The REAL facts about Marc Bulger, and one opinion

[btimsah]

Sure there is. Adults use words like "poor" to intelligently discuss a player's performance. Children who are unable to do so fall back on comments like "Bulger sucks."

Nobody had a problem saying Linehan sucked. In fact it was mandatory, wasn't it?



Just kidding...

[RamsInfiniti]

Its not how good your stats look that win games.

Really? I was under the impression that some genius once said that "Stats Don't Lie" ....

So, since all that matters is winning games, can we safely say that Dan Marino and Warren Moon weren't actually great quarterbacks?

[ScottD413]

For what it's worth, I don't think the inaccuracy was so much as Bulger not hitting his spots, it was moreso the younger receivers not being where they were supposed to be ...

Those routes in those Martzian types offenses must be run very precise, as the QB is throwing to a spot. Hard to tell which was more at fault ...

FWIW ....

Marc Bulger is the 19th highest rated passer in NFL HISTORY ...

Marc Bulger is 5th in yards per game in NFL HISTORY ...

Marc Bulger is 68th in completions in NFL HISTORY despite being 86th in attempts, a testament to his accuracy ....

Marc Bulger is 12th in completion percentage in NFL HISTORY ...

Marc Bulger has the 26th lowest INT percentage in NFL HISTORY ...

Marc Bulger has the 37th highest YPA in NFL HISTORY ...

Marc Bulger's 17 come from behind victories are 13th most in NFL HISTORY ...

For those who don't get it, NFL HISTORY means EVERY QB that has ever played the game with a qualifying number of pass attempts ...

I agree that these are fine stats, but they are a little deceiving. The game has changed so much and when you talk about all time statistics, you have to take that into account. For example, lets look at the yards per game list:

1. Kurt Warner
2. Peyton Manning
3. Dan Marino
4. Drew Brees
5. Marc Bulger
6. Jay Cutler
7. Carson Palmer
8. Daunte Culpepper
9. Brett Favre
10. Dan Fouts
11. Trent Green
12. Warren Moon
13. Tom Brady
14. Drew Bledsoe
15. Jim Kelly
16. Jim Everett
17. John Elway
18. Donovan McNabb
19. Aaron Brooks
20. Jon Kitna
Some great names up there, but also some poor ones. I mean come on, do you really think that Aaron Brooks or Daunte Culpepper are elite QB's? Of course not, yet here they are in the top 20. Likewise, you would be hard pressed to find somebody who would tell you that Bulger is a better QB than John Elway or Johnny Unitas.

I don't think Bulger sucks. I'm just pointing out that sometimes stats can be deceiving.

[RamsInfiniti]

I agree that these are fine stats, but they are a little deceiving. The game has changed so much and when you talk about all time statistics, you have to take that into account. For example, lets look at the yards per game list:

1. Kurt Warner
2. Peyton Manning
3. Dan Marino
4. Drew Brees
5. Marc Bulger
6. Jay Cutler
7. Carson Palmer
8. Daunte Culpepper
9. Brett Favre
10. Dan Fouts
11. Trent Green
12. Warren Moon
13. Tom Brady
14. Drew Bledsoe
15. Jim Kelly
16. Jim Everett
17. John Elway
18. Donovan McNabb
19. Aaron Brooks
20. Jon Kitna
Some great names up there, but also some poor ones. I mean come on, do you really think that Aaron Brooks or Daunte Culpepper are elite QB's? Of course not, yet here they are in the top 20. Likewise, you would be hard pressed to find somebody who would tell you that Bulger is a better QB than John Elway or Johnny Unitas.

I don't think Bulger sucks. I'm just pointing out that sometimes stats can be deceiving.

No one knows what Culpepper would have been had injuries not raped his career ...

Brooks is the exceptioin ....

And you only chose one stat to look at. I doubt QB rating is deceiving at all, or YPA, or INT% ....

[ScottD413]

No one knows what Culpepper would have been had injuries not raped his career ...

Brooks is the exceptioin ....

And you only chose one stat to look at. I doubt QB rating is deceiving at all, or YPA, or INT% ....

Sure they are. Here's QB rating:

1. Steve Young+ 96.8 1985-1999 2TM
2. Peyton Manning (32) 94.7 1998-2008 clt
3.Tony Romo (28) 94.7 2004-2008 dal
4. Kurt Warner (37) 93.8 1998-2008 3TM
5. Tom Brady (31) 92.9 2000-2008 nwe
6.Philip Rivers (27) 92.9 2004-2008 sdg
7. Joe Montana+ 92.3 1979-1994 2TM
8. Chad Pennington (32) 90.6 2000-2008 2TM
9. Drew Brees (29) 89.4 2001-2008 2TM
10.Ben Roethlisberger (26) 89.4 2004-2008 pit
11.Daunte Culpepper (31) 89.0 1999-2008 4TM
12. Carson Palmer (29) 88.9 2004-2008 cin
13. Jeff Garcia (38) 87.5 1999-2008 5TM
14. Jay Cutler (25) 87.1 2006-2008 den
15. Otto Graham+ 86.6 1946-1955 cle
16. Dan Marino+ 86.4 1983-1999 mia
17. Trent Green (38) 86.0 1997-2008 4TM
18. Donovan McNabb (32) 85.9 1999-2008 phi
19. Marc Bulger (31) 85.6 2002-2008 ram
20. David Garrard (30)

Top 20 all time. David Garrard? Jeff Garcia? Chad Pennignton? Where's Elway? Or Unitas? Or Waterfield? Or any number of HOF Qbs not included on this list? There are many, many, many elite all time great QB's that don't appear, yet some less than wonderful names are present.

the YPA list is skewed too because players didn't throw the ball down field nearly as much as they do now.

Again, I don't think Bulger sucks, but stats are deceiving when including players from an older era.

[RebelYell]

Historical numbers for what Marc was able to put up 5 years ago really don't have an impact on his current performance. If that were relevant, the Rams would have been fine with Trent Green being the quarterback last year. Sadly, Trent Green was done in 2006. The Rams aren't winning any games this year based upon what a QB did in 2005.

[RamsInfiniti]

Historical numbers for what Marc was able to put up 5 years ago really don't have an impact on his current performance. If that were relevant, the Rams would have been fine with Trent Green being the quarterback last year. Sadly, Trent Green was done in 2006. The Rams aren't winning any games this year based upon what a QB did in 2005.

The true relevance of the statistics is shown against the argument that "Bulger sucks, and he always has" ....

This is the route the arugment usually ends up taking, or at minimum, what it implies ...

[RebelYell]

Well that's just silly. Marc was a top 5 QB in the league at one time. Sadly, that really hasn't been the case since Martz left.

[rammiser]

Its amazing how success blinds people and lack of success causes people to blame one guy. Bulger "sucks" according to some seems to be a theme around here. Just wondering if the Rams had won the superbowl last year with the stats Bulger posted would people still say he sucks? If you answered yes to that question then I guess Ben Roethlessburger sucked last year too. That's right their stats are almost identical last year but Big Ben is on a far suprerior team. This is a team sport and Big Ben had team support and Bulger did not. Then again maybe its just all those intangibles that Big Ben has that Bulger doesn't that won the superbowl. Success keeps people from seeing bad qb play. Big Bens season as far as stats go were not very good but they won the Superbowl so no one notices. Bulger's team goes 2-14 with very similar stats and Bulger sucks, go figure.

[btimsah]

Its amazing how success blinds people and lack of success causes people to blame one guy. Bulger "sucks" according to some seems to be a theme around here. Just wondering if the Rams had won the superbowl last year with the stats Bulger posted would people still say he sucks? If you answered yes to that question then I guess Ben Roethlessburger sucked last year too. That's right their stats are almost identical last year but Big Ben is on a far suprerior team. This is a team sport and Big Ben had team support and Bulger did not. Then again maybe its just all those intangibles that Big Ben has that Bulger doesn't that won the superbowl. Success keeps people from seeing bad qb play. Big Bens season as far as stats go were not very good but they won the Superbowl so no one notices. Bulger's team goes 2-14 with very similar stats and Bulger sucks, go figure.

Hmm.. If we were able to win the Superbowl with Bulger throwing 11 touchdowns and 13 interceptions, well we'd have an incredible defense, running game and a patriots like filming staff providing us with behind the scenes video preparing us for every game. .... lol

[rammiser]

Hmm.. If we were able to win the Superbowl with Bulger throwing 11 touchdowns and 13 interceptions, well we'd have an incredible defense, running game and a patriots like filming staff providing us with behind the scenes video preparing us for every game. .... lol

So Big Ben throwing 17 td's and 15 int's is that much better lol, none of you haters will ever back down amazing. Those are Superbowl winning qb stats lol. Big Ben had 600 more yds and 6 more td's and also played 1 more game. Big Ben's stats are amazing though and Bulger sucks lol.

[maxxdigger]

here the dif between the two last year only. Big Ben made the big plays when they were needed bulger did not thats the only dif that you can compare. If the rams Defense was like the stealers the fans would still be upset about marks play last year. But we probaly would have won alot more games.

Mark is a system QB he always has been maybe he can make it out of his current funk and lead this team, Maybe not time will tell.

I am guessing that only people on here think Big Ben had a great year last year, Because the guys at nfl network think he was below average in the regular season, But he carried his team to a superbowl win. They all agree on that

[btimsah]

So Big Ben throwing 17 td's and 15 int's is that much better lol, none of you haters will ever back down amazing. Those are Superbowl winning qb stats lol. Big Ben had 600 more yds and 6 more td's and also played 1 more game. Big Ben's stats are amazing though and Bulger sucks lol.

I am surprised that Big Ben was that bad and still won, but at least he had more TD's than INT's..

That is still an amazing stat and says a lot about Pittsburgh's defense. See. I backed down. But Bulger is still toward the bottom of the league as far as I'm concerned., but perhaps (sigh) he can turn it around this year.

[RamsFanSam]

But Bulger is still toward the bottom of the league as far as I'm concerned., but perhaps (sigh) he can turn it around this year.

So you are finally admitting that this is strictly your OPINION, and is NOT A FACT.

Will you now quit trying to claim that your opinion is something other than an opinion? Avenger has presented facts to prove that your claim that Bulger is one of the worst QB's in the NFL is clearly false, and has presented facts to prove that he is not the greatest QB. He is what he is: A QB who, with the right circumstances, can show flashes of greatness; and a QB who, in less than favorable circumstances, can fall flat on his face.

Let me repeat that last sentence:

He is what he is: A QB who, with the right circumstances, can show flashes of greatness; and a QB who, in less than favorable circumstances, can fall flat on his face.

This is why I am tired of those who keep on with the "Bulger sucks" crap year after year. I know I am not the only one.

[RebelYell]

So you are finally admitting that this is strictly your OPINION, and is NOT A FACT.

(That sentence you repeated for us works for every QB in the league so how is it special for Bulger?)

Since you demand facts, what are the facts that prove to you that Bulger is a far superior QB to the stats he delivered the last two seasons? I'm not concerned about what he did 5 years ago, I'm not concerned about excuses for what the offensive line might have been, what are the facts right now that prove Bulger is at least average as a starting QB in the NFL?

The reality is that facts are extremely difficult to provide to prove this point. The stats show Bugler is a declining QB. You can give excuses but those excuses do nothing but give you hope that a turnaround is possible. They aren't proof of fact.

Any player assessment is based mostly on opinion and estimation (opinion) of the talent around the player and historical performance and how that translate to the future. So to demand only facts is rather silly. Did the Rams draft Smith based solely upon facts or the opinion of scouts, their opinion of what he could develop into and their opinion of his character?

In the 1999 playoff game against the Vikings it was my opinion the game was over when Jeff George fell down and was later sacked because he perceived pocket pressure that did not exist. It was my opinion that if a QB is that worried about getting hit, he's done. On the radio yesterday they asked D. Farr if Bulger is able to escape pressure in the pocket at this point or does he just fall down (how would he have handled the Superbowl pressure Eli Manning escaped)? Farr refused to bash his friend but finally admitted defensive linemen know he's an easy sack. Regardless of the offensive line, it was Farr's OPINION that Bulger is more interested in avoiding the hit than making the play. That's an opinion but it is supported by some of the stats.