, 2.3 yds per carry. Guess who that was, you guessed it that was Lamont Jordan. We can't hang our hats on the preseason because if we are I'll take those stats for our defense in every game because we wont get called for 6 Pass interferance calls. It was a poor performance score wise but did our defense really play that bad? I dont know about you but I'll take 2.3 yds per carry and 50% completion ratio all day long. It was pretty obvious to me that Incognito is a very important part of the o-line because the interior looked like swiss cheese without him. I'll take my chances in a regular season game with Holt,Jackson,Bulger,Bennett,Mcmichael, and Leonard over the Raiders any day. They can have the pre-season wins and stats because it means NOTHING. I can't give an honest judgement of this offense in pre-season let alone a pre-season game where 3 very vital parts of our offense dont play. If you took the Raiders best rb and best wr and best guard out of their offense last night how good would they have looked, because with them they still only managed 2.3 yds per carry and a 50%completion ratio with all their starters. Bulger is not skiddish or squeamish or he doesnt have happy feet. He has a condition called "PLMMITPSIF", this is a very contagious condition that strikes many players during the pre-season. It is "Please Let Me Make It Through Pre-Saeason Injury Free" and can be very harmful to pre-season performance. Some people perform when it matters and Bulger has a track record of performing just fine. Now we are looking at his stats in pre-season or how he looked and wondering??? Not me Bulger is fine and when we BEAT the Panthers in week one everyone will see that pre-season means NOTHING!
    I'm cool with that. It'd also be fair to mention Oakland's defense re Mark's game last night; the Raiders have one of the top D's. I don't believe preseason scores and stats are completely unimportant. I don't think the current team can totally blow off preseason the way the 2000-02 Rams could, or like the Colts do now. I do try to be more concerned about how the team looks vs. their numbers, and they didn't look sharp last night. I was expecting better, maybe that's where I went wrong. If they had won 20-10 and played shaky, I would have said about the same thing. If they lost 20-10 and played well, I would have painted a different picture. Either way, I'm fully aware there's a couple of weeks left to work out the bugs, which I mentioned. I'm not saying, and didn't say, to expect it, but I think we'd both agree things won't work well if Marc's game against Carolina is like the one he had tonight.

    --Mike

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    I thought the write up was pretty accurate with respect to the state of season readiness for the Rams.

    When the season starts and your starting lineups set with Jackson and Holt in there with Bruce - you should be able to run and pass the ball like you did last year. On the defense side you have some really good players.

    I have a question - was it that the Rams played poorly or that the Raiders are not the same team from last year?

    They have actually improved especially on the offensive side of the line. Most agree they have a top 3 defense and have improved on the front line with its run stoppers.

    The offensive line has talent - poor coaching last year that has been replaced with very good coaching especially on the line. That was noticeable when the Rams pulled an all out blitz that was pretty much picked up long enough to allow Culpepper to drop of a check down pass to Curry for their 1st TD. Again in the 2nd qtr when your 1st team defense was still out on the field a 43 yard screen pass that had O-Lineman down field blocking. Their 1 st line has given up only 2 sacks so far both came Friday night against the Rams

    Friday night was a good test for your team and Oakland as well. Each team saw what it was doing right and what it still needs to work on to get ready for opening day.

    Good Luck to you guys this year. I would rather see you take your division than the Seahawks.
    Last edited by Twisted-Panther; -08-26-2007 at 10:40 AM. Reason: typos

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    I have a question - was it that the Rams played poorly or that the Raiders are not the same team from last year?
    Both teams are not the same... Raiders needed a win any win they can get.

    One stat that will change is the amount of times the Raiders go for it on forth down.We stopped them countless times on third down and they went for it on 4th, from anywhere on the field. I guess they do not need work on punt coverage.

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    The key statistic tonight: FIVE DPI's on the Rams for 127 yards. Some of it looked like crap calls.
    It also seemed like the Raider secondary had a lot more leeway when it came to defending the pass. Not crying foul, but it did seemed skewed in their favor.

    Could it be the old White gloves on white jersey vs White gloves on Black jersey?

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Quote Originally Posted by Twisted-Panther View Post
    I have a question - was it that the Rams played poorly or that the Raiders are not the same team from last year?
    I think we just had a poor showing and a few really bad calls by the refs. Culpepper didn't look too bad out there, but it wasn't like he was making great throws or the receivers were making spectacular grabs. Our secondary had a bad day, and we didn't do well when the QB started to scramble.

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Some interesting takes on the game.

    What I find the most interesting have been the ones regarding the perceived favoritism by the refs towards the Raiders with respect to penalties and how they were called.

    Think about it, when has the league ever shown the Raiders any favoritism in calling penalties in their favor? So, why would they start with this game? Could it be that those penalties actually occurred and that the Raiders are actually getting better?

    When it comes to getting wins your right the Raiders need them but at 0-3 thats not a very good way for the Rams to be heading into the last pre-season game with. Winning is contagious it has to start somewhere how does a team learn to win in the regular season if it can't win in pre-season?

    Again with 4th down conversions, I agree your not going to see any team in the league try it 6 times in one game. The up side is practice makes perfect the Raiders were 4-6 that means the Rams could not stop them 66% of the time. That does not translate well for the Rams going into the regular season - thats why teams practice - hopefully your coach and staff will see this and get it worked out when it actually mean something, especially against the Seahawks.

    Peace Out

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    I think Hill's third pass interference call was warranted and probably so was the one on Chillar, but I just couldn't see what the problem was on the other two on Tye Hill even after the replays. On the first call, the receiver pretty clearly pushed off and the penalty was called on the cornerback. I mean Tye Hill is a little guy who relies on his speed. He's not a very physical corner, and it just didn't look like he was doing anything...but the refs would still throw the flag every time the ball went his way.

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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Quote Originally Posted by Twisted-Panther View Post
    Some interesting takes on the game.

    What I find the most interesting have been the ones regarding the perceived favoritism by the refs towards the Raiders with respect to penalties and how they were called.

    Think about it, when has the league ever shown the Raiders any favoritism in calling penalties in their favor? So, why would they start with this game? Could it be that those penalties actually occurred and that the Raiders are actually getting better?

    When it comes to getting wins your right the Raiders need them but at 0-3 thats not a very good way for the Rams to be heading into the last pre-season game with. Winning is contagious it has to start somewhere how does a team learn to win in the regular season if it can't win in pre-season?

    Again with 4th down conversions, I agree your not going to see any team in the league try it 6 times in one game. The up side is practice makes perfect the Raiders were 4-6 that means the Rams could not stop them 66% of the time. That does not translate well for the Rams going into the regular season - thats why teams practice - hopefully your coach and staff will see this and get it worked out when it actually mean something, especially against the Seahawks.

    Peace Out

    You would have to see the pass interferance calls and make your own judgement. Several of them were pretty sketchy. As for the Rams being 0-3 in pre-season not that it matters at all they are actually 1-2, we beat the Vikings with our scrubs. Like i said before the pre-season counts for nothing except staying healthy. Others have their own opinions but even Orlando Pace said it's pre-season and without Jackson in there this is a different team. We were crappy in pre-season last year too and we were what 1 win from making the playoffs. The pre-season doesnt translate to regular season especially when 3 of you starters dont play (Holt,Incognito,Jackson).
    Just Fix It

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    Twisted-Panther is offline Registered User
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    Re: RamView, 8/24/2007: Raiders 20, Rams 10 (Long)

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser View Post
    You would have to see the pass interferance calls and make your own judgement. Several of them were pretty sketchy. As for the Rams being 0-3 in pre-season not that it matters at all they are actually 1-2, we beat the Vikings with our scrubs. Like i said before the pre-season counts for nothing except staying healthy. Others have their own opinions but even Orlando Pace said it's pre-season and without Jackson in there this is a different team. We were crappy in pre-season last year too and we were what 1 win from making the playoffs. The pre-season doesnt translate to regular season especially when 3 of you starters dont play (Holt,Incognito,Jackson).
    Actually - I'm curious if we watched the same game - what do you call when a DB has his hands on the other teams players Face Mask? or what about when a DB physically interferes with the WR"S path to get the football while the ball is in the air (I thought it was actually funny that he ran up to the ref with his hands up saying what did I do). You must have missed the one where the DB was holding Porter's shirt with his off hand (on replay you can actually see Porter shirt pulled away at least 5 inches).

    Personally, I wish Jackson had played - it would have served as a better bench mark as to where the Raiders run defense stands and Holt might have helped out your passing game against the Leagues #1 pass defense.

    I understand the defensiveness of the responses - but fact is fact - I still wish the best for the Rams and think you guys will do well this season - good luck

    Peace Out
    Last edited by Twisted-Panther; -08-26-2007 at 07:22 PM.

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