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Thread: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

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    A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    I posted this on another site but wanted to see what others here thought.

    PLEASE READ:
    This is not my preferred draft. I prefer trading down and I prefer Blackmon in this draft over Kalil. I just wanted to see what a draft would look like with Kalil. Kalil will either go #2 or #3 IMO. So the only way we draft Kalil is if we stay at #2. This draft includes the Rams drafting with no trades. I still like the looks of this team using this draft scenario.


    Draft:
    1 Matt Kalil OT 6'7 295
    2 Dontari Poe DT 6'5 350
    3 Keith Zeitler OG 6-4 318
    4 Nigel Bradham SLB 6'3 240
    6 Asa Jackson CB 5' 11 190 4.4 40
    7 Chris Rainey RB 5'8 175 4.36 40

    Resign:
    Brandon Lloyd WR 6'0 188 31

    Sign:
    Nick Hardwick C 6'4 310 31
    Jason Jones DT 6'5 280 25
    Cortland Finnegan 5'10 190 28
    One Of: V. Jackson WR 6'5 230 29, M. Colston WR 6'4 225 29, D. Bowe WR 6'2 221 28

    Offense:
    QB – Sam Bradford 6’4 235
    RB – Steven Jackson 6'2 235 28 /Chris Rainey 5'8 180 4.36 40
    FB – Brit Miller 6’0 245 25
    TE – Lance Kendricks 6’3 250 4.50 40
    WR1 – Vincent Jackson 6'5 230 29
    WR2 - Brandon Lloyd 6’0 190 30

    LT – Matt Kalil 6'7 295
    LG –Jason Smith 6’5 305 25 / Keith Zeitler 6-4 318
    C – Nick Hardwick 6'4 310 31
    RG – Harvey Dahl 6’5 305 30 / Jovan Olafioye 6'6 325 24
    RT - Rodger Saffold 6’5 315 24 / Jason Smith 6’5 305 25 / Jovan Olafioye 6'6 325 24

    Defense:
    DE – Chris Long 6'3 265 26
    DT Jason Jones 6'5 280 25 (Younger James Hall play DT/DE)
    DT- Dontari Poe 6'5 350 / Justin Bannan 6’3 310 32
    DE – Robert Quinn 6’4 270 4.62 40 21

    SLB– Nigel Bradham 6'3 240/ Brady Poppinga 6’3 250 32
    MLB– James Laurinatis 6’2 245 25
    WLB– Chris Chamberlin 6’1 230 25

    LCB – Cortland Finnegan 5'10 190 28
    RCB –Bradley Fletcher 6’0 200 23 / Asa Jackson 5'10 195 4.4 40
    FS – Quintin Mikell 5’10 205 31
    SS – Darian Stewart 5’11 215 22


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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    People in every mock lately have us picking up crazy FA's. We have $10 million in space... $10 million. Finnegan is going to get $7 at least. Jason Jones $2.5. Any of those WR's will get $5 +.

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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    People in every mock lately have us picking up crazy FA's. We have $10 million in space... $10 million. Finnegan is going to get $7 at least. Jason Jones $2.5. Any of those WR's will get $5 +.
    There will be cuts and likely a restructure of at least one contract likely Longs since he is a free agent after 2012.

    Here is a break down of how we can do what is proposed here and I will await your response.
    Possible Cuts and 2012 salary (in million):
    Fred Robbins 3.75
    James Hall 2.75
    Justin Bannan 2.75
    Ron Bartell 6.2
    15.45 mil should more then pay for Hardwick, Jones, and Finnegan.

    We would still have 10 mil in cap space to sign a WR and draft picks. We could also still restructure (IE Long) another contract or cut some of the following.
    Jason Brown C 5 mil
    Josh Brown K 2.7 mil
    Jason Smith OT 10 mil (would be only about 1.5-2 in cap savings)
    Another 9.5 mil more possible + restructure

    I doubt if we signed Finnegan he would count 7 mil against this year because it would likely be a longer term deal with a signing bonus spread across them. It would likely be around 4-5 mil cap hit IMO.
    Last edited by RamsSB99; -02-04-2012 at 03:12 PM.
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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    Quote Originally Posted by RamsSB99 View Post
    There will be cuts and likely a restructure of at least one contract likely Longs since he is a free agent after 2012.

    Here is a break down of how we can do what is proposed here and I will await your response.
    Possible Cuts and 2012 salary (in million):
    Fred Robbins 3.75
    James Hall 2.75
    Justin Bannan 2.75
    Ron Bartell 6.2
    15.45 mil should more then pay for Hardwick, Jones, and Finnegan.

    We would still have 10 mil in cap space to sign a WR and draft picks. We could also still restructure (IE Long) another contract or cut some of the following.
    Jason Brown C 5 mil
    Josh Brown K 2.7 mil
    Jason Smith OT 10 mil (would be only about 1.5-2 in cap savings)
    Another 9.5 mil more possible + restructure

    I doubt if we signed Finnegan he would count 7 mil against this year because it would likely be a longer term deal with a signing bonus spread across them. It would likely be around 4-5 mil cap hit IMO.
    Just letting you know that I think that Bannan would actually be a negative cap hit, due to his bonus being brought forward. Not certain on that. I do think Hall will be cut, I think his savings is somewhere in the $1.5-2M range. Bartell is currently our #1 corner, and has been a very good man cover player who can shut down guys like Fitzgerald. He has one of our higher cap numbers, but it significantly hurts our defense to lose one of our better starters.

    Yes, Brown, Brown and Smith could all be cut, and might. But with Smith, what would be the reason that he would agree? He could make us cut him and he could go elsewhere and still get a huge signing bonus because people will think his problems came from being a Ram, not with him. Then we're down a player and only gained $2M. I also list Bradford as a significant saving with turning his salary into a bonus. Long might get signed to a long term deal, but how would restructure a guy in his last year? I would love the re-signing though.

    Now, as for the crux of the problem, the "let's go spend crazy amounts on 'elite' FA's" notion that so many people seem to have. We don't have $10M to spend on good players. We have $10M to spend total at this point. I don't think we have a single OLB under contract for 2012. Lloyd is a FA, and will take a $5-7M cap charge. VJax will probably be closer to $7M, Colston $6M, and Bowe the same.

    Finnegan will probably want $7M worth of cap, maybe $6M, but then we're paying him the same as Bartell, who has been a better cover corner over the last 3 years that both played(08, 09, 10). Jason Jones played mainly at DE this year and is undersized to play inside except on passing downs. Further, as the 'elite' pass rushing DT(if you can call him a DT), he'll be asking for probably $3-4M in cap.

    So yes, we can sign these guys. But then we'll be playing with whomever we can scrounge up in the draft or who go undrafted at OLB, backup DE, backup DT, backup OL, and backup RB. We don't have a backup QB under contract.

    We don't have the depth, and certainly not under contract to say that we're two stars away. The reason why we had such an issue this year is because we have no depth! Once our starters got injured or started playing badly, there was no one who could come close to their level of productivity. That's why I keep preaching that we need to grab up and coming, reasonable cost and not 'elite' players. We need to build a team, not a starting lineup.
    mde8352gorams likes this.
    I believe!

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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    We sign a top 10 WR
    We sign a top 5 DB
    We sign a top tier pass rushing DT
    we sign a proven veteran interior lineman

    I guess vince young was wrong st. louis is the new dream team

    really think about it though thats plenty of money to dish out to veterans when your a re-building team and your owner knows that you win on sunday by winning in the war room on draft day

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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    I would have a few concerns with this result:

    1) Although it helps to have a massive nose tackle next to him, I'm still skeptical about Jason Jones as an every down defensive tackle. He was a DE in college, and the Titans started moving him around to the DE spots with limited success last year because they thought he was too prone to wear down later in games, which also made it more difficult for him to stay healthy. Personally, I would be concerned that if we pair a raw, unusually tall, 350-lb. rookie who declared early from a mid-level conference with a free agent DE/DT tweener, our run defense would be pretty awful.

    2) I'm sure they could get creative to find some more room under the cap, but I'll also agree that signing Lloyd, a top tier wide receiver,the best corner available, and two other starters in free agency would be ambitious.

    3) I'm not sure that moving Saffold to RT and Smith to LG would be the smoothest transition. It might work, but Saffold isn't a mauler in the running game. With only one player returning to the position he played last year for the Rams, we would just have to hope that a lot of things went right.

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    Re: A draft with Kalil (No Trades)

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    Just letting you know that I think that Bannan would actually be a negative cap hit, due to his bonus being brought forward. Not certain on that.
    That is not the case at all he would likely save us about 1.5 mil. His salary in 2012 will be 2.75 mil he had a signing bonus of 2 mil over 3 years or 666k per year. That would equate to about 1.5 mil cap savings with the signing bonus brought forward.

    I do think Hall will be cut, I think his savings is somewhere in the $1.5-2M range.
    Hall would be in the last year of his contract. He is due to make 2.75 mil and he had a three year contract with a signing bonus of 1.8 mil or about 600k per year. That would equate to 2.15 mil cap savings.

    Bartell is currently our #1 corner, and has been a very good man cover player who can shut down guys like Fitzgerald. He has one of our higher cap numbers, but it significantly hurts our defense to lose one of our better starters.
    Bartell is currently our CB who is trying to come back from a broken neck who will be 30 years old this month and had only one tackle in the first game of the season before missing the entire season. Not to mention we lost every other CB that played last year to injury including our #2 CB Fletcher. That is why I dont think its smart to pay Bartell 6.2 million dollars and have no good veteran CBs that are not coming off injuries. I would prefer to use that money to sign Finnegan who is as durable as they come and is two years younger then Bartell.

    Yes, Brown, Brown and Smith could all be cut, and might.
    Thats a good amount of cap savings.

    But with Smith, what would be the reason that he would agree? He could make us cut him and he could go elsewhere and still get a huge signing bonus because people will think his problems came from being a Ram, not with him.
    I only mentioned that he would be a small cap savings if they did decide to cut him. I think you are making an argument for why would he restructure which I never said anything about. I think a restructure of his contract is unlikely to happen although it was said he would be willing to rework his contract.

    I also list Bradford as a significant saving with turning his salary into a bonus.
    I never even mentioned that. But it would be even more money that could be used.

    Long might get signed to a long term deal, but how would restructure a guy in his last year? I would love the re-signing though.
    That is what I was eluding to was signing him to a long term contract that would void his current contract and lower his cap hit when I said restructure. It only makes sense that this will happen.


    Now, as for the crux of the problem, the "let's go spend crazy amounts on 'elite' FA's" notion that so many people seem to have.
    I think that we more than proved that we have plenty of money. Even you said later we had enough but didn't have enough for backups. Do you remember how many players the Rams signed last year as starters with very little cap money. We are talking about signing backups after this and I think there is still plenty of money left when we are talking about replacing CB (Bartell 6.2 mil) for CB (Finnegan) and a DT (Hall 2.75 mil) for a DT (Jones), C (Jason Brown 5 mil) for C (Hardwick). Then other potential savings in cutting Robbins 3.75 (Poe 6'5 350 replaces), Bannan 2.75, Josh Brown 2.75 mil. That is 9.25 mil coupled with the 10 mil to help get 2 WRs (V. Jackson and Llyod) and some backups.

    It don't look like you have really looked at what all we could have to spend. There is a lot more money that could be spent then you think when the cuts and restructure of Long takes place. Also the money you mentioned could be saved with Bradfords contract if they want to go that route.

    Jason Jones played mainly at DE this year and is undersized to play inside except on passing downs. Further, as the 'elite' pass rushing DT(if you can call him a DT), he'll be asking for probably $3-4M in cap.
    First you say he is not that good then you go on to say he will be 3-4 mil in cap hit. I dont think he will be more then what Hall, Robbins, or Banyan would be cap wise in 2012. Cutting one of them would likely pay his 2012 cap hit. He is a young James Hall and would be used in a DT rotation and could slip out to DE on running downs.

    So yes, we can sign these guys. But then we'll be playing with whomever we can scrounge up in the draft or who go undrafted at OLB, backup DE, backup DT, backup OL, and backup RB. We don't have a backup QB under contract.
    So as you said we could sign these guys and go this route and as you stated in several areas you don't know the cap savings we would have. So you saying that we wouldn't have any money left for backups is not an informed stance. You are worried about backups being good when we don't even have starters that are good. Do you remember last year when we looking at potential starters such as Sims Walker, Popinga, Bannan, Mark Clayton and we signed all of them when we had very little cap room. I am not advocating signing those type of players as potential starters. I am advocating signing good players as starters which you said we had the money to do. I am recommending signing other players as backups for minimal cap hit like we did with those other guys we projected as potential starters and Cadiallac Wilaims, and Jorious Norwood. If you really think we can fill all the starters and all the backups in one season with quality players you are nuts. We need to not dilute this roster with average starters and average backups. We need good starters and then worry about getting decent backups. This team needs to build talent badly and I believe the proposed method would be a step in that direction and fit within the cap.
    Last edited by RamsSB99; -02-05-2012 at 04:09 PM.

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