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Thread: Slater V Pace

  1. #1
    majorram's Avatar
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    Slater V Pace

    Will Pace EVER be as good as Slater???? is there anybody in the leaque that reminds you of Slater????

    Who was best Run Blocking or pass protection between Pace and Slater.. Is there any comparison at all ??????between them both...

    For me Slater will always be the best PERIOD, Pace has some ways to achieve that kind of recognition if he can at all....

    thoughts!!!!

    steve :ramlogo:


  2. #2
    general counsel Guest

    Re: Slater V Pace

    Great off season topic Major, i think we should promote you and change your name to colonel ram.

    I have debated this topic with people over and over, must recently in a private exchange with Double Z.

    Its not so much a question of who is "better" but whether there is really any difference between the two. Keep in mind that slater played quite a bit of right tackle at one point, something that pace never did. The big issue on comparing these two is that certain people always cite slaters loyalty in being a career ram while pace has been criticized for the contract situations which thank god are in the past.

    People forget that Slater had NO CHOICE! IE NO FREE AGENCY. We have no way of knowing what slater would have done if he (tom mack vs. timmerman vs. dennis harrah, another great board topic), had the opportunity to leave via free agency.

    I love both slater and pace. Personally, i think Pace is as dominant a pass blocking left tackle as the NFL has EVER had, bar none. Slater, while a great pass blocker, was i believe a better run blocker. In part, slater played mainly for rams offenses that were run based, while of course The Big Man has been part of the greatest show on turf.

    I think that Pace is this generations Slater, especially now that he has signed the long term deal. Time will tell if he has Big Jackies durability (he makes so much more money than jackie ever did you never know if he will even want to play for 20 years), but these two are BOTH hall of fame talents and barring an absolute collapse in Paces play or a terrible injury, Pace will be inducted some day just as big jackie was before him.

    Two all time great rams.

    Other all time great rams offensive linemen

    Level One Tom Mack, Doug Smith, Dennis Harrah
    Level Two Ken Iman, Adam Timmerman (only a very slight notch down based on the green bay years)


    All time courage award- Tom Nutten

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

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    Re: Slater V Pace

    Good Questions Major !


    Tough to answer though, with these two playing in separate eras, the competion on the other side of the ball is much different.

    Make no mistake, both are/were as good as they get, but I'm going to give the nod to Slater.

    I think he was the better run blocker and I think he faced better pass rush competition, with the likes of Reggie White, Lawrence Taylor, and others.

    Also, at this point, Slater gets the nod due to longevity alone.

    LT, one of the most feared pass rushers of his time, was known, at times, to line up on either side, but I honestly do not recall him ever taking Slater to task when the Rams faced the Giants during those days.

    I do recall the Rams 1989 playoff game vs. the Eagles, with Reggie White matched up on Slater. Whether it was run or pass blocking, Slater took White to school on that day.


    Jackie Slater



    Orlando Pace
    Last edited by Curly Horns; -06-16-2005 at 01:29 PM.

  4. #4
    general counsel Guest

    Re: Slater V Pace

    Ferter, i have a very vivid memory of that giant playoff game. I was living in nyc at the time and all my friends were giants fans. Primarily, it was Pankey who cleaned LT's clock all day in that game. LT didnt rush nearly as much on big jackies side of the ball.

    The longevity argument is a good one, but i am not sure about better pass rushers. I think the linebackers are faster today on the whole than they were in the 80's when big jackie was in his prime.

    If Pace does it another 5 years at this level, they will be about as close as possible.

    Keep in mind that as far as pass blocking, our offense in the Pace era puts the MAXIMUM pressure on the left tackle. Pace basically never gets any help and we are running longer patterns more often than maybe any team in nfl history, certainly a LOT longer than we ran in big jackies day. How often does Pace get beat? It will be very interesting to see how he responds to the big contract. Does his game go up a notch without the distraction (ie with the benefit of the off season workouts) or does it go the other way now that the cash is in the bank.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

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    Re: Slater V Pace

    hey ferter love that photo of Slater!!!!

    steve :ramlogo:

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    Re: Slater V Pace

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel
    i am not sure about better pass rushers. I think the linebackers are faster today on the whole than they were in the 80's when big jackie was in his prime.
    Agreed, overall they are probably faster, however, it was another era and the defensive schemes were different during the 80's. Most teams were using the 3 -4 scheme and you had that OLB who often lined up in the upright position, thereby, changing the techniques required to block. Today, for the most part, teams employ the 4-3 scheme with the larger and possibly slower DE lining up in the down position.



    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel
    Keep in mind that as far as pass blocking, our offense in the Pace era puts the MAXIMUM pressure on the left tackle. Pace basically never gets any help and we are running longer patterns more often than maybe any team in nfl history, certainly a LOT longer than we ran in big jackies day. How often does Pace get beat?
    Yes, I agree, the offensive scheme is much different, however, who is to say that Slater could not excel in today's scheme or Pace in the run oriented scheme of the 80's.

    Like I said, it is a tough call, when you try and make these kinds of comparisons.



    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel
    Does his game go up a notch without the distraction (ie with the benefit of the off season workouts)
    Yeah, I would have to think it will go up a notch. I did find it interesting that camp will not be held in Sweltering, Macomb this year. Have to wonder if Pace's agent lobbied for that in his contract negotiations....

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    Re: Slater V Pace

    The main difference I see between Pace and Big Jackie is in effort. Jackie Slater never took a play off. Orlando Pace sometimes appears to get a little lazy. Skill wise they both have everything you look for.

    That said, I think a tackle tandem of Orlando Pace and Jackie Slater (in his prime) would be the best ever.

  8. #8
    general counsel Guest

    Re: Slater V Pace

    Great point double Z, just wait a couple of years for The Big B, Mr. Barron, to get up to speed and Pace and Barron will easily be the top duo in the nfl!

    Good point on the effort, i think big jackie was certainly a more physical player. He was certainly meaner. See separate thread for my personal big jackie story.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel

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    Re: Slater V Pace

    Great Points By Everybody,i Give A Slight Edge To Slater Because Of His Run Blocking.

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    Different but simply two of the best OTs ever

    Thanks, Major ... or as GC suggested, Colonel.

    Without getting too much into nuances (mainly because I wouldn't know), I believe these two OTs are physically and fundamentally, a different specimen: Jackie played at 6-4, 280 lbs. Orlando stands at 6-7 and weighs in at close to 330!

    Advantage or not, it simply dictates a different bulk to put into defenders either for pass or run plays, different techniques to utilize in action.

    Nonetheless, in terms of professionalism, sure, Slater has the edge. More 'consecrated' if you will. A man's man as far as OTs are concerned. "Iron man" as an athlete and as a team player. I was very proud of our offensive line when JS played too.

    I'm just so glad we have Big-O with us on a long-term basis; I'm happy because I know that Pace has also matured and is committed. We're just so fortunate to have had two of the best ever.

  11. #11
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    Re: Slater V Pace

    Well just to lay out my hero's stats:

    Almost (and obviously should have) won the Heisman!
    Outland Trophy 2 times!
    FIRST OVERALL PICK!
    Every Pro bowl since he has been in the league I think
    ...essentially perfect every single play. Maybe not the best run blocker every, but a damn-near perfect pass blocker in a league where the ends are essentially some of the most ridiculous athletes in the world...

    Not saying that he's better, just saying that he is damned good!

    OPIMH

    P.S. Check out my new avatar pic of him flattening Hugh Douglass in the NFC Championship game in 2001!

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