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  1. #16
    moloch41's Avatar
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Funny- he must have forgotten about the 07' Patriots- who went 18-1 after signing a bunch of free agents last offseason.


  2. #17
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    18-1, but they didnt win the superbowl, so its pointless
    Built RAM tough

  3. #18
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    Look at the Patriots. They spend all kinds of money last year in free agency. They won free agency. But are they wearing XLII rings? I think not.
    Hey Moloch, I didn't.

    When you look at the Patriots 2007 season, you'll aways remember the "AND ONE", not the 18-0. Build in the draft, not through free agency. Those tons of dollars spent in free agency? The two of the receivers who were free agents didn't pan out and were cut. Moss was worth it, but he wasn't a free agent. Welker kinda was, but he was technically a trade as well. Adalius Thomas was a real free agent, but he didn't set the world on fire. He was average at best.

    So no, free agency DOESN'T work. Lets see if Cleveland wins it all this year, shall we? Or the Jets, they certainly won free agency too.

  4. #19
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Not spending isn't always good. Cleveland hasn't just been throwing money at people hoping they revive their career, they've had a great offseason, along with last years. You can't question it when it works. When it doesn't, like Washington and Oakland then question their free agency style. Seatle hasn't been bad either, was Julian Peterson a bad pick up? Patrick Kearny? Nope. The point of the article was don't be an Oakland. It was just presented poorly.

  5. #20
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    You make a very good point, Red, and I should revise my statement. Trying to BUILD your team through free agency doesn't work. Finding the spark you need using FA can work, as in the case with the Colts, grabbing Vinatieri from the Pats. Finding a depth player who can start can work, as in the case of New York and Kiwanuka. But let's look at the last number of Super Bowl Champions.

    NYG, their 07 draft paved the way and gave them the depth to make their run.

    Indy, they never strike in FA, and actually lose players that give them big supplemental picks. They made one move this year to grab a kicker, otherwise, their draft got them there, in the form of a new RB and a late round FS who started almost the entire season.


    Pittsburgh is another team that rarely goes after free agents, and they were bolstered by a second year QB coming into his own, two solid, but drafted WR's, a former Ram who's hardly acknowledged to have ever not been a Steeler and an undrafted RB along with their historically smashmouth defense.

    NE and NE. This was before their big time free agent days and they made their name by drafting talent to fit their system and cheap castoffs that became role players for their teams. In a way, you can say that they "built" their team through free agency, however, they built it with those who weren't wanted by everyone else, hardly what has been meant by free agency.

    So, by the last five years, you can see that the trend is to find the bargains in free agency that can be role players and depth reserves to your draftees. Actually building your team using free agency has not won championships for a number of years.

  6. #21
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Teke, you are making some good points but the fact of the matter is that we were junk last year. No change in the amount of injuries were going to change how bad we were. IMO a lot of bad coaching as well, but still. The rams were in fact so bad last year that yeah we do need to spend. As many examples as you have come up with for teams that don't spend I'm sure someone could come up with them for teams that do spend.

    Now look at it this way, when I say spend, I am not saying go out and overpay for every player who has had one decent season... but go out and at least buy up a bunch of cheap depth at least..., YOU said yourself that injuries killed us... then go find players to cover our injury problems... there has to be more on the market then what we picked up.

    Or better yet, trade! Get rid of Pace and draft long, now is the time to get rid of him while he still holds 'some' value. Get rid of a couple of these guys who can be gotten rid of, get more picks then build your team through the draft. Theres no point in expecting 8 picks to turn our team around, go get more picks, and better ones... SPEND!

    This offseason, we dumped our only other starting caliber WR... we have nothing to show for it, and the draft is deep but not strong at that position... we should have picked a guy up (can't believe we have to watch bennett again this year). We need CB's they are available. Trade a pick for Lito, best option. A 3rd for Lito... what an opportunity. Chances our 3rd round guy actually makes the squad... laughable. Trade it for a guy who cna and will start, then that pick has served its purpose.

    My point is that there are ways to get your draft value, without "drafting" trading picks for players is a good idea, and spending the moeny to do it isn't bad either... then dump some of our nunk depth, as you said we were bad b/c of injuries, then obviously our depth aren't good enough to play so dump them and retain their salaries for better players.

  7. #22
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    You make some good points yourself, guud. And you're right, we got killed by coaching and strength and conditioning coaching through injuries. I would support, like you, getting some cheap depth at this point.

    Looking at the free agents still out there, I would have no issues picking up OG Shane Olivea from the Chargers if the price was right. Or RT LJ Shelton from the Dolphins. Those would be two good depth/possible starters for our line. The issue is cap room, but there are always ways around that. I think that would shore up our line enough to skip it in this draft, unless we traded Pace, but what is his value? A third, maybe? Probably a fourth, and only because he's a possible hall of famer. Generally I don't feel trades tend to be worth it, but you never know. We could trade him right before he gets a career ending injury.

    On the defensive front, we're pretty stuck about pass rushers. Those are all gone. Jerome McDougle from Philly is the only one I recognize, and I play a lot of Madden, so that's saying a lot. I mentioned the linebackers I favor in the GM< thread, but to state them again: Gilbert Gardner, Nick Griesen, Rob Morris. I also see a number of fourth year LB's that could work as well. There's a lot of options there. The exact opposite is true of the secondary positions. Chris Crocker of Atlanta's the only one I would maybe go after.

    Now, as for your call for some trades of our draft picks. In general, I'm not a huge fan of trades, but there are always bargains out there if you look. Lito Sheppard is one of the main ones at the moment. If we're indeed losing Brown and can get away with only a third round pick for him, I could be inclined to go for it, provided two things happen. First, we pick up someone else for the offensive line, as I would use that choice for the offensive line. That's where the value should be. The second, would be that we pick up the best DE available in the first. I personally think that the Dolphins are going after Jake Long, so that would mean Chris Long. Gholston would be a good enough second choice though. The reasoning behind this is that there's no point in getting a better cover corner if we have no pass rush. I would rather let Hill, Wade and Bartell fight it out for the starting spots and develop the hard way if we don't get them help first.

    As for other trades, who is available? What deals do you think are out there? And don't say Pacman.

  8. #23
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Also, I've said I'm a fan of Bennett, so I know I'm partial, but I still say the jury is out for him, as he was used improperly and no one had a great year last year. He was injured with an injury that usually affects receivers for a whole season, and it showed with him. I'll admit that he was a foolish acquisition after this year if he doesn't prove himself worth it, provided we don't have another meltdown that can't be attributed to him again, of course. I should hope all of the Bennett haters out there would do the same if he proves himself.

  9. #24
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    I dunno- this guy and other people who have defended the Rams lack of action in the offseason seem to confuse smart spending with no spending at all. Just because you don't want to spend money doesn't make you smart. Now, I'm not saying we should go throw a boatload of money at Freddie "The People's Champ" Mitchell because he's there and available, but I thought we should have made some more moves. The Brandon Chillar non-signing is a perfect example. He didn't get much from the Packers, didn't sign a long term contract, and wanted to be back with the Rams. With as weak as this defense was last year and having already lost parts, it would have made sense to sign him. He knows the defense- had a pretty decent season and he came at a reasonable price tag. I also think they could have done a better job at restructuring Bruce's contract to keep him. He's a club icon and was also very productive for the Rams. Now, you let him go to the team's biggest rival and have absolutely no one to replace him. This wasn't some relic that wasn't producing anymore and you were just holding onto for old time's sake- he played and would have played a big role in the team's offense. It just seems like they are slashing payroll, but don't really have a plan on what to do after they do that or they are trying to reduce payroll to make it more attractive to a perspective buyer. If that is the case, they should make that public and not act as if they have this grand plan in the works.

  10. #25
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    moloch makes a valid point. Smart spending is one thing, stupid spending is another, and no spending means you must be very good.

    2 years ago, the Packers got Pickett who I really wanted the Rams to spend some money on. They seem to pick up at least one good FA signing a year and the Rams seem to have done that with the OG that they got. We'll see, but comparing teams that don't spend to teams that do is iffy. The Packers secondary was better than the Rams, so was the Front 4. Don't forget the other "4" that was on the offense for them either.

    Oh, and don't downplay the Free Agent signing of Randy Moss either. He was a vital cog in their Super Bowl run. 18-1 and not successful because they didn't win it all? Bull. How many on here would die for that record?
    Last edited by txramsfan; -03-24-2008 at 02:46 PM.

  11. #26
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Quote Originally Posted by txramsfan View Post
    18-1 and not successful because they didn't win it all? Bull. How many on here would die for that record?
    And don't forget- even before they traded for Moss and Welker and signing Stallworth, the Pats were not a 3-13 team. We were a horrible team that has only cut players and did nothing to fill their spots. Even though they didn't win the Superbowl, the Pats were commited to putting a winning team on the field- I can't say the same about the Rams. You can't tell me that there wasn't one trade out there worth making. It didn't even seem like they made an effort to bring free agents in- besides for a kicker and one lineman, that is.

  12. #27
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Thanks for the backup... I was too lazy to write all that, hoping someone would

  13. #28
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Ok, Moloch, Tx and guud, put your money where your mouth is. What free agents would you have gone after? What ones would you go after now? I did in the GM thread already. As for trades, the names being bounced around ate Jason Taylor, Chad Johnson, Lito Sheppard and Pacman Jones. There's also Dewayne Roberson. Other than that, there were the trades other teams did. Who/What would you have traded and for whom?

  14. #29
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Honestly, maybe this year I wouldn't have gone after anyone. I didn't like what I saw out there. However, to arbitrarily say that you should never spend in free agency is not valid.

    I may have paid for Faneca. That's one I could have opened my checkbook for. Other than that, I don't see where the Rams erred in their free agent spending.

  15. #30
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    Re: Smart teams spend little in free agency/Gosselin

    Quote Originally Posted by txramsfan View Post
    Honestly, maybe this year I wouldn't have gone after anyone. I didn't like what I saw out there. However, to arbitrarily say that you should never spend in free agency is not valid.

    I may have paid for Faneca. That's one I could have opened my checkbook for. Other than that, I don't see where the Rams erred in their free agent spending.
    i dont believe that you shouldent spend in FA. i think you need to spend wisely as someone said.

    dont forget, before this year we really didnt have a "true" gm before devany, he said that they were interested in faneca, and im guessing they would have been willing to pay, not as much as the jets probably, but were probably willing to open the checkbook.

    faneca is in his 30's i believe, i know OL can generally play late into their 30's but i beleieve we will get better, consistant years out of bell.

    basically what im trying to say is that as someone said, you cant build your team through FA, just spark it really. Teams are built through the draft, and there is no reason to pay huge for average players in FA. a mistake alot of people think is that if you pay a player alot of money you assume they are gonna be amazing(which they SHOULD be foir that kinda money), but they are really average players that dont deserve much more than all the other FA's and just get greatly benefitted by a weak FA class. so this year i can understand not spending.

    when we signed spoon, chavous, and glover that one offseason it seemed they were willing to spend, i think our front office plays it smart and knows what guys it should and shouldent overpay for.
    Built RAM tough

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