Why are the Martz backers parnoid and think the sky is falling????

#1 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

When we were losing with Martz the Martz backers did not seem paranoid and now that we have been winning with Vitt they seem paranoid about everything. They are afraid to talk about our success lately. They are afraid to let go of the Martz issue and just let the season play out. They think he is being treated unfair by the FO. They think he is being treated unfair by the media. They don’t like that we are getting attention as a team with Vitt. They can’t stand success without Martz. They hate to see anyone get credit right now except Martz. They only want to feel sorry for Martz and not the team and interim coach. Some of these people use to call people here Nay Sayers when we were losing and now that we are winning without Martz some of them are acting like Nay Sayers every time we do something good that’s Martz guy if we do something bad lets blame it on Martz not being there or our D or D coordinator because we don’t hold Martz accountable for that (We tend to blame Marmie who Martz hired).

Why don’t some guys back Vitt?
Probably for the same reasons some of them are afraid of using backups for people like Hargrove because they already made an early prediction that he is good and are afraid of looking like a fool when some one else does a better job. They can’t reverse their stance even after reality sets in.

I am not saying we have to give up on people like Hargrove but when they are not pulling their weight we need to at least try some one else until he is or we decide he cant cut it.

**AvengerRam** · #2 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

I'm not a "Martz backer," nor am I a "Martz basher."

There are things I like about Mike Martz, and there have been times when I thought he should be fired.

There are only three things I'm certain of right now:

1. Mike Martz deserves to be treated with more respect by fans and the media.

2. Joe Vitt has done nothing to prove that he's the long-term answer at Head Coach.

3. The defense still needs a lot of work.

**Nick** · #3 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN

They are afraid to talk about our success lately

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN

They can’t stand success without Martz.

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN

They hate to see anyone get credit right now except Martz.

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN

they already made an early prediction that he is good and are afraid of looking like a fool when some one else does a better job.

If these are the conclusions you've drawn by reading posts here over the last few weeks, then it would seem to me you're largely out of touch with the actual opinions of those you criticize.

#4 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by AvengerRam

There are only three things I'm certain of right now:

1. Mike Martz deserves to be treated with more respect by fans and the media.

2. Joe Vitt has done nothing to prove that he's the long-term answer at Head Coach.

3. The defense still needs a lot of work.

I agree on all three counts and I will add my replies to those.
1. I can honestly say I think the media thing maybe a little blown out of proportion. I have seen several media people standup for Martz and no one truly knows if Martz started it or the FO started it. The FO is to blame for the poor handling of it. I have also seen several media people say that he will get a job coaching for sure next year even if he is not back with St. Louis. I agree he deserves some respect from the fans for the years of excitement he brought here. But what bugs me is the Martz backers trying to minimize everything good that’s happening instead of letting people get excited again about our teams play and giving some credit to the job of the present coaching staff. They seem afraid to give credit to the coaches without thinking about Martz. Yes they are coaching Martz team but I wish people would evaluate them on what they do with the talent given to them and let the Martz issue go until the off season.

2. I agree I like what he has done as interim but I want to see how I feel at the end of the season about his coaching ability. I question if a high-energy guy like Vitt can last for a long period of time. For now I don’t care I am behind him 100% and I am not going to spend the rest of the year over analyzing our coaches every game. I will save that for when our players are not playing (off season).

3. I agree 100%.

*cowboyhater* · #5 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

I am not getting on anybody's bandwagon until we can be a decent team on the road.

**evil disco man** · #6 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Here are my own few points...

1. Joe Vitt has done a great job of managing this team as the interim head coach. I hope he returns next season, but not as head coach.

2. Mike Martz will still be missed. This roster will probably be completely different when the '06 season starts. There will be some players that end up exiting after Martz that will additionally be missed. That said, this team has some great young talent that will be able to win without Martz and Co.

3. I'm not afraid of the Rams' future because of the fact that Martz will likely leave. I'm afraid of what the upper management might do to the identity of this team and the time it will take to set up a whole new style.

*theodus69* · #7 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Martz has been an up & down coach to me. Not quite as great as his billing and always seemed to leave me feeling a little like( I'm not so impressed so to speak) It's just time for a change and fortunately Vitt has had the luck on his side as a lot of interm coaches don't get! So Vitt will be the guy til the seasons end. The playoffs or in the grasp , but this team seems to be as bad as last year and seeing them in the playoffs was sickening. They were an embarrassment to say the least! So who knows , it will all be revealed soon enough.

*RealRam* · #8 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

STL, as Nick implied, you are really not following or simply not understanding what some of us are clearly stating regarding the Rams current coaches situation.

In other threads, and now here also, I for one have approved, liked, and supported Coach Vitt for his attitude/mentality and dedication since MM left ill. I'm glad he is who he is, and am certainly looking forward to continued success during the rest of the season.

Quite a number of other fans have stated very similar opinions.

I have also expressed that I hope Coach Martz returns for '06 and that JV become our DC.

Quote:

Why don’t some guys back Vitt? --STLRF

The reasons, the comments you follow-up with to your own question in the opening post are, in the words of Mike Martz, "...awful! That's awful! That's awful!"

By and large, I believe most Rams fans here in ClanRam as well as around the rest of the football world, are glad to have Joe Vitt as interim HC. And most people (that are mature enough) don't have a problem succeeding without Mike Martz.

Let's get over it, friend. No need to argue what is not even there to argue! :clanram:

*RealRam* · #9 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Quote:

I'm afraid of what the upper management might do to the identity of this team and the time it will take to set up a whole new style. --EDM

Now, see? That is an intelligent observation. And, unfortunately, potentially true. :tut

**HUbison** · #10 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Quote:

Originally Posted by STLRAMSFAN

When we were losing with Martz the Martz backers did not seem paranoid and now that we have been winning with Vitt they seem paranoid about everything. They are afraid to talk about our success lately. They are afraid to let go of the Martz issue and just let the season play out. They think he is being treated unfair by the FO. They think he is being treated unfair by the media. They don’t like that we are getting attention as a team with Vitt. They can’t stand success without Martz. They hate to see anyone get credit right now except Martz. They only want to feel sorry for Martz and not the team and interim coach. Some of these people use to call people here Nay Sayers when we were losing and now that we are winning without Martz some of them are acting like Nay Sayers every time we do something good that’s Martz guy if we do something bad lets blame it on Martz not being there or our D or D coordinator because we don’t hold Martz accountable for that (We tend to blame Marmie who Martz hired).

Why don’t some guys back Vitt?
Probably for the same reasons some of them are afraid of using backups for people like Hargrove because they already made an early prediction that he is good and are afraid of looking like a fool when some one else does a better job. They can’t reverse their stance even after reality sets in.

I am not saying we have to give up on people like Hargrove but when they are not pulling their weight we need to at least try some one else until he is or we decide he cant cut it.

STL, my friend, I make you this promise. I'm not going to give up on you. I believe soon you will be able to differentiate between what those around you are actually saying, and what you think those around you are saying. Let the therapy begin......

Nobody is rooting against Vitt.
Nobody is afraid to talk about recent wins.
Nobody (well, almost nobody) is paranoid about everything.
Nobody hates to see credit given to where it is due.
Nobody wants to see the Rams lose.

And just as Warnerite and Bulgerite before it, Martz-backer is just another ignorant label that doesn't even begin to describe anyone's whole position around here.

**txramsfan** · #11 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

Well, I started the Warnerite stuff a few years ago out of frustration, not ignorance but I know what you mean bison.

STL, I think you may have a point but you just don't know how to articulate it properly. I have the same problem at my office; what I think is blatanly obvious my boss is utterly confused.

I really don't think, on this board anyway, that anyone wants Vitt to do bad. If that happens then the Rams are in the tank. And, I'm not sure about everyone thinking the sky is falling if we don't have Martz. I thought about something this morning: you can win a Super Bowl with Trent Dilfer at QB but it's difficult to win a Super Bowl with Jamie Duncan at MLB.

**AvengerRam** · #12 (**permalink**) -04-11-2005

"Still, a man hears what he wants to hear and disregards the rest."

--- Paul Simon

If anyone thinks that I am hoping that Joe Vitt will "fail," then (to quote another great American wordsmith) you don't know me vewwy well!

I would like nothing more than to see the Rams suddenly start playing inspired football leading to a Super Bowl win in early 2006. And, if that happens, I would not only support, I'd insist upon the Rams organization retaining Joe Vitt as the full time Head Coach.

But, for now, I'm not ready to assume that this will actually occur. I expect that the Rams will play well enough to remain in contention for a playoff spot until the final weeks of the season. Whether they make it or not... who can say?

So... since some seem to think I'm now to be characterized as a "Martz backer," I will submit to you that my prognostication is hardly a "sky is falling" postion.