Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast
Results 76 to 90 of 119
  1. #76
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Geez... you couldn't be putting more words in my mouth unless you were force feeding me Alpha-bits.
    I'm sorry. Did you not say this?

    Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Your characterization of my posts is not correct, but to the extent that I have posted criticism of Warner, there is a simple reason: I think that blind hero worship is a dangerous thing, and would prefer that sports personalities be viewed as human being with both positive and negative characteristics. In my many years as a sports fan, I cannot recall an athlete who has been portrayed by fans in as unrealistic a manner as Warner. There is a segment of Rams fans (or, in some cases, Warner fans who care little about the Rams) who think that he can do no wrong. He can and he does.
    That's why I quoted it in the preceding post.

    I did attempt to clarify.. you have said I have it all wrong. So, in order to better myself and help you help me, I will offer again, but I'll break it down smaller, then you can tell me which pieces I have wrong, (and, hopefully, why) and the world will be a better place!

    As I understand what I quoted from you above:

    1. Your comments about Warner in this case are only tangentially critical.
    2. Those comments weren't to tear him down, but to point out to us, the unwashed masses, that he is not a "saint'.
    3. You believe it is your duty to educate those of us who "deify" Warner as to the humanity of him; that there is good and bad in everyone... we learn to live, we learn to give.. (oh wait, got off track)

    If you are incapable of respecting my opinion, and can only respond with mischaracterizations and straw man arguments, that your problem, not mine.
    I am doing my best with that with which I have to work. It would be helpful if you either confirmed 1-3 above, or explained where I misunderstood the words you typed. I mean, perhaps I have the wrong lexicon or something. I mean, I could parse the entire thing if you like, but I didn't think there was that large of a debate regarding the meaning of those words.


  2. #77
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,479
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    If you think I am going to specifically respond to every piece of nonsense you post simply because you ask me to you are sadly mistaken.

  3. #78
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,530
    Rep Power
    144

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by AV
    Kurt remains a good man. But he's no Saint
    I completely agree with this position. I think the facts bear out that Kurt has been a Packer, Ram, Giant and Cardinal, but nowhere can I find that he is or has been at any point a Saint. Bulger, on the other hand.........
    Quote Originally Posted by atc
    Paul probably thought it in either Greek or Hebrew, but it was certainly written down in the Greek, translated into Latin, and into English.)
    Unless of course one were to use a NIV or newer translation skipping the Vulgate, translated directly from the early Greek MSs. And I'm just guessing (of course), but I bet Paul thought in his "first" language Aramaic. I'm certain he was trilingual, but I bet his thoughts were in the conversational language of his environment.
    Last edited by HUbison; -10-03-2008 at 10:48 AM.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  4. #79
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    If you think I am going to specifically respond to every piece of nonsense you post simply because you ask me to you are sadly mistaken.
    I can only conclude, then that you feel trapped by my analysis.

    Pity. I might have grown so much with your proselytizing.

  5. #80
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    And I'm just guessing (of course), but I bet Paul thought in his "first" language Aramaic. I'm certain he was trilingual, but I bet his thoughts were in the conversational language of his environment.
    You may be correct... he was a learned man, however. It gets tricky when one has mastery of several languages.. and in the context of those times, it's hard to say.. Greek was very much like English is today.. required by industry and travel, etc.. so there's quite the possibility... I would say it would depend on which language he used most. I'm thinking that his letters, however, would have been written in Greek, because they were shared between various churches... used both by Jews and Gentiles (but mostly Gentiles)

  6. #81
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,530
    Rep Power
    144

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by atcchris View Post
    You may be correct... he was a learned man, however. It gets tricky when one has mastery of several languages.. and in the context of those times, it's hard to say.. Greek was very much like English is today.. required by industry and travel, etc.. so there's quite the possibility... I would say it would depend on which language he used most. I'm thinking that his letters, however, would have been written in Greek, because they were shared between various churches... used both by Jews and Gentiles (but mostly Gentiles)
    I don't think Palestine was as backwater as some think, so I wouldn't be surprised if a large portion (or at least larger than expected) of the population weren't trilingual. And yes, Paul was highly educated and fluent in all three, but I'd be surprised if the first language he learned wasn't Aramaic. As for the letters, I agree, the original surely were Greek.

    Matthew might, I say might, have been written in Hebrew, but that's a different discussion all together.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  7. #82
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,479
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by atcchris View Post
    I can only conclude, then that you feel trapped by my analysis.
    What analysis? All you have done on this thread is misquote, mischaracterize and babble. Is that what you consider "analysis"?

    No, the reason I'm no longer responding to your questions is that it has become apparent that attempting to communicate with you is like trying to discuss nuclear physics with an oak tree.

  8. #83
    r8rh8rmike's Avatar
    r8rh8rmike is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    29 Palms, Ca.
    Age
    55
    Posts
    11,216
    Rep Power
    127

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    And to think this all started with a post that simply talked about Kurt Warner and his family's efforts to do something good.

  9. #84
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    I don't think Palestine was as backwater as some think, so I wouldn't be surprised if a large portion (or at least larger than expected) of the population weren't trilingual. And yes, Paul was highly educated and fluent in all three, but I'd be surprised if the first language he learned wasn't Aramaic. As for the letters, I agree, the original surely were Greek.

    Matthew might, I say might, have been written in Hebrew, but that's a different discussion all together.
    Indeed! Good analysis.

  10. #85
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    What analysis? All you have done on this thread is misquote, mischaracterize and babble. Is that what you consider "analysis"?
    There you go again! LOL. I point out that I pointed out that I pointed out that I actually re-quoted exactly what you had to say. I can't help that you actually said it.

    No, the reason I'm no longer responding to your questions is that it has become apparent that attempting to communicate with you is like trying to discuss nuclear physics with an oak tree.
    At least no longer just deleting you don't like. progress.
    Last edited by AvengerRam; -10-03-2008 at 02:39 PM.

  11. #86
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike View Post
    And to think this all started with a post that simply talked about Kurt Warner and his family's efforts to do something good.
    I know. It's a good thing avengerram was around to make sure that the public was educated as to the dangers of over-deifying a human being, though.

    You can't have too much of that.

  12. #87
    moklerman's Avatar
    moklerman is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Bakersfield, CA
    Age
    43
    Posts
    1,597
    Rep Power
    18

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    In this case, all I see is a puff-piece.
    The problem is, one has to choose to ignore everything else Warner has done and make some leaps and assumptions to take the stance that you have on this particular article. You assume that Warner's motivations are driven by publicity and that his actions aren't genuine unless they are unknown to the general public. To me, that speaks to how little you think of Warner and that you are giving the media way too much credit.

    You seem to react negatively and disproportionally to positive news about Warner. You were, in fact, the first person to respond to this article and it was by no means constructive, much less positive. It's funny that you have read so much into what you think Warner's motivations are when it seems painfully obvious that your actions and approach are laced with ulterior motives.

    But, as you seem to feel it's pointless to respond I have reached my tolerance of your words on this subject. That you think Warner has now decided to "leak" his good deed after 8 years of anonymity just speaks to your bias and nothing else. It's ridiculous.

    If this story had conveniently come out the day after Warner had a horrible game I could see the angling but it came out before his horrid day against the Jets so I don't see how this story isn't being taken at face value. It isn't damage control and it pales in comparison to the many other acts of actual charity and kindness that Warner has been doing for years. He is an athlete that is truly thankful for where he is and how he got there and has chose to give back to fans and people in need.

    With all of the obvious areas of criticism that Warner has earned with his play on the field I just can't fathom why someone would feel the need to talk dirty about things that should be admired. Sounds like a personal problem to me.

  13. #88
    AvengerRam's Avatar
    AvengerRam is offline Moderator Emeritus
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Longwood, Florida, United States
    Age
    46
    Posts
    18,479
    Rep Power
    167

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by moklerman View Post
    I just can't fathom why someone would feel the need to talk dirty
    Hey there! That kind of thing is not allowed on these boards!

  14. #89
    Nick's Avatar
    Nick is online now Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Morgantown, WV
    Age
    31
    Posts
    19,290
    Rep Power
    153

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by moklerman View Post
    When someone close to Warner comes out on a radio show and says that Warner has told them that all of his charitable work has been part of a publicity campaign, I'll consider the possibility that it's true.

    I haven't seen the "IF Warner's acts of charity and generosity are publicity driven, THEN my feelings would be..." from AV.
    But again, the point was that you had no problem talking about things with no basis when it came to Bulger, yet now object to it when the person in question is Warner.

    Using "if-then" before talking about Bulger purposely tanking games doesn't change the fact that such a possibility has no basis behind it. To then come into another thread and criticize someone else for statements about Warner that you feel have no basis or evidence behind them rings a bit hollow to me.

    Obviously you feel differently, but I thought it was worth mentioning as an observer to this debate.

    Carry on.

  15. #90
    atcchris's Avatar
    atcchris is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Dec 2004
    Location
    Bedford, Texas
    Age
    51
    Posts
    300
    Rep Power
    11

    Re: K Warner - no matter what great guy

    Quote Originally Posted by moklerman View Post
    The problem is, one has to choose to ignore everything else Warner has done and make some leaps and assumptions to take the stance that you have on this particular article. You assume that Warner's motivations are driven by publicity and that his actions aren't genuine unless they are unknown to the general public. To me, that speaks to how little you think of Warner and that you are giving the media way too much credit.

    You seem to react negatively and disproportionally to positive news about Warner. You were, in fact, the first person to respond to this article and it was by no means constructive, much less positive. It's funny that you have read so much into what you think Warner's motivations are when it seems painfully obvious that your actions and approach are laced with ulterior motives.

    But, as you seem to feel it's pointless to respond I have reached my tolerance of your words on this subject. That you think Warner has now decided to "leak" his good deed after 8 years of anonymity just speaks to your bias and nothing else. It's ridiculous.

    If this story had conveniently come out the day after Warner had a horrible game I could see the angling but it came out before his horrid day against the Jets so I don't see how this story isn't being taken at face value. It isn't damage control and it pales in comparison to the many other acts of actual charity and kindness that Warner has been doing for years. He is an athlete that is truly thankful for where he is and how he got there and has chose to give back to fans and people in need.

    With all of the obvious areas of criticism that Warner has earned with his play on the field I just can't fathom why someone would feel the need to talk dirty about things that should be admired. Sounds like a personal problem to me.
    I could not agree more.

Page 6 of 8 FirstFirst 12345678 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. The Complete Book of SpiralHorns IV: Legion Eternal
    By AvengerRam in forum SpiralHorn Book 4
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -01-19-2005, 03:13 PM
  2. The Complete Book of SpiralHorns IV: Legion Eternal
    By AvengerRam in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -01-19-2005, 03:13 PM
  3. Warner Will Not Stay As Eli's Backup (CNNSI)
    By AvengerRam in forum NFL TALK
    Replies: 66
    Last Post: -01-08-2005, 02:47 AM
  4. Rich Eisen Interviews Warner....
    By Yodude in forum NFL TALK
    Replies: 3
    Last Post: -10-23-2004, 11:19 AM
  5. Warner wows his receivers
    By Nick in forum NFL TALK
    Replies: 77
    Last Post: -08-17-2004, 05:32 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •