Results 1 to 15 of 15
  1. #1
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is online now Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,822
    Rep Power
    168

    Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote the following comment:

    If the Rams turn things around, I fear that there will be many who will see that as ammunition against Coach Martz.


    It has already started.

    The media and fans have started singing Interim Head Coach Vitt's praises. He's changed the offense. He's changed the attitude. He's intilled toughness. He's shown appropriate conservatism. He's won two in a row.

    Well... maybe.

    To attribute that to Vitt, you have to presume that Mike Martz would not have rallied the troops in the face of injuries. You have to presume he would not have focused more on Jackson in Bulger, Holt and Bruce's absence. You have to presume that the team would not have similarly rallied if he were here.

    I'm not ready to presume all that.

    The truth is, the Rams won two fairly close games against one sub-par and one decent, but flawed, opponent, while playing on their home turf.

    I'm not ready to annoint Vitt as a savior quite yet, nor am I ready to declare that "things have really changed since Mike Martz left."

    This is still Mike Martz's team.

    Win or lose.


  2. #2
    CRAZYHORNS's Avatar
    CRAZYHORNS is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Maryland near DC
    Age
    47
    Posts
    633
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    I agree 100%

  3. #3
    RamJackson39's Avatar
    RamJackson39 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2005
    Location
    Alabama
    Posts
    990
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    To attribute that to Vitt, you have to presume that Mike Martz would not have rallied the troops in the face of injuries. You have to presume he would not have focused more on Jackson in Bulger, Holt and Bruce's absence. You have to presume that the team would not have similarly rallied if he were here.
    The difference is not the offence. It is the defense. Vitt has instilled his personality in it. It is playing much better, blitzing much more, and that is why the Rams have won.

    Do I anoint Vitt as the second coming of God himself? No. I do believe, though, that we would not have beaten the Jags unless Vitt had done something with the defense.

  4. #4
    rampete is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Southern Cal
    Posts
    654
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote the following comment...
    how does this person qualify as "wise"...?

    prophetic or cynical may be a better fit, don't you think?

  5. #5
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,642
    Rep Power
    145

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by rampete
    how does this person qualify as "wise"...?

    prophetic or cynical may be a better fit, don't you think?
    Maybe, but then again, I can't think of a single cynical prophet that isn't wise.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  6. #6
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,642
    Rep Power
    145

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by RJ39
    The difference is not the offence. It is the defense. Vitt has instilled his personality in it. It is playing much better, blitzing much more, and that is why the Rams have won.
    Excellent point, RJ! The offense isn't doing anything different. Jackson is running the ball more, but with Martin at QB, would Martz have done anything different? Maybe, maybe not, but I doubt it.

    As you pointed out, the difference is in the defense. Since Vitt has taken over, we've stopped bailing on the base defense. Before we were throwing out the blitz with the bath water and spending 90% of our D downs in a nickel package. Now we're staying in base and blitzing more. A successful blitz package can make a sloppy secondary look a lot better than they are.

    IMHO, it's not that Vitt is an improvement over Martz. It's that Vitt is an improvement over Marmie.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  7. #7
    r8rh8rmike's Avatar
    r8rh8rmike is online now Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    29 Palms, Ca.
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,697
    Rep Power
    129

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by RamJackson39
    The difference is not the offence. It is the defense. Vitt has instilled his personality in it. It is playing much better, blitzing much more, and that is why the Rams have won.
    I tend to agree with this. The shadow and influence of Mike Martz is still very much on this team, but with Vitt in the position of head coach, I think he's able to have more of a say in what happens on defense, without Marmie being able to run to Martz in protest. So far, it looks to be working.

  8. #8
    viper's Avatar
    viper is online now Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Vancouver, Washington
    Age
    53
    Posts
    1,682
    Rep Power
    26

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison
    Excellent point, RJ! The offense isn't doing anything different. Jackson is running the ball more, but with Martin at QB, would Martz have done anything different? Maybe, maybe not, but I doubt it.

    As you pointed out, the difference is in the defense. Since Vitt has taken over, we've stopped bailing on the base defense. Before we were throwing out the blitz with the bath water and spending 90% of our D downs in a nickel package. Now we're staying in base and blitzing more. A successful blitz package can make a sloppy secondary look a lot better than they are.

    IMHO, it's not that Vitt is an improvement over Martz. It's that Vitt is an improvement over Marmie.
    Would it be safe to say because we are blitzing more our secondary is looking better, but, our run defense is suffering for it?

    In any event, I like the more aggressive version we are running lately. Hopefully, they will be able to get a handle on stopping the run more consistently. They look great at times and terrible at others.

  9. #9
    sbramfan is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    los angeles
    Age
    42
    Posts
    894
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Ufortunately for Martz, he didn't get the chance to try to turn things around, so if this team improves, it will look like Vitt is the reason.

    And if they do turn this around, perhaps it is the reason.

  10. #10
    NY RAMFAN's Avatar
    NY RAMFAN is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2005
    Location
    NY
    Age
    42
    Posts
    381
    Rep Power
    10

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    I'm sorry gentleman but saying that this team has turned around because Martz is no more is a truly disrespect of the coaching staff and the players. We've been in this situtation many times before (just look back one season) and we turned things around, but guess what . . . MM was on command, and Vitt was just next to him, so were these same players (thank God Chandler is not!). Nobody would never think that the players also owe loyalty to the guy that leaded them to a SB and only had 1 lossing season and they also play to give back something to the guy that trust them and put them on the field???
    I'm sorry, but the coaching staff are not stupid, neither the player or myself, Vitt is doing a great job and turned things around but I believe that MM would have done the same thing.
    Don't forget who is MM: 3rd winning% coach, I NFC ch., only 1 loosing season, 2 mvp and also off. coach of the GSOT.

  11. #11
    AJD45 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jul 2001
    Location
    California
    Posts
    120
    Rep Power
    14

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    I was among those hoping Vitt would in fact make things better (simply because now the Rams have a full-time head coach as opposed to MM splitting time between coach/coordinator). But I haven't seen much different. It's still a freakin' contest each week to see which Ram can come up with the most idiotic penalty, jump offsides the most, run into a guy calling a fair catch, step out of bounds at the one, etc. Unless Vitt does something like hold cadence class instead of giving the team Monday off or something, color me unimpressed.

  12. #12
    Curly Horns's Avatar
    Curly Horns is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    1st & Goal
    Posts
    2,669
    Rep Power
    58

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Should we presume that, in the absence of the Rams starting QB, during the 2004 season, that Martz would use chandler in his offense, just as he used the starting QB in his offense?

    Or should we just chalk that up to idiotic fact?



  13. #13
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is online now Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,822
    Rep Power
    168

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Chandler at least had Holt and Bruce to throw to (not that he did - he preferred throwing to the other team).

  14. #14
    Curly Horns's Avatar
    Curly Horns is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Mar 2002
    Location
    1st & Goal
    Posts
    2,669
    Rep Power
    58

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Chandler at least had Holt and Bruce to throw to (not that he did - he preferred throwing to the other team).
    Point taken.

    But Martz never showed much willingness to change the play calling to fit the back-up QB.

    It's the Roy McAvoy principle. It's always about what Martz thinks a player or players may be able to do, rather what they actually can do.



  15. #15
    ramsbruce's Avatar
    ramsbruce is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    FIRING SCHOTTY
    Age
    42
    Posts
    3,716
    Rep Power
    52

    Re: Two weeks ago, a wise man wrote...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ferter
    It's the Roy McAvoy principle. It's always about what Martz thinks a player or players may be able to do, rather what they actually can do.
    Example Lamar Gordon as our Fullback :tut
    Quote Originally Posted by ramsbruce
    The backhanded compliments about Austin Davis are amusing.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •