Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast
Results 1 to 15 of 24
Like Tree10Likes

Thread: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

  1. #1
    TorontoRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Saint Louis
    Posts
    220
    Rep Power
    2

    Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    has convinced me, even more than watching RGIII and Kapernick this season that a mobile, ground gaining, quarterback is the present and future of the NFL, because they can beat you with their legs as well as his arms. The multiple options that an OC has when his QB can scamper are amazing. And, then, it dawned on me that Johnny Football may be on the Draft board in 2014 (after packing on a few pounds albeit not a Tebow-like 35 or so) or 2015 at the latest, but probably 2014. My oh my what an NFL franchise who might be in the market for a QB could do with that kid! However, said franchise would have to have a lousy 2013 season to do so. Maybe some GMs will be rooting for their oponents next season ()


  2. #2
    Rammed's Avatar
    Rammed is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2007
    Location
    Netherlands
    Posts
    404
    Rep Power
    8

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    This feels like the Wishbone, Wildcat, Cam Newtown, Wide 9, HB-TE it takes coaches/coordinators one season to figure them out.

    Let's wait and see what the run option QB looks like next season. I for one aint buying!

  3. #3
    Rambos's Avatar
    Rambos is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Cali
    Age
    50
    Posts
    8,968
    Rep Power
    74

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Well lets see how it works out in the NFL playoffs. There are three QBs that will be a passing and running threat. Lets see who has the ring when it's all said and done. History says it will be a pocket passer and I tend to agree.
    citr92 likes this.

  4. #4
    citr92 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2012
    Location
    California
    Posts
    2,173
    Rep Power
    8

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    exactly...look at oregon's qbs, don't see any of them playing...maybe dixon, but only very, very sparingly

    manziel won't be able to do that in the nfl, especially if he wants a longer career

    now there's film on him, they'll be keying on him next year for sure

  5. #5
    RAMFANRAIDERHATER's Avatar
    RAMFANRAIDERHATER is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Surf City USA
    Age
    61
    Posts
    2,277
    Rep Power
    56

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    There's a reason it doesn't work (for long) in the NFL.

    Players are better on defense top to bottom.

    A scrambling option type QB doesn't last long before they go down with an injury. There's no way that style of play will last long in the NFL with the bigger, stronger defensive players of today. Linebackers at 240 can run with most of these QB's. Unless they're really fast like RGIII, but even RGIII got caught and eventually, hurt.

    You can't compare what goes on in the college game with the NFL. No, a traditional pocket QB with quick release and the right scheme will be around for a long time. It helps if that drop back QB is mobile, don't get me wrong, but if you put the QB in harms way too often, you will pay with an injured QB.

    Case in point. I'm bettin' that "Johnny Football" will be the next Tim Tebow.
    Last edited by RAMFANRAIDERHATER; -01-05-2013 at 05:36 PM.
    ZiaRam likes this.
    Faithful Rams fan since 1968

  6. #6
    TorontoRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Saint Louis
    Posts
    220
    Rep Power
    2

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    I appreciate the feedback, which seems unanimous regarding how he'll fare in the NFL, but this kid, IMHO has some things that the other NFLers mentioned don't have:
    He's said to read defenses extraordinarily well and scampters wheh he should and doesn't when he shouldn't
    He's said to possess amazing 'quickness' in addition raw speed and can change direction on a dime
    He's said to be about as poised as a QB can get
    I could go on, but my intention is not to belabor the point. I was so impressed with his performance against two pretty good teams and two pretty good coaches (Stups' Sooners and the Crimson Tide) that it's fairly certain that he'll be in the Draft by 2014 unless he chooses not to go and I'd love to see him in the NFL in which case he'll have to prove his metal as does every other QB in the league including ours.

  7. #7
    RockinRam's Avatar
    RockinRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Apr 2008
    Location
    TX
    Posts
    4,074
    Rep Power
    44

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Johnny Manziel =/= Tim Tebow


    1) The difference between Manziel and RGIII is that Manziel is able to avoid hard hits from the defense while RGIII cannot.

    2) Manziel also has underrated throwing ability, while Tebow has overrated throwing ability. There are no similarities at all between the two. Only the lazy/ignorant fans who don't watch Manziel play can compare him to Tebow because they both "run".

    3) Having tape of him doesn't mean anything. Opposing teams had tape on him from the previous games this season. Didn't seem to work did it?

    4) Alabama's defense is as pro as there is in the NCAA. They couldn't stop Johnny either.


    To reiterate, expect Manziel to have a solid year again next year due to self-improvements and the improvements of his teammates. If you want to compare him to someone currently in the NFL, compare him to Russell Wilson. Manziel is obviously more talented, but they are somewhat the same size and can extend plays with both their arms and legs and are more shifty and elusive than the average running QB.
    Tampa_Ram and sosa39rams like this.

  8. #8
    RAMFANRAIDERHATER's Avatar
    RAMFANRAIDERHATER is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2006
    Location
    Surf City USA
    Age
    61
    Posts
    2,277
    Rep Power
    56

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    When I said the next Tim Tebow, I meant great college career, not so much in the NFL.

    We'll see...
    Faithful Rams fan since 1968

  9. #9
    TorontoRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Saint Louis
    Posts
    220
    Rep Power
    2

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Quote Originally Posted by Rambos View Post
    Well lets see how it works out in the NFL playoffs. There are three QBs that will be a passing and running threat. Lets see who has the ring when it's all said and done. History says it will be a pocket passer and I tend to agree.
    First of all, you can't lose because two of em are playing one another tomorrow night. Quite a stretch eh! In that case, I'll bet ya that a scrambling QB's team wins tomorrow night's game. Okay?

    Second, you only need one ring to be a SB champ, since this is not a marathon in the NFL (a la the Rams) this is a sprint.

    Third, who's the third QB? Luck? NIMHO. If not Luck, who?

    Ask 'Stupes' how old man football worked out for him. When they had to throw Katey bar the door! Ball A&M. Game over!

    Gosh, I love these smiley faces!
    Last edited by TorontoRam; -01-05-2013 at 06:29 PM.

  10. #10
    TorontoRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Aug 2012
    Location
    Saint Louis
    Posts
    220
    Rep Power
    2

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Thanks for asking the Manziel v. Tebow question. I know Johnny Manziel and Tim Tebow is no Johnny Manziel or else Rex Ryan would have his jersey on his wife's body on his tat. LMAO.

  11. #11
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,411
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    I actually really like Manziel. I dont think he's going to be a top 25 prospect when he comes out, but I do believe he can be a serious steal for a team willing to take a chance on him. He's going to slip just like Russell Wilson did. This league is so complex and yet miss the simplest things. He's going to slide only because he isn't a prototypical 6'5 240lb QB, but he gets the job done.

    Just like Wilson he is short. Though everyone and their mothers knew that Wilson could throw, was extremely intelligent, and had the ability to extend plays with his feet. I think Manziel can be the exact same, just needs to work on his deep ball.

    He clearly has all the motivation a man needs. Redshirted, the guy brought himself up from nothing really. Excited to see him come draft time.
    Tampa_Ram and RockinRam like this.


    THE DREAM TEAM

  12. #12
    NJ Ramsfan1 is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Sep 2008
    Location
    new jersey
    Posts
    2,193
    Rep Power
    69

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Quote Originally Posted by TorontoRam View Post
    has convinced me, even more than watching RGIII and Kapernick this season that a mobile, ground gaining, quarterback is the present and future of the NFL, because they can beat you with their legs as well as his arms. The multiple options that an OC has when his QB can scamper are amazing. And, then, it dawned on me that Johnny Football may be on the Draft board in 2014 (after packing on a few pounds albeit not a Tebow-like 35 or so) or 2015 at the latest, but probably 2014. My oh my what an NFL franchise who might be in the market for a QB could do with that kid! However, said franchise would have to have a lousy 2013 season to do so. Maybe some GMs will be rooting for their oponents next season ()

    They said the same thing when Randall Cunningham entered the league and was successful. Michael Vick, Kordell Stewart, Jake Plummer- all guys who were supposed to change the way the position was played. Never happened. This league has been and always will be a drop back passer league.

    That is not to say that there won't be a few guys from time to time that can scramble around and cause problems for defenses. Certain elements of the position will evolve, but these guys will remain the exception for two reasons. One, NFL defenses from top to bottom are 10 times as quick as the college game. What works in college doesn't work in the pros- that's why they don't run the option, the wishbone, etc. And two, QBs must engage in self-preservation if they want to survive for any length of time in the pros. It does not benefit them to scramble around and risk serious injury. You saw the scares involving RGIII this season; don't expect this to become a trend.

  13. #13
    Rambos's Avatar
    Rambos is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Cali
    Age
    50
    Posts
    8,968
    Rep Power
    74

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Quote Originally Posted by TorontoRam View Post
    First of all, you can't lose because two of em are playing one another tomorrow night. Quite a stretch eh!
    That's true but two pocket passers are playing in the first game... one will lose.

    In that case, I'll bet ya that a scrambling QB's team wins tomorrow night's game. Okay?
    I bet you neither one goes to the show!

    Second, you only need one ring to be a SB champ, since this is not a marathon in the NFL (a la the Rams) this is a sprint.
    If you are saying they don't need to have long careers... I agree they won't. But even in the short run the defense in the playoffs gets even tougher. In the short term these guys have about two years before the D coordinators stop the pistol and the option IMO.

    Third, who's the third QB? Luck? NIMHO. If not Luck, who?
    It's not Luck, how many times have you seen him run the option? None, and how many times have you seen him in the pistol none. Yes he can run and so can Aaron Rogers but they are not using the option to create passing lanes and creating misdirection with the play action out of the pistol formation.

    Ask 'Stupes' how old man football worked out for him. When they had to throw Katey bar the door! Ball A&M. Game over!
    Well lets see how it works out in the NFL playoffs.
    Gosh, I love these smiley faces!


    Whatever floats your boat...
    Last edited by Rambos; -01-05-2013 at 08:03 PM.

  14. #14
    TekeRam's Avatar
    TekeRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    May 2007
    Location
    Lexington, Kentucky, United States
    Age
    30
    Posts
    3,869
    Rep Power
    71

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    For the ongoing question, the third running QB is in our very own division... Colin Kapernick. Everyone forget about him? The guy we beat once and should have a second.

    Here's my thinking. Yes, a mobile quarterback who threatens to run at any time is dynamic and can break a game wide open. Look at what RGIII does, he freezes the linebackers and opens up the intermediate routes for receivers. The problem is that the NFL as a whole is injury prone. There's a reason why no one will break Brett Favre's ironman record. The defenses are faster and bigger than ever before.

    I actually was hoping to see what Tebow could do in a second year of starting, because I think he could actually be successful as a running QB. Why? He's not fast, but he has the bulk to hit the linebacker and put the hurt on him like Jax does. His problem is that he isn't accurate anytime before the 4th quarter. In a system that actually works, I think Cam Newton could be great. Because he has the bulk to withstand hits.

    A smaller QB like Vick, RGIII, Wilson, or Kapernick who goes downfield is going to end up on the wrong side of a Ray Lewis who will rip his leg off. Give me a drop back passer who won't get hit as much and has some size to take the hits. I know that he can last for 20 games, which is the most important thing to me.
    I believe!

  15. #15
    gap's Avatar
    gap
    gap is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2009
    Location
    North Carolina
    Posts
    1,230
    Rep Power
    25

    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    There's a reason why no one will break Brett Favre's ironman record. The defenses are faster and bigger than ever before.
    They also do a better job of drug testing for pain killers.

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    A smaller QB like Vick, RGIII, Wilson, or Kapernick who goes downfield is going to end up on the wrong side of a Ray Lewis who will rip his leg off.
    Unfortunately, Ray is retiring after this year.

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    Give me a drop back passer who won't get hit as much and has some size to take the hits. I know that he can last for 20 games, which is the most important thing to me.
    Amen on the 20 games, and winning the last one. Although, I'd be happier 19 wins.


    gap

Page 1 of 2 12 LastLast

Similar Threads

  1. Johnny Hekker
    By Stone Cold Tavon Austin in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 6
    Last Post: -10-10-2012, 06:06 PM
  2. Throwing Johnny Hekker a Rams' secret weapon?
    By MauiRam in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 9
    Last Post: -08-02-2012, 08:54 PM
  3. Anyone else watching Arz vs Sf?
    By mcpeepants232003 in forum NFL TALK
    Replies: 17
    Last Post: -11-30-2010, 03:39 PM
  4. Watching the Cowboys O...
    By Varg6 in forum RAM TALK
    Replies: 0
    Last Post: -09-07-2008, 04:27 PM
  5. Are you watching the NHL playoofs?
    By Revelstoke in forum OTHER SPORTS
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: -05-01-2008, 01:19 PM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •