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  1. #16
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Butler's been a starter for two seasons and has nine interceptions. That's impressive, but he's no Ed Reed. I'm not sure I'd rank him as one of the top takeaway guys in the entire league just yet.
    Interesting you say that. Only two players have had 6 or more takeaways over the last 2 seasons: Ed Reed and Jerametrius Butler.

    That said I'm going to break the rules and pick two players: Butler and Fisher. I think these two are one of the most underrated CB tandems in the league. Butler has been spectacular getting the ball and Travis Fisher's speed and coverage skills are excellent.
    Last edited by ZigZagRam; -06-20-2005 at 03:23 PM.


  2. #17
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZigZagRam
    Interesting you say that. Only two players have had 6 or more takeaways over the last 2 seasons: Ed Reed and Jerametrius Butler.
    To me, this is like saying only so many QBs have been in a Super Bowl, and since Trent Dilfer is one of them, he's on the same level as the others.

    If you include fumble recoveries, your statement is technically true, but I'm not sure I personally consider grabbing an already loose ball on the ground as creating a turnover or being a good takeaway man. It's creating those takeaways that's important, and while Butler has done well overall, I'm not sure I'd put him at the top of the league in that respect.

    Maybe if he actually didn't hesitate in run support, he'd be able to force some more fumbles. But so long as he stands back and watches as runners slam through holes into the second level, he's not going to convince me of much.
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  3. #18
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    All I said was that he is underrated.

  4. #19
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    I gotta go with Pickett. He brings his lunch bucket everyday, gets down in the trenches and carries the load of his fellow teammates who have struggled the last few years. All the while not bringing any attention to himself. Fortunately, it looks like Kennedy may be ready to bust loose and take some of the pressure off of Pickett. This should be a pretty good defensive line this year if Kennedy and Hargrove step up as expected.

    Massey does deserve special mention as well.

  5. #20
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    To me, this is like saying only so many QBs have been in a Super Bowl, and since Trent Dilfer is one of them, he's on the same level as the others.
    But winning the Super Bowl is a team accomplishment. Individual stats are a measure of the individual player's success.

    If you include fumble recoveries, your statement is technically true, but I'm not sure I personally consider grabbing an already loose ball on the ground as creating a turnover or being a good takeaway man. It's creating those takeaways that's important, and while Butler has done well overall, I'm not sure I'd put him at the top of the league in that respect.
    Fair enough. He does have a forced fumble though.

  6. #21
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by ZigZagRam
    But winning the Super Bowl is a team accomplishment. Individual stats are a measure of the individual player's success.
    So then is Terry Allen on the same page as Emmitt Smith as a player because both have gained over 20 rushing TDs in a single season? Can you compare Carl Pickens to Randy Moss or Jerry Rice because all have caught 17 or more TDs in a single season? Individual stats do measure the success of an individual player, but stats don't always put people on the same level as others who have accomplished that.


    Quote Originally Posted by ZigZagRam
    Fair enough. He does have a forced fumble though.
    Emphasis on "a" forced fumble. We'll see how Butler does in his third year. I don't think he's ever going to be the kind of player some people see him as if he doesn't buckle that chin strap and step up to make a tackle a bit earlier than he has in the past.
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  7. #22
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Actually, he has 12 takeaways in the past two years (9 interceptions, 3 fumble recoveries). I believe that puts him in the top 5 in the league in takeaways over the past two years. (Dre Bly, for example has also had 12 takeaways in the past two years, but he has made the Pro Bowl both years).
    Butler'd probably have more if it wasn't so flippin' easy to run on us.
    "the Heart Lies and the Head Plays Tricks with us, but the Eyes See True".

  8. #23
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by sbramfan
    the only problem with the "mike furrey" feel good story is that he'll be cut before the season starts. No way he makes it at safety.

    The whole NFC west is underrated if you ask me. Supposedly this is one of the "weekest" divisions. Yeah, we'll see how easy it is this year. I bet there's a wild card in this division.
    I dont think they'll cut mike Furrey,if anything he'll go back to being wide reciever,hes to good on special teams.If somebody has to be cut to keep Furrey,it could be Dane Looker who I think is under rated,or they mike cut a rookie WR.We need looker to be kick holder,and I think Dane is under rated the kid knows how to get open,and he has good hands.
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  9. #24
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    I agree that Pickett has been under the radar and hopefully will have a huge year this season.

    But I think that D Lew had a decent season last year filling in for Big Bear.

    36 tackles, 10 assists, and 5 sacks. He was third on the team in sacks behind B Fisher and Little.

    I think he will play a major role in the rotation, and may see some time on the end.
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  10. #25
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by psycho9985
    I dont think they'll cut mike Furrey,if anything he'll go back to being wide reciever,hes to good on special teams.If somebody has to be cut to keep Furrey,it could be Dane Looker who I think is under rated,or they mike cut a rookie WR.We need looker to be kick holder,and I think Dane is under rated the kid knows how to get open,and he has good hands.
    Amen on Dane Looker, former World Bowl MVP. The kid has Ricky Proehl-like talent [whatever that's saying] and would get 6-700 yds and 6 TDs a year if not for the slot burners we've got in Curtis and McDonald. He's got glue for hands and could be very valuable in goal-line, red zone, or third down scenarios.

  11. #26
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    I like looker also guys, but he made some big mistakes last year that he needs to correct this season. he had some big drops and the fumble early in the saints game got him into the dog house. For looker to be valuable, he has to catch basically everthing that hits him in the hands and he cant fumble given that his strength is reliablility, not big play capacity.

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  12. #27
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    I Am Going To Narrow My Answer Down To Last Year And That Would Be Isaac Bruce,put Up Big Numbers And Didnt Make The Pro Bowl So I Consider Him And His Last Season Performance Underated.

  13. #28
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Can you compare Carl Pickens to Randy Moss or Jerry Rice
    Yea, but Pickens is a much better actor. I mean he was great as Taggert in Blazing Saddles!

    Wait...no that was Slim Pickens, my bad. Hey, maybe Carl's his nephew?!
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  14. #29
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    Re: who is the most underrated ram?

    Jeff Wilkins - as the best tackler on Special teams. Seriously.

    The guy can tackle. I'd like to know what other positions he's played.
    "the Heart Lies and the Head Plays Tricks with us, but the Eyes See True".

  15. #30
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    Isaac Bruce has been underrated his whole career because he keeps his mouth shut. It's a shame.

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