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Thread: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Substitute "African-American" for "gay," and you have a perfect description of the 1940s.
    Yeah. It's going to take time.... Untill it becomes more socially accepted, which I suspect will take a very long time.


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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by citr92 View Post
    .....really?
    Yes really but it was 2010 Draft and Jeff Ireland asked Dez Bryant.

    sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2010/writers/jim_trotter/04/30/dez.bryant.jeff.ireland/index.html?mobile=no

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by Beastified View Post
    Yeah. It's going to take time.... Untill it becomes more socially accepted, which I suspect will take a very long time.
    I don't know....seems pretty socially acceptable now. I mean here we are discussing this and nobody has said they think a player should be moved down or off a board because of their sexual orientation.

    In football terms, I just can't imagine that having any impact on the field. Which begs the question, why in the world did a member of a team staff ask the question?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Heck, if there was a DE who was openly gay and, as a result, ignorant OTs were unwilling to block him, I'd take him in a heartbeat.

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Heck, if there was a DE who was openly gay and, as a result, ignorant OTs were unwilling to block him, I'd take him in a heartbeat.
    Holy crap! That's it! Some team has figured out how to utilize homophobia in football lockerrooms to an advantage on the field.

    Prediction: Andy Dick will lead the league in sacks next season!
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Chris Culliver was so homophobic in the superbowl that he refused to cover or tackle any Ravens players because he doesn't want any physical contact with the same gender.

    I don't like how people in the league just accept the fact that there is a homophobic culture and do nothing to try to change the level of intolerance. It's good that some players have come out for gay rights but it shouldn't be a surprising news story anymore that a handful of NFL players aren't ignorant prejudice *******. Guys like Chris Culliver shouldn't be the norm anywhere in 2013 and the league should do something to improve this.
    Last edited by HUbison; -03-05-2013 at 08:59 AM. Reason: don't swear.

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    I don't know....seems pretty socially acceptable now. I mean here we are discussing this and nobody has said they think a player should be moved down or off a board because of their sexual orientation.

    In football terms, I just can't imagine that having any impact on the field. Which begs the question, why in the world did a member of a team staff ask the question?
    Well... I don't know. I don't think most people here want to say something like that because they don't want to be labled a bigot. Personally, I would remove them completely from my draft board but I have legitament reason for it because I'm more about winning and making the team happy. I don't think there is anything wrong with asking a player about their sexual orientation, because you really don't want to screw up on a draft pick and set your team back several years because no one gets along with them in the locker room.

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by Beastified View Post
    Well... I don't know. I don't think most people here want to say something like that because they don't want to be labled a bigot. Personally, I would remove them completely from my draft board but I have legitament reason for it because I'm more about winning and making the team happy. I don't think there is anything wrong with asking a player about their sexual orientation, because you really don't want to screw up on a draft pick and set your team back several years because no one gets along with them in the locker room.
    Well, I do applaud your honesty.

    So, you think that an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    Well, I do applaud your honesty.

    So, you think that an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team?
    Yes, but it depends on the team surrounding as well. An openly gay player may not have have as big as a negative impact in Pittsburgh as they would in St. Louis -- the youngest and probably most immature team in the league.

    It probably depends on how flamboyant the gay person is about it as well. I would probably introduce the player to some of the teammates beforehand and see how they got along, and I'd ask them how they felt about it. Specifically team leaders like Sjax. If the leaders of the team don't respect somebody, then no one will. So yeah, I think in most situations, an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Beastified

    Yes, but it depends on the team surrounding as well. An openly gay player may not have have as big as a negative impact in Pittsburgh as they would in St. Louis -- the youngest and probably most immature team in the league.

    It probably depends on how flamboyant the gay person is about it as well. I would probably introduce the player to some of the teammates beforehand and see how they got along, and I'd ask them how they felt about it. Specifically team leaders like Sjax. If the leaders of the team don't respect somebody, then no one will. So yeah, I think in most situations, an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team.
    Really? What if he's 6'5, 225 lbs., runs a 4.25 forty, has a 40" vertical, and lead the SEC in receiving for two consecutive years? Would he still be detrimental to the team?

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by Beastified View Post
    Yes, but it depends on the team surrounding as well. An openly gay player may not have have as big as a negative impact in Pittsburgh as they would in St. Louis -- the youngest and probably most immature team in the league.

    It probably depends on how flamboyant the gay person is about it as well. I would probably introduce the player to some of the teammates beforehand and see how they got along, and I'd ask them how they felt about it. Specifically team leaders like Sjax. If the leaders of the team don't respect somebody, then no one will. So yeah, I think in most situations, an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team.
    Interesting.

    But I think it would be fair to say today's society is more accepting of homosexuality than yesterday's society. So with that premise in place, couldn't a very young roster like the Rams be MORE accepting of an openly gay man than an older (ie. yesterday's society) roster?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by Beastified View Post
    Yes, but it depends on the team surrounding as well. An openly gay player may not have have as big as a negative impact in Pittsburgh as they would in St. Louis -- the youngest and probably most immature team in the league.

    It probably depends on how flamboyant the gay person is about it as well. I would probably introduce the player to some of the teammates beforehand and see how they got along, and I'd ask them how they felt about it. Specifically team leaders like Sjax. If the leaders of the team don't respect somebody, then no one will. So yeah, I think in most situations, an openly gay player would be detrimental to a team.
    History shows that progressive first adapters are usually always those who are able to gain a competitive advantage and perform better. The first teams to accept black players were able to perform well because they were not letting bigotry and things that had nothing to do with sports get in the way of their team's success. This idea that we should let society's ignorance and hate dictate which qualified people can and can not be hired is ridiculous and does nothing but hold us back. I'm positive that players didn't respect Jackie Robinson for things that had nothing to do with baseball before he came into the league but I doubt Dodgers fans really cared about things like appeasing the prejudice of the locker room after Robinson made several All Star teams.

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by jmk321 View Post
    History shows that progressive first adapters are usually always those who are able to gain a competitive advantage and perform better. The first teams to accept black players were able to perform well because they were not letting bigotry and things that had nothing to do with sports get in the way of their team's success. This idea that we should let society's ignorance and hate dictate which qualified people can and can not be hired is ridiculous and does nothing but hold us back. I'm positive that players didn't respect Jackie Robinson for things that had nothing to do with baseball before he came into the league but I doubt Dodgers fans really cared about things like appeasing the prejudice of the locker room after Robinson made several All Star teams.
    Hey Mr. Kettle, I'm Mr. Skillet.

    Just because someone doesn't accept homosexuallity, doesn't make them ignorant or hatefull. I have absolutely no hate toward people that are homosexaul. I am also FAR from ignorant. I also don't accept homosexuallity. I have a moral obligation to my GOD to not accept it. Also have a moral obligation to my GOD to love all people. I can love someone, but dislike their life-style; after all, I am far from perfect, so who am I to judge someone else.

    Back to the topic.

    If the team as a unit feels that it would not be harmaful to the locker room, draft whomever. If such a player would cause division in the locker room, and poor play on the field, don't draft such a player.

    I once bought a home from an openly gay couple. After that transaction, I became a frequent customer of their business. You know why? They never did anything to make me feel uncomfortable. They treated me like a normal human being, just like I treated them. Had either one of them tried to firt with me, or made sexual advances, things would have been different. I feel that is the biggest key of an openly gay player in any sport. Can they treat their fellow teams like normal human beings, or will they flirt and make sexual advances.


    gap

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by gap View Post
    Hey Mr. Kettle, I'm Mr. Skillet.

    Just because someone doesn't accept homosexuallity, doesn't make them ignorant or hatefull. I have absolutely no hate toward people that are homosexaul. I am also FAR from ignorant. I also don't accept homosexuallity. I have a moral obligation to my GOD to not accept it. Also have a moral obligation to my GOD to love all people. I can love someone, but dislike their life-style; after all, I am far from perfect, so who am I to judge someone else.

    Back to the topic.

    If the team as a unit feels that it would not be harmaful to the locker room, draft whomever. If such a player would cause division in the locker room, and poor play on the field, don't draft such a player.

    I once bought a home from an openly gay couple. After that transaction, I became a frequent customer of their business. You know why? They never did anything to make me feel uncomfortable. They treated me like a normal human being, just like I treated them. Had either one of them tried to firt with me, or made sexual advances, things would have been different. I feel that is the biggest key of an openly gay player in any sport. Can they treat their fellow teams like normal human beings, or will they flirt and make sexual advances.


    gap
    We have had this discussion in America about employment and opportunity about every group that is not a straight white male with English decent. It happened with the Irish, it has happened with African Americans and it happened with women entering the work force in the middle of the 20th century. Every time this happens there are people that feel uncomfortable because they have preconceived notions about how a certain group will not fit in when in reality they just don't like the change that is happening because they will have to be around someone who is different. These things are going to keep happening and the people that decide to exclude gay men because they feel that gay men are incapable of being professional and will try to flirt with any male around them will be on the same side of history as the people who wanted to exclude women from the work force because they thought men and women could not work together without making sexual advances toward each other.

    Our country is better when more qualified people are allowed to enter the work force. We are better when qualified gay men and women are able to enter the military and protect us, we are better when smart women are able to enter the workforce and we are better when qualified black people are able to enter the work force. Decreasing our human capital just because some people have prejudices about others due to their race, gender or sexuality is limiting us and is a good way to fall behind others who are willing to ignore preconceived opinions.

    Also don't use the religion thing as an excuse either. You are allowed to feel however you want about homosexuality, but you can't deny people rights or opportunity because of these feelings. People have used religion for centuries to argue for segregation, slavery and to deny women's rights and this is no different.

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    Re: Questions re: Sexual Orientation at Combine

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Really? What if he's 6'5, 225 lbs., runs a 4.25 forty, has a 40" vertical, and lead the SEC in receiving for two consecutive years? Would he still be detrimental to the team?
    Doesn't matter how good he is if the rest of the team doesn't get along with him/feels uncomfortable, ultimately bringing the team's performance down.

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