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  1. #61
    Fat Pang's Avatar
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    Re: Are some of us wrong??

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison
    Interesting question. The Martz hating (and there is a difference between hate and criticism...for this discussion I'm talking about the hate) began after Warner got benched. Some will say they hated Martz all along, but really it was over the Warner benching and subsequent dismissal......surely most would agree to this timeline. And now that the Warnerites/Anti-Martzites have hooked their white whale, where does the hate turn?

    I'd love to say it goes away and these people start over fresh and new. However, the more cynical side of me thinks something new will spring up to foster their hate. My first guess is Stephen Jackson. He is the replacement for Marshall Faulk and IMHO, the biggest bulls-eye for those that enjoy the more bile-laden aspects of fandom.

    But that's just my opinion.

    Great post HUb, I particularly like the allusion to Moby Dick, given the self destructive nature of Ahab's rage it compares well with some of the post's I've seen in this thread.

    As for the point on Jackson, I'm in full agreement. We've started to see it on the poison filled P-D board and we had a couple of negative threads on Jackson early in Dec I think.

    Seems to me that some of our more extreme Martz hating as opposed to Martz critical colleagues, want time to stand still. I can't explain the "Martz is a retard" point of view in any other way.

    Kurt Warner wasn't winning, Marc Bulger was. On this basis and extending the logic used by some of the posts by people disgusted with Martz, Kurt Warner should have been "kicked to the curb (kerb)" after a couple of games. He wasn't and Martz gave Kurt back his starting role the following season only for Kurt to lay a huge egg against the Giants.

    Martz gave him another shot and he couldn't take advantage of it.

    If Kurt was that fictional CEO rebel13, for the sake of consistency ,I would've expected you to urge us to can him as things were truly going "amiss". I somehow don't think you would have done.

    Wouldn't you get rid of your leader if things were going amiss rebel13?

    Martz' "agenda" was the agenda of a HC wanting to win ball games. We were'nt winning, a change was made and we started to win games and get to the playoffs.

    This hatred of Martz comes from an inability to recognise the moment when the 99 season ended and the following season began, or more accurately, when Kurt's performances started to drop off.

    If we had blindly refused to recognise the inevitable, our fall from the upper echelon of the NFL would have been far more spectacular and less gradual than it has been.

    Our fall from that grace is down to players getting older, being successful in the age of the salary cap, performances falling off, FO dysfunction, parity, poor drafts and poor positional coaching and co-ordination. It is not down to one man being benched or a coach being a retard.

    Failure to accept the dynamic, changing nature of the NFL or even change itself ultimately means that happiness and contentment is extremely difficult to attain.

    I would hope that the people who are glad to see the back of MM will be a little more patient with Mr Linehan and judge him on his own merits, not the fact he isn't Mike Martz.
    Last edited by Fat Pang; -01-20-2006 at 02:27 AM.

  2. #62
    OldRamsfan's Avatar
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    Re: Are some of us wrong??

    Quote Originally Posted by tanus
    what exactly are you trying to say here? i need to check my facts? um, you just agreed with me that the defense was completely rebuilt yet i still need to check my facts. kinda odd, but ok.

    you said that he inherited a SB team, which he did, but was also a major part of constructing it. so give him that credit as it is due to him. my point is that the defense in 2000 was absolutely terrible. Martz completely overhauled the defense in 2001 and got back to the SB. if that isnt coaching then i really dont know what is. perhaps someone can enlighten me.

    i do agree with you that leadership is important. given the state of the relationship with the FO and Martz, that answers that question. as far as the players loving and respecting martz, there has been numerous quotes from players saying so.
    All I was saying was in my opinion I dont think mike was a better head coach than he was O.C. I have never been a Martz hater as you would have seen by other post I have made in this thread ... I respect all opinions weather I agree or not and I understand yours and respect it ... What I had a problem with is the way you came at my post and me ... If you read the other post I never mention anything about the Players not getting along with martz( putting them in the right fram of mind or in the right spots to win) and if you read the other posts I mentioned that Mike did have alot to with the making the team what it was and Is ... those are the facts I'm talking about ... When another person talkes a post and turnes it around or misunderstands it and begins to be disrespectfull that where I have a PROBLEM ... If I'm wrong then I will say so ! But their is no room for disrepect ....You seem to be upset with the fact that I used the same words that you delt me in your post Wow what concept , I do how ever think this has been a big MISUNDERSTANDING the other thing that upset me was the fact that in this thread I was given a neg rep on my rating that couldn't have been you right>right ... So when a post is misunderstood one should not attack another without 1st finding out what was meant by the post ! Only my Opinion
    Last edited by OldRamsfan; -01-20-2006 at 02:10 PM.

  3. #63
    Curly Horns's Avatar
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    Re: Are some of us wrong??

    In case anyone missed it, Martz was on "Quite Frankly" with Stephen A. Smith yesterday. He was very candid in the interview, although he could not elaborate on the FO situation due to a settlement reached with the Rams. Essentially it sounds like they bought his silence on the subject. He did say that the infamous cell phone call was previously planned and expected by Fairchild.

    He said he loves the game and loves to coach. He said he loves to teach players. He says he gets the most enjoyment from teaching players to rise above their own perceived shortcomings. He would prefer to be a head coach, but he said he would consider being an OC and/or a QB coach. He plans to coach again in some capacity.

    He talked briefly about SB36. He said they basically took the same approach in preparation as in SB34. Using Faulk was in the gameplan. The plan was to give him 10-12 carries per half. Martz said getting behind on the scoreboard and the 3 turnovers changed the gameplan.

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