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  1. #16
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: AV - maybe, but its his right

    Quote Originally Posted by ramhard
    AV,

    You said Bruce was crazy thinking he was getting more than $5M. Well a couple of things come to mind. First, its his right to take that risk - he might well get less, but I don't begrudge him for trying. Secondly, I don't know the details of the offer (you might) so it is not just $5M for next year, but how much is guaranteed over the next 3 (the forseeable time that Bruce will play). So even if someone offers him less than $5M but more guaranteed over the next 3 years than the Rams then he will have made more money.

    So while I think $5M might be too high, I think he could get more than the $3 guarantee I understood the Rams were offering.

    Just some data, here are the top paid WR's, the franchise tag amount and the transition amount:

    Wide receiver
    Randy Moss, Minn. $8,630,327
    Marvin Harrison, Ind. $8,082,880
    Isaac Bruce, St. L. $7,640,709
    Eric Moulds, Buf. $7,245,000
    Terrell Owens, Phi. $7,243,333
    Jimmy Smith, Jax $6,349,333
    Derrick Mason, Tenn. $5,802,500
    Muhsin Muhammad, Car. $4,508,117
    Rod Smith, Den. $4,502,928
    Amani Toomer, NYG $4,135,000
    Franchise $7,768,000
    Transition $6,414,000
    My understanding is that Bruce was offered $5 million for this season.

    The number you posted really prove my point. Moss, Harrison, Owens, Mason and Smith are (were) being paid #1 receiver money. Bruce is clearly no longer the Rams' #1 receiver (and Holt is being paid #1 receiver money), and is older than most of those players.

    Moulds is on his way out of Buffalo for reasons similar to Bruce's situation.

    The others are being paid less than the $5 million Bruce has been offered.


  2. #17
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    I don't think Holt gets payed that much at all. I heard he doesn't care about that stuff. I totally understand what Bruce is saying with how he doesn't want a pay cut. But this is a pay cut of a few million. He's still making millions from his soon to be over career. I understand a pay cut being a big deal to someone who needs the money that badly. I think its kinda being greedy. A lot of people can't make 1 million dollars in 40 years with an average job. This guy is unhappy that he gets a few million less, its not like he doesn't have money still unless he spends it all, then I guess I understand..


    Always and Forever a fan of the St. Louis Rams

  3. #18
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    What is so exasperating for me is that Ike and the Rams have had a great relationship over the years through thick and thin, and now all of a sudden they can't work out a deal that is fair and equitable? This issue surely must have been discussed in some way over the course of the last year between both parties. How it could get to the point of Ike being cut is beyond me.

    Very disappointing.:tut

  4. #19
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    ...Rams and President of Football Operations Jay Zygmunt are holding out hope that they can get something done with Bruce in the coming days. --NW
    Okay friends, let's start collecting signatures. :angryram:

    Aaaargh! Come on, last L.A. RAM!

  5. #20
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    Re: AV - maybe, but its his right

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    My understanding is that Bruce was offered $5 million for this season.
    Which is fine, but unfortunately for Bruce, there are two other years to consider. And if it's a three year deal worth $9 million and he's making five of it in the first year, that leaves two a year for the remainder of the contract, and that's pretty low no matter how you slice it.

    You can't just look at this and say, "Wow, shame on Bruce for turning down $5 million for 2006" because this wasn't a one year deal.


    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike
    What is so exasperating for me is that Ike and the Rams have had a great relationship over the years through thick and thin, and now all of a sudden they can't work out a deal that is fair and equitable? This issue surely must have been discussed in some way over the course of the last year between both parties. How it could get to the point of Ike being cut is beyond me.

    Very disappointing.:tut
    Agreed, which is one of the reasons I fault both parties. Ike says he's easy, Rams say they want to keep him, yet neither seem to be willing to go close enough to the middle to get it done before the time limit was up. It'll be a shame if something doesn't get done, but you can't just blame one side without blaming the other, IMO.

  6. #21
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by Varg6
    I don't think Holt gets payed that much at all. I heard he doesn't care about that stuff.
    Holt signed a 7 year, $42 million deal in 2003 (he received a signing bonus of about $11 million). He also seems to be getting more endorsement deals than Bruce ever did.

  7. #22
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Holt signed a 7 year, $42 million deal in 2003 (he received a signing bonus of about $11 million). He also seems to be getting more endorsement deals than Bruce ever did.
    What's interesting is the salary breakdown of Holt's contract:

    2003 530000.00
    2004 535000.00
    2005 540000.00
    2006 3850000.00
    2007 4150000.00
    2008 5650000.00
    2009 6650000.00

    Maybe the jump in Holt's salary (a little over three and a quarter million) played a bigger role in the front office's decision than one might have though. Also keep in mind the Rams probably want to sign Curtis long term as well, and you have to wonder how much money the Rams really can devote to the WR position.

  8. #23
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    That is a good point, Nick. You have to think that they have budgets that are position specific, and with Holt getting a base of $3.85 million (plus a share of his bonus against the cap) and Curtis tendered at $1.5 million, they may be near their WR budget.

  9. #24
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    Re: Reality - no one should be 'angry'

    Quote Originally Posted by ramhard
    It is crazy to be angry at Bruce or his agent. It's always funny when people talk about how a player should take substantially less money to be a 'X' fill in the blanks, when few of us would do so in our own jobs.
    This isn't unheard of in business, though. Sometimes when a company is in financial straits, it will provide employees with the choice of either taking voluntary paycuts or preparing for lay-offs. One way of looking at this is to just say this guy has the opportunity to make $5,000,000 in one year doing something he loves. Most of us would jump at the opportunity to be in his shoes. Maybe he could make more somewhere else, but I doubt it.

    I don't have a problem with him wanting to test out free agency, but it is frustrating when a guy has been with you for 12 years and he's still thinking about going to another team on account of money when it seems like the team is offering a fair amount for the abilities he currently still brings to the table.

  10. #25
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    That is a good point, Nick. You have to think that they have budgets that are position specific, and with Holt getting a base of $3.85 million (plus a share of his bonus against the cap) and Curtis tendered at $1.5 million, they may be near their WR budget.
    I would think the bean counters could bend a little on their WR budget for a player like Ike, who is not only still arguably near the top of his game, but a valuable team presence.

  11. #26
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    No doubt. I'm certain there isn't another 30+ WR in the league (or the World, for that matter) who the Rams would offer $5 million to play this year.

  12. #27
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    No doubt. I'm certain there isn't another 30+ WR in the league (or the World, for that matter) who the Rams would offer $5 million to play this year.
    Perhaps they could bend just a little more as opposed to drawing a line in the sand at that $5 million figure.

  13. #28
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    I hope someone draws a $5 million line in the sand in front of me one day.

  14. #29
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    I hope someone draws a $5 million line in the sand in front of me one day.
    You might feel differently if you were Ike.

  15. #30
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    Re: As it sinks in, I'm more and more angry at Bruce (and his agent)

    If you really believe this statement you are sadly mistaken. Everyone in this league cares about what they make. Getting paid is just as much part of the "competition" as the game itself. This my friend is sometimes as much the issue as the money itself. Because in the whole scheme of things. do you think it matters if it is 10 million or 13 million. It's what your neighbor is getting for the same job, only done at a higher standard.

    That my friend is the league bragging rights.



    Quote Originally Posted by Varg6
    I don't think Holt gets payed that much at all. I heard he doesn't care about that stuff.

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