Chris Long vs. Glen Dorsey

[RamsSB99]

Originally Posted by From Jim Thomas Article

Dorsey wouldn't give the Rams the edge rusher they need at defensive end, but some at Rams Park are convinced he could consistently push the pocket from the inside, putting up eight to 10 sacks per season.

If you where drafting for the Rams and thought Dorsey could give you 8-10 sacks from the DT position would that be more valuable then having Chris Long and him giving you possibly 10 or more. IMO having someone that can create consistent pressure up the middle would help the whole DL.

Would you rather have Dorsey if you projected him getting 8-10 sacks or Long if you projected him getting 10 sacks?

[Rambos]

I would take C. Long, AC playing UT will get 2-4 and Ryan will get 2-4. How many pressures, balls knocked down and tackles will C. Long have?

[harrydog]

If it weren't for the injury concerns I'd prefer Dorsey by a slim margin.

[Goldenfleece]

I think it's an unfair comparison. From 2001-2007, Warren Sapp capped 10 sacks just once, Rod Coleman achieved that mark 3 times, and John Randle managed it once. Those are the only DTs who got 10 sacks in a season anytime during that period. Meanwhile, 12 defensive ends got 10 sacks in 2007 alone. When you figure in another 4 OLBs from the 3-4 who surpassed that mark, that puts 10 sacks as about average for the top outside rusher on a team.

So what if Glenn Dorsey was the greatest defensive tackle of his generation and Chris Long was a very pedestrian defensive end? Well, I think the choice would be obvious. But you're giving Dorsey the best possible scenario and Long a scenario where he would underperform the expectations of a first round pick. Defensive Ends Mark Anderson and Justin Tuck have had 10 sack seasons as backups recently, and even Bryce Fisher had 9 sacks as a backup for us.

[Mooselini]

It's Chris Long for sure. As mentioned, Dorsey won't fill our need at DE. We need a good pass rush from the outside. If we only keep it coming from the inside, teams start to pick up on it and block the middle a bit better, which may leave a player to 2 sacks a year. =/

Taking Chris Long will force teams to make sure the outside is being watched while the inside (in our case Adam Carriker and Clifton Ryan) to push through and reach the QB. Little may be old, but he's not out of the equation yet either. Having Chris Long on the otherside of Leonard Little may be an amazing thing for this squad.

[harrydog]

Originally Posted by Goldenfleece

I think it's an unfair comparison. From 2001-2007, Warren Sapp capped 10 sacks just once, Rod Coleman achieved that mark 3 times, and John Randle managed it once. Those are the only DTs who got 10 sacks in a season anytime during that period. Meanwhile, 12 defensive ends got 10 sacks in 2007 alone. When you figure in another 4 OLBs from the 3-4 who surpassed that mark, that puts 10 sacks as about average for the top outside rusher on a team.

So what if Glenn Dorsey was the greatest defensive tackle of his generation and Chris Long was a very pedestrian defensive end? Well, I think the choice would be obvious. But you're giving Dorsey the best possible scenario and Long a scenario where he would underperform the expectations of a first round pick. Defensive Ends Mark Anderson and Justin Tuck have had 10 sack seasons as backups recently, and even Bryce Fisher had 9 sacks as a backup for us.

Forget Dorsey sacks. If a DT can consistently stop the run, collapse the pocket and get pressure up the middle, all while being double teamed, he will enable others to get many more sacks than they would otherwise. That's the value in a Glenn Dorsey.

[Goldenfleece]

Originally Posted by harrydog

Forget Dorsey sacks. If a DT can consistently stop the run, collapse the pocket and get pressure up the middle, all while being double teamed, he will enable others to get many more sacks than they would otherwise. That's the value in a Glenn Dorsey.

Well, my point was that one of the predictions was extremely optimistic, while the other was somewhat pessimistic. I would expect the poll results to be somewhat skewed given the choice.

On the sack question, though, NFL.com's profile lists 13 sacks and 7 QB pressures in 51 games (the equivalent of 3+ NFL seasons). That doesn't sound like incredible pressure, especially for a guy who is supposed to be this pass rushing monster.

[RealRam]

We're talking, of course, about two excellent prospects here and in addition to their respective DE / DT attributes (including potential number of sacks), I also underscore the character strengths that both of these young men bring to the team, even as rookies just now initiating their leaarning curve in the NFL.

IMO, the league is especially fortunate this year to have three, four, five young athletes that are truly fine individuals entering the 1st round. Both Long and Dorsey come across as having a high degree of self awareness, discipline, and desire. They both seem to be humble, eager, coachable. That's sports smartness exemplified.

Accordingly, the Rams are especially fortunate to have an 'easy' pick from at least three of these four collegiate standouts simply because they play DL. And the Clan has established that the Rams CANNOT go wrong with the 2008 Draft.


That said and in response to SB99's poll, to me ... the slight edge goes to Chris Long. He seems to be more promising in that respect -- character -- perhaps an earlier and more solid maturity too, his dad being a clear and strong influence, no doubt.


Who can say we know that much of either player, C. Long or G. Dorsey; but I've researched a bit on them -- anyone here that hasn't? And I sure wouldn't say that Chris Long is the next Jack Youngblood!

But he certainly appears to be in that class.



PS: For the record, I'm hoping we go for Gholston.

[txramsfan]

If those stats were correct, it has to be Dorsey. Hands down. C'mon a DT getting that many sacks? We could put the punter then at DE and he'd get at least 5.

[HUbison]

Originally Posted by txramsfan

If those stats were correct, it has to be Dorsey. Hands down. C'mon a DT getting that many sacks? We could put the punter then at DE and he'd get at least 5.

Tx, last year we couldn't put a DE in at DE and get 5 sacks!

[txramsfan]

But those stats weren't there last year HUb. If those stats are there this year.....

[MauiRam]

This has been a great debate throughout several threads. I am leaning toward Dorsey at this point, however, I can't help but think how shocked we'll all be if Miami were to select Dorsey. There has been virtually no mention of where they might be going with their #1. For sure we've heard why Dorsey won't be the Phin's pick - square peg - round hole argument, but with the Tuna, one never knows ..

I am still leaning toward Dorsey at this point, but if Chris Long is still there and we take him I'm not going to cry - if nothing else, the Rams will finally get some love from Howie. Gholston kind of scares me .. at number #2 overall anyway. After all this debate over Dorsey vs C. Long, there is a chance we might end up with J. Long instead ...:x

[Shan the Ram Man]

:r Chris long won't be there to take at 2nd pick. It will either be Dorsey or Gholston . The Rams should take Gholston & another DE in 3rd RD of draft. Possible picks in 3rd RD (Darrell Robertson , Jeremy Thompson).

[39thebeast]

Its not all about the sacks at DT guys. If Dorsey can consistently draw the double like he did in college and get 5-8 sacks i'll be extremely happy. Heres why when a DT draws the double DE's are getting one one match ups that makes it easier for them to get to the QB. I think this would make up for a guy like Adam Carriker's lack of speed of the edge.

Just look how Dorsey affected guys around him like AL Woods, Kirsten Pittman and Tyson Jackson (who has been compared to and is verry comparable to Carriker) Just watch LSU this year all of them won't be as good and they are going to wish they came out with Dorsey especially Jackson. I would be ecstatic to get a high impact player and put him in our line up and make the guys around him better

[39thebeast]

A better comparison than Warren Sapp for Dorsey is Tommy Harris. Look at the defensive decrease of all the players in Chicago especially in sacks when Harris was out. I would expect Dorsey to have a similar or better stat progression throughout his career than Tommie Harris if he stays healthy