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Thread: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

  1. #31
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike View Post
    I don't have a major problem with taking the gamble, (although I'm crossing my fingers and hoping for the best) and I don't see too many others being completely against the pick, but let's call it what it is, a move that has more inherent risk than normal.
    No doubt there.

    But perhaps the Rams felt like, on some level, their extra picks were akin to "house money" that could be gambled on a high risk/high reward prospect.

    Here's hoping.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Vegas
    Because just maybe the other teams had other needs, or weren't (aren't) as desperate as the Rams.
    But how would this be considered a desparation move by the Rams if Jenkins did not have an increased risk associated with him?
    Or the majority of NFL management think like you ,RFRH and NJ Rams, which is probably (and understandably) the case.
    I'm not sure you have a handle on my position just yet. I can't speak for RFRH or NJ, but personally, I have never condemned this pick. I recognize that there is a considerable risk with this pick, but I've never condemned it.

    My argument is not with those who see this as a worthy pick. My argument is with those who refuse to acknowledge that the pick has increased risk with it.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    But perhaps the Rams felt like, on some level, their extra picks were akin to "house money" that could be gambled on a high risk/high reward prospect.
    I have no doubt this was the case.

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Self-AppointedAvengalist View Post
    But hey, keep on shoveling your pseudo-intellectual offerings.
    Couldn't just disagree. Had to personalize it once again, eh. {{sigh ...}}

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    But how would this be considered a desparation move by the Rams if Jenkins did not have an increased risk associated with him?
    I'm not sure you have a handle on my position just yet. I can't speak for RFRH or NJ, but personally, I have never condemned this pick. I recognize that there is a considerable risk with this pick, but I've never condemned it.

    My argument is not with those who see this as a worthy pick. My argument is with those who refuse to acknowledge that the pick has increased risk with it.
    Fair enough, but you failed to answer the first half of the response, i.e., that other teams had other needs. It can be argued it was NOT a desperation move by the Rams because WR and DT were bigger needs.

    And I do understand your position. MY opinion is weed, IN AND OF ITSELF, (recognizing the NFL's policy), does not make someone a character risk. So if you are saying, (which I don't think you are), that if the NFL wasn't anti-marijuana, you would have no problem with the pick, I would concur.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Holt Your Horses View Post
    We should just pick guys that are proven leaders, no criminal background and all round good people.. that way all the risk is eliminated and in three years our team will be playoff bound!!
    You, sir, have a brilliant strategy.

    Signed,
    S. Spagnuolo
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Video just posted on the Rams official website (Wed. May 02, 6 p.m. EDT):

    Under the Lights: CB Janoris Jenkins Draft Feature.

    FWIW
    Last edited by RealRam; -05-02-2012 at 06:08 PM. Reason: Format

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Everyone can look at this as a risk if they want but im looking at this for a chance of increased reward. If this guy doesnt work out he was one of 3 second round picks. We have had many failed second round picks before. Like I said if one of the 3 works out thats nice. If two work out great but if all 3 work out we are lucky. I don't expect all 3 to work out and Jenkins could be the only one that does you never know. I hope that is not the case but that is a possibility.

    If those who only want to see the high risk of this pick I ask you do you also see a chance of high reward? I mean we got a top 10 talent at the 39 hole. I am looking at this as possibly being a great pick. I mean no matter what the risk is because of character or because a guy doesnt work out they are all risks, a risk is a risk.

    I think Hub asked why we took him at 39. To that I would say Fisher saw a top 10 talented guy at 39 and felt we needed corner help and this guy has the skills to be a very good corner. If he doesnt work out he was a second round pick just like Quick and Pead and any of those three could miss making the team. I bet if he works out everyone that passed on him will wish they had picked him. If he doesnt work out he is just another of MANY failed second round picks.
    Last edited by rammiser; -05-02-2012 at 07:13 PM.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by RealRam View Post
    Video just posted on the Rams official website (Wed. May 02, 6 p.m. EDT):

    Under the Lights: CB Janoris Jenkins Draft Feature.

    FWIW
    So he isnt a public speaker but I did like that he said he's ready to prove people wrong.
    Just Fix It

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Rammiser View Post
    So he isn't a public speaker...
    What! You're kidding, right? Ha ... LOL! I'M kidding.

    So far, and it is just way too early, obviously, Jenkins seems to be reacting the way he ought to. He knows he IS a risk, but he says he's motivated to better days with the Rams. Carry on young man!
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by adarian_too View Post
    Groupthink. Symptoms of which include bounded rationality, tethered assumptions, and belief in inherent morality of the group.

    Irving Janis, Psychology Today, Nov. 1971
    It cannot be denied that the draft, along with all of its attendant draft services, draft guru's, football commentaries and near-hysteria (witness some of the idiocy in this boards draft-day thread) promotes a certain consensus. Its most clearly seen for me in the 'You didn't pick a player that Mel Kiper had in his top-100 and so I feel that you have clearly failed' or even more simply, 'You didn't pick a player I had heard of and so I feel justified in calling for the dismissal of the entire front-office'. Its interesting because this school of though continues to flourish despite evidence of countless drafts; top picks regularly flaming out, Keith McCants, Ryan Leaf et al and unheralded FA's and lower-round picks making the grade, Araian Foster and our own Clyde Simmons to name but two.

    So there is an encouraged orthodoxy inherent in the whole process.

    There is also a tendency, to eternally condemn on the evidence of past misdeeds. Someone screws up and lets just throw them in societies dustbin. This, despite whatever the purpose of the penal system with regards to rehabilitation and the Christian principle of forgiveness. (The USA is rather Christian these days) That doesn't strike me as fair or even useful as far as larger society is concerned.

    That said, the Rams are not a vehicle for personal salvation, Jenkins represents a risk on their investment. I feel that Sneads comments are particularly appropriate because he's responsible to a fair degree for picking him and he likened it to an investment in stocks. In the same way that we have regulatory bodies there, Jenkins will be monitored in terms of his present and future performance and I have no doubt he's been made aware of it.

    We had three 2nd rounders and we chose to take a punt with one of them, the potential reward being worth the risk. I've seen a lot of film on the guy since we drafted him and he can play, if he works out he's a shut-down corner with return abilities who will make multiple pro-bowls. If he doesn't he'll be gone but at least Snead/Fisher tried to make us better and this was a gamble I'd say they could afford in their first year.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Pang View Post
    So there is an encouraged orthodoxy inherent in the whole process.
    Conformity is the norm, I submit, throughout virtually every aspect of society. Generally speaking, people are uncomfortable with notions outside their frame of reference. Hubi asked a question to which I gave an answer, not necessarily the answer. Just because someone hasn’t heard of Irving or his theory doesn’t invalidate the possibility that the theory could explain why Jenkins’ value on the Board tumbled.

    Groupthink has a number of elements to it of which I only listed three. I’ll let the real know-it-alls go do their own research to better inform themselves of topics they know nothing about. So using Jenkins as a case study (no AV, I’m not pretending to speak about case law now), the question was why did he fall. On the surface it appears that there is consensus that he hosts a number of football skills that make him a valuable football commodity.

    However, and not being privy to the possibility that there may be some other questionable behaviors, it appears as though his repeated pot use and fathering children out of wedlock were the primary focal points.

    And that’s where shared morality comes into play. Drug use is bad, if not obviously illegal. Repeated drug use does not show repentance. Fathering one child is youthful indiscretion. Fathering two or three with multiple partners, well just shows plain irresponsibility. Combined they display lack of judgment, failure to learn from one’s past “mistakes” – all, I submit, rationalizations, as to why it’s easy to characterize Jenkins as a “bad apple” ready to rub off on the nearest bushel he’s thrown into.

    Groupthink isn’t defined by proximity to your neighbor’s chalkboard, it’s defined by the shared assumptions, rationalities, and belief systems that color one’s perception of the neighborhood you choose to live in. Saying that Jenkins has fallen down the draft board is a product of groupthink isn’t the same thing as saying that the judgment about Jenkins is wrong though. In fact, the consensus may very well be right. He may very well display bad behavior down the road that will call into question the Rams’ willingness to afford him an opportunity. And his prior actions may well have foretold that outcome.

    Regardless of one’s position, the Rams saw enough to give him a chance at the brass ring. Hopefully, he will vindicate their faith in him. Personally, his public speaking skills don’t concern me; in fact they already qualify him to replace certain so-called analysts.
    Last edited by adarian_too; -05-03-2012 at 09:17 AM.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by VegasRam View Post
    Fair enough, but you failed to answer the first half of the response, i.e., that other teams had other needs. It can be argued it was NOT a desperation move by the Rams because WR and DT were bigger needs.

    And I do understand your position. MY opinion is weed, IN AND OF ITSELF, (recognizing the NFL's policy), does not make someone a character risk. So if you are saying, (which I don't think you are), that if the NFL wasn't anti-marijuana, you would have no problem with the pick, I would concur.
    To the first half of your statement, I highly doubt the teams picking 1-38 are so rich with cornerback talent that they can pass on a top corner prospect........unless of course there was an increased risk with that particular prospect.

    And you're right, I'm not trying to make some big "say no to drugs" statement (though everyone should say no to drugs, just to be clear), but rather there is a component of this young man's life that is in direct violation of NFL rules. The one and only reason I care about that is that if he doesn't eliminate that component, he will not be on the field.

    Look, if the NFL came out with a mustard ban, and next year we have pictures of some prospect eating grey poupon with a spoon, he will have an increased risk. Like AV said, this isn't a moral thing, it's a business thing.
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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser
    I think Hub asked why we took him at 39. To that I would say Fisher saw a top 10 talented guy at 39 and felt we needed corner help and this guy has the skills to be a very good corner.
    Yes, I agree that Fisher saw a top 10 talented guy, calculated the increased risk in this kid, and decided he was the BPA.

    That's why the Rams selected him.

    But, my question was why a top-10 talent was available at #39?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: so you think taking Jenkins was a risk huh?

    People, your over analyzing this pick. Seriously, again its a risk either way. Look at HOF guys that had rap sheets (Cris Carter, Terell Owens, Deion Sanders etc....). Thats all im going to say. Now im not saying their problems were the same as Janoris but they did have problems either way. Do you think it was a mistake for those teams to pick them? Shoot ANY player could be drafted high and then all of a sudden have trouble in his personal life or develop a pre maddonna attitude or what not. NOBODY KNOWS! Thats the draft in a nutshell. For a guy that draft analysts said in terms of pure talent was a top 10 pick, how could you NOT take him at that point in the draft? Thats a steal. Again, look at our past draft the past 10 years or so and tell me if it wasnt worth the risk in your opinion. Well thats just my two cents.

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