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  1. #1
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    If Isaac Bruce doesn't finish his career as a Ram, he will have nobody to blame but himself (and his agent).

    The Rams have dealt with Bruce fairly, acting within the confines of the salary cap system. Bruce has made big money during his career, and was, by pure production/salary standards, substantially overpaid last year (even if you factor in his injury).

    Reportedly, he was offered a deal that would have paid him $5 million this year. How is that not a reasonable offer for Bruce at this stage of his career?

    His hardline stance also makes no sense. He's not a 28 year old who will be fielding multiple offers for big money elsewhere. The likelihood is that he won't get a substantially better offer from any team.

    Is this foolish pride? Bad advice from an agent? An overblown notion of the monetary value of seniority?

    It makes no sense. Bruce (and his agent) are wrong on this one.

    Let's hope they turn around and make it right.


  2. #2
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Well said,I agree at the stage of his career he is now in 5million is not a unfair offer,I f he wanted to stay a Ram as much as he lets on,Money would not be the bottom line and in this case it seems that way.

    Its a shame if they dont get something worked out by Wednesday but I have confidence in KC and Mac and Dane Looker will get some well earned playing time.


    :clanram:

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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    In the final analysis, the Rams were unwilling to carry Bruce's 2006 salary cap figure of $10.04 million under his old contract. Under terms of that deal, Bruce was scheduled to make $8.1 million this season, including a $1.5 million roster bonus due on the first day of the league year - that is, the start of the free agency and trading period. Advertisement
    What is he looking for? The last two years he got hurt at some point.

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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Totally agree "AR" his agent is out of control , It he rejected a 3 yr deal for 3 mil , WOW what happened to the good old days where players just wanted to play...

  5. #5
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Its funny I really don't know what I think, its just one of those off seasons and its time to make those tough decisions I suppose, its bussiness!!!!

    steve:clanram:
    "The breakfast Club"

  6. #6
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Unless he really has an agenda that does not include the Rams, it seems a foolish thing to turn up his nose at 5 million. The remark that because the Rams are well under the cap and therefore he should get more, rings hollow as well given the fact that there are so many holes on the D alone. There has been an imbalance in salary in favor of the offense for a long time ... perhaps this is the beginning of a shift toward more balance.


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    ramhard's Avatar
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    Reality - no one should be 'angry'

    It is crazy to be angry at Bruce or his agent. It's always funny when people talk about how a player should take substantially less money to be a 'X' fill in the blanks, when few of us would do so in our own jobs.

    The bottom line is this: Bruce and his agent think that he could get substantially more on the FA market than what the Rams offered. Is that true or not? Only time would tell, but that is what they think. Compounding the issue is that no matter how you put it, they are cutting his 'contracted' pay. We know those figures are funny, but there is still a psychological impact of taking this cut. Not just with players, a recent company purchase I was involved in disintegrated because the owners wouldn't take less than they were offered 2 years ago, even though the company was in worse shape - they anchored on the higher number.

    I still think this will get done, but it is Bruce and his agents right to get more if they can. Especially since this is Bruce's last contract. He'll probably never have an opportumnity to make this type of money ever again, no matter what else he does.

    It is also the Rams FO's right to offer him what they think is a fair contract (and given his tenure with the club - I'd say they should offer him slightly more than fair).

  8. #8
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: Reality - no one should be 'angry'

    Quote Originally Posted by ramhard
    It is crazy to be angry at Bruce or his agent. It's always funny when people talk about how a player should take substantially less money to be a 'X' fill in the blanks, when few of us would do so in our own jobs.
    Right now, I'm self-employed, but if I were working for somebody and they said "take less money or I'm going to have to let you go," and I had no reasonable expectation of making more elsewhere, I'd have to consider it, would I not?

    The bottom line is this: Bruce and his agent think that he could get substantially more on the FA market than what the Rams offered. Is that true or not? Only time would tell, but that is what they think.
    If they think any team will pay him, at his age and coming off a year in which he was injured half the season, more than $5 million, they are the crazy ones.

    It is also the Rams FO's right to offer him what they think is a fair contract (and given his tenure with the club - I'd say they should offer him slightly more than fair).
    I think they already have.

  9. #9
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    In my opinion Bruce has got his pay day several years ago. At some point in career you have play because you want to, and do what is best for both parties. Up until this point I believe we have treat Isaac very fair and he has given some great ball.

    I agree Avenger, the more I think about this, the more it really erks my chain.

  10. #10
    VegasRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Be interesting to know what Bruce has madde over his career, and what he gave up in his last renegotiation.
    "the Heart Lies and the Head Plays Tricks with us, but the Eyes See True".

  11. #11
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Honestly, I fault both parties.

    I believe Bruce and his agent need to realize that while the Rams can afford to pay him the $8.1 million or whatever it is, it's going to hinder how competitive they can be, which is their ultimate goal. He can't expect to get every cent of that contract.

    On the flip side though, I'm still not convinced that a three-year $9 million deal with $5 million in the first year is a great offer. Bruce is due $8.1 million this year, and he's upset that he's losing $3.1 million with the Rams' contract offer. I just don't understand how the organization can't convert more of that difference into bonus spread out over the length of the deal, maybe even another roster bonus next year.

    I dunno, I think Bruce's expectations are unrealistic, but so are the Rams'. Both have ground they can give up, especially if a CBA gets done and the cap expands to $110 million or so.

  12. #12
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    I'm still not convinced that a three-year $9 million deal with $5 million in the first year is a great offer.
    How many WRs at Bruce's age and coming off a down season do you think will be making $5 million this year?

    Bruce is due $8.1 million this year, and he's upset that he's losing $3.1 million with the Rams' contract offer.
    No, Bruce is actually "due" $0 this year. The Rams are not bound by the contract (And, yes, I'm aware that some people think that this is unfair, but that's how the league works. Its all based on bargaining power in the end). So, Bruce is not choosing between $5 million and $8.1 million - that latter number is imaginary. He is choosing between $5 million and whatever some other team will agree to pay him. My guess is that it won't be more than that.

    I just don't understand how the organization can't convert more of that difference into bonus spread out over the length of the deal, maybe even another roster bonus next year.
    Its not a question of whether they can do so, its a question of whether they should do so.

  13. #13
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Well, we disagree on this then, Av. I think both sides could have moved more toward common ground, and I think Bruce is worth more than $9 million over three years. He's not worth $8.1 million this year, but somewhere in between, IMO. And I fault both sides for not being able to move closer to one another to get something done.

  14. #14
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    AV - maybe, but its his right

    AV,

    You said Bruce was crazy thinking he was getting more than $5M. Well a couple of things come to mind. First, its his right to take that risk - he might well get less, but I don't begrudge him for trying. Secondly, I don't know the details of the offer (you might) so it is not just $5M for next year, but how much is guaranteed over the next 3 (the forseeable time that Bruce will play). So even if someone offers him less than $5M but more guaranteed over the next 3 years than the Rams then he will have made more money.

    So while I think $5M might be too high, I think he could get more than the $3 guarantee I understood the Rams were offering.

    Just some data, here are the top paid WR's, the franchise tag amount and the transition amount:

    Wide receiver
    Randy Moss, Minn. $8,630,327
    Marvin Harrison, Ind. $8,082,880
    Isaac Bruce, St. L. $7,640,709
    Eric Moulds, Buf. $7,245,000
    Terrell Owens, Phi. $7,243,333
    Jimmy Smith, Jax $6,349,333
    Derrick Mason, Tenn. $5,802,500
    Muhsin Muhammad, Car. $4,508,117
    Rod Smith, Den. $4,502,928
    Amani Toomer, NYG $4,135,000
    Franchise $7,768,000
    Transition $6,414,000

  15. #15
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    What I wonder is whether the Rams offered Bruce any packages providing a reasonable base salary and some incentives. Certainly, if Bruce could revert back to his 2004 form, he'd be worth starter money.

    If a compromise is going to be worked out, I think incentives is the way to go. I wonder if there is an ego element preventing that, though - the notion that Bruce doesn't think he should have to prove his worth at this stage.

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