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Thread: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

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    Barry Waller is offline Registered User
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    2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    It's probably a good thing the Rams have a couple high picks in this year's draft, and a pretty high second rounder.

    That's because this draft looks to be one of the weakest in years, and comparing it to a good crop like 2012 or 2013, is a clear indication just how weak this one could be in some areas.
    In a couple, where 2012 or 2013 was a very weak year, this year does have better talent, but not necessarily top ten type talent.

    The weakness early is clearly why so many quarterbacks are rising to top ten pick projections, and also so many more geting to the top 40.

    Lets do a ranking of where next year's first round picks would rate if the very solid 2012 pool and last year's, and next year's are combined.

    The rating # is my own

    Quarterback:
    1. Andrew Luck 2012 9.9
    2. RG III 2012 9.5
    3. Ryan Tannehill 2012 8.5
    4. Teddy Bridgewater 2014 8.5
    5. Russell Wilson 2012 8.0
    6. Johnnie Maziel 2014 8.0
    7. Brett Hundley 2014 7.8
    8. E.J Manuel 2013 7.8
    9. Geno Smith 2013 7.5

    Not even close 2012 vs 2014, and 2013 worst of all

    Running Back
    1. Trent Richardson 2012 9.0
    2. Doug Martin 2012 8.5
    3. David Wilson 2012 8.2
    4. Eddie Lacey 2013 8.0
    5. Giovani Bernard 2013 8.0
    6. LeVeon Bell 2013 8.0
    7. Monte Ball 2013 8.0
    8. Melvin Gordon 2014 8.0
    9. KaDeem Carey 2014 8.0
    10.. Lache Seastrunk 2014 8.0
    2
    No year super strong, but bigger name college stars in 2012 and 2013.

    Wide Receiver
    1. Justin Blackmon 2012 9.0
    2. Sammie Watkins 2014 9.0
    3. Tavon Austin 2013 9.0
    4. Mike Evans 2014 8.8
    5. Marquise Lee 2014 8.5
    6. DeAngelo Hopkins 2013 8.5
    7. Cordarelle Patterson 2013 8.5
    8.. Michael Floyd 2012 8.3
    9.. Kendall Wright 2012 8.2
    10. Justin Hunter 2013 8.0

    2014 is better than 2012, not as good as 2013

    Tight End
    1, TYler Eiffert 2013 9.0
    2. Zach Ertz 2013 9.0
    3. Gavin Escobar 2013 8.5
    4. Jack Amaro 2014 8.5
    2. Coby Fleener 2012 8.2
    3. Austin Seferian-Jenkins 2014 8.0

    2013 by far the best here

    Offensive Tackles
    1. Eric Fisher 2013 9.8
    2. Luke Joeckel 2013 9.8
    3. Jake Matthews 2014 9.7
    4. Matt Kalil 2012 9.5
    5. Taylor Lewan 2014 9.5
    6. Lane Johnson 2013 9.5
    7.. Riley Reiff 2012 9.2
    8. DJ Fluker 2013 9.0
    9. Cameron Erving 2014 9.0
    10. Cyrus Kouandjio 2014 9.0

    Pretty close to equal here

    Center/Guard
    1. Jon Cooper 2013 9.3
    2. Chance Warmack 2013 9.3
    3. David DeCastro 2012 9.0
    4. Kyle Long 2013 8.8
    5.. Kevin Zeitler 2012 8.8
    6.. Cyril Richardson 2014 8.8
    7. Zack Martin 2014 8.3
    8. Travis Swanson 2014 8.0
    9.. Peter Konz 2012 8.0
    10. Travis Frederick 2013 8.0

    More depth this year, but not as good at the top as the other two years

    Defensive End
    1. Jadeveon Clowney 2014 9.8
    2. Bruce Irvin 2012 9.0
    3. Dion Jordan 2013 9.0
    4. Ziggy Ansah 2013 9.0
    5. Barkevious Mingo 2013 9.0
    6. Bjorn Werner 2013 8.8
    7. Datone Jones 2013 8.8
    8. Quinton Coples 2012 8.8
    9. Melivin Ingram 2012 8.5
    10. Shea McClellan 2012 8.5
    11. Chandler Jones 2012 8.5
    12. Vic Beasley 2014 8.4
    13. Trent Murphy 2014 8.0

    Clowney better than any of the 2012 crop or 2013, but after that it isn't close, with 2013 the best.

    Defensive Tackle
    1. Sheldon Richardson 2013 9.4
    2. Star Lotuleilei 2013 9.4
    3. Dontari Poe 2012 9.0
    4.. Fletcher Cox 2012 9.0
    5. Michael Brockers 2012 9.0
    6.. Louis Nix 2014 8.8
    7. RaShede Hageman 2014 8.8
    8. Sharif Floyd 2013 8.5
    9.. Will Sutton 2014 8.5
    10.. Ego Ferguson 2014 8.5
    11. Timmy Jernigan 2014 8.5

    2013 better at the top, 2012 still very solid, but good depth in 2014 in late round one/ early round two, if not real early guys.


    Linebackers
    1. Luke Kuechley 2012 9.7
    2. Anthony Barr 2014 9.5
    3. C.J Mosley 2014 9.5
    4. Jarvis Jones 2013 9.4
    5. Khalil Mack 2014 9.4
    6. Alec Ogletree 2013 9.4
    5. Ryan Shazier 2014 9.0
    6. Kyle Van Noy 2014 9.0
    7. Manti Te'o 2013 8.8
    8. Kevin Minter 2013 8.7

    Next year is a far better year t5hyan 2012, though Kuechley was, and is very special. 2014 better than 2013

    Defensive Backs
    1. Dee Milliner 2013 9.4
    2. Morris Claiborne 2012 9.0
    3.. Mark Barron 2012 9.0
    4.. Stephon Gilmore 2012 8.8
    5.. Dre Kirkpatrick 2012 8.7
    6. Kenny Vaccaro 2013 8.7
    7. Eric Reid 2013 8.7
    8.. Harrison Smith 2012 8.7
    9. Desmond Trufant 2013 8.7
    10.. Janoris Jenkins 2012 8.7
    11.. Hasean Clinton Dix 2014 8.5
    12. Xavier Rhodes 2013 8.5
    13. Matt Elam 2013 8.5
    14. Jason Verrett 2014 8.5
    15. Justin Gilbert 2014 8.5
    16.. Bradley Robey 2014 8.5

    Not even close this year to 2012 or 2013, which is a bad break for the Rams.
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    Barry Waller

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Good comparison, thanks for sharing it!

    Did Eric Ebron factor into your tight end rankings when comparing this upcoming 2014 class to previous years?

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Nice breakdown one thing that could help us though is there seem to be more teams desperate for a QB this year than last.

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    So is this ranking system where they are right now or where they were at the time they got drafted?

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Nice job Barry. Strengthens my belief that we may be well served with an OLB in round 1 either at Washington's pick or ours, presumably outside the top 10.

    Go Rams!

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Quote Originally Posted by mde8352gorams View Post
    Nice job Barry. Strengthens my belief that we may be well served with an OLB in round 1 either at Washington's pick or ours, presumably outside the top 10.

    Go Rams!
    I agree with you, I'm not that opposed to drafting a stud OLB in the first round as others on this forum are. Either way you can't go wrong with Barr or Mack (maybe even Mosely), though I doubt Barr will fall out the top-5.

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    I don't get the logic of a first round linebacker unless the guy is the next coming of Lawrence Taylor. JL and Olgetree are our top two LB and Dunbar is more than adequate. A new guy will at *best* be the 3rd LBer and will sit a lot. Are we good enough and deep enough to do that? OL make more sense if Matthews is there (he should be); and if there is a #1 type of WR, that even makes more sense. Heck, I think QB might even make more sense!
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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Quote Originally Posted by chiguy View Post
    I don't get the logic of a first round linebacker unless the guy is the next coming of Lawrence Taylor. JL and Olgetree are our top two LB and Dunbar is more than adequate. A new guy will at *best* be the 3rd LBer and will sit a lot. Are we good enough and deep enough to do that? OL make more sense if Matthews is there (he should be); and if there is a #1 type of WR, that even makes more sense. Heck, I think QB might even make more sense!
    I somewhat agree, but the Rams have invested so much draft-wise into the WR position over the years that I'd hate to see them use another pick on one. Gilyard, T Austin, Quick, Salas, Givens, Pettis, Bailey… all of them taken from Rounds 1-4. I agree we need a stud #1 receiver, but there's no Megatron or AJ Green in this draft that are sure things.

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    Quote Originally Posted by chiguy View Post
    I don't get the logic of a first round linebacker unless the guy is the next coming of Lawrence Taylor. JL and Olgetree are our top two LB and Dunbar is more than adequate. A new guy will at *best* be the 3rd LBer and will sit a lot. Are we good enough and deep enough to do that? OL make more sense if Matthews is there (he should be); and if there is a #1 type of WR, that even makes more sense. Heck, I think QB might even make more sense!
    I disagree with the assessment of Dunbar. He's OK at best. But remember he'll be a free agent after the season ends so you will either pay him substantial money to keep him or you can upgrade with a player like Barr and pay far less. Don't forget Dunbar is also one bad drug test from a season long suspension or whatever the 2nd offense costs. I reserve judgment on Barr until the Combine, but as of now he could be a really outstanding 3 down OLB for us. Another threat to the QB along with Quinn, Long and Brockers.

    Go Rams!

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    I don't understand your rating system, Barry.

    It seems like there are two ways to rate players who were taken in prior drafts: (1) you can rate based upon how they were perceived before they were drafted (which would be comparable to the way you are rating the 2014 prospects), or (2) you could rate them based upon their current status, having played in the NFL for at least 12 games.

    Rather than selecting one of these methods, it appears that you have mixed those concepts.

    For example, you gave Russell Wilson what seems to be a first round grade of 8.0. While that makes sense now, clearly nobody (not even the Seahawks) gave him a first round grade before the 2012 draft. On the other hand, you gave Manti Te'o a grade of 8.8, which might have made sense when he a Heisman frontrunner, but certainly is not be supported by his play as a rookie.

    At this point, when we don't know which underclassmen will declare, and we have not had the benefit of the Senior Bowl, the Combine or Pro Days, I think its premature to say its a weak draft. Let's not forget... on December 9, 2012, NOBODY thought Eric Fisher was a candidate to be the first pick in the draft.
    Last edited by AvengerRam; -12-09-2013 at 07:21 PM.
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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    To your point Av Notre Dame junior NT Louis Nix III has signed with an agent and will declare for the draft. I'm sure he's not the only one that will be added to the draft.

    Another factor for me is how deep is the draft at positions of need for the Rams.

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    UH, it's basically the Kiper rating system, with my early opinion of skills, stats, experience comparison to earlier drafts at the position. Lots of room to rise and fall before April.

    9.6- 10 Blue chipper with instant Pro Bowl potential (Top 10 picks in average draft)
    9.0-9.5 Pretty sure instant starter with pro bowl potential (Round one 10-32)
    8.6-8.9 Good players who can be expected to start some day, usually guys with some negative (raw, needs bulking up, small college etc) ( upper half Round Two)
    8.0-8.5 Should make a roster, has a chance to start at some point (late Rd 2- rd3).
    7.6-7.9 Has a chance to make a team as a backup/journeyman (Mid Rounders)
    7.0-7.5 Special team type only not much chance.(Late round, free agents)
    UNDER 7.9 - really a long shot to ever make an NFL roster (camp invitees)
    Barry Waller

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    <<Another factor for me is how deep is the draft at positions of need for the Rams.>>

    Depth is good at DT, and LB, and CB, not at safety, but I think a VETERAN is badly needed (they blew it with Mikell)

    Not a good top 10 though at DT, and especially CB.

    Nix is more a 3-4 NT and he had a bad year. First rounder yes, top ten no.
    Barry Waller

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    <<I think its premature to say its a weak draft.>

    I'm not the only one saying it, because it's true.

    And I has at least three OT at the top of round one in November, though I thought Matthews and Lewan would be two of them, along with Joeckel.

    It's not about whet her a few players will run well at the combine and see their stock improve, it's about the huge difference in guys I would rate 9.0 and better this year from thelast two.

    In December 2012, everyone knew about Dion Jordan, Bark Mingo, Dee Milliner, Tavon Austin, DJ Fluker, Chance Warmack, Sheldon Richardson, Star Luteleilei, among other high picks.

    You simply don't have that caliber this year. Last year I knew all about Vaccaro, Reid, Elam,
    safeties, but this year Clinton-Dix is about the only one I know much about, and i don't like what i see all that much, where I loved those guys last year.

    Sorry, but I've been doing this for 40 years plus, and THIS is a bad draft, except at QB and OL and maybe OLB.

    Is it as weak as 2009, a year I consider one of THE worst round one talent ever? Probably not because of te QB and OL.

    But it's certainly one of the worst at the top I've covered as a n OBSESSED draftnik. You have no idea how much time I spend on thsi stuff, especially since I started covering the Rams as a member of the local media.

    Someone has to go top ten, so it's about whether teams reach, or take an OT, QB , Barr, or Clowney
    Barry Waller

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    Re: 2013 vs 2014 Draft ; NO Comparison

    <<So is this ranking system where they are right now or where they were at the time they got drafted?>.

    Obviously whe they were drafted, or Russell WIlson would be WAY higher.
    Barry Waller

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