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  1. #1
    txramsfan's Avatar
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    Draftnix....explain this to me....

    How in the HECK does the K from USC outbench the following:

    1. Eugene Monroe
    2. Michael Oher
    3. Ray Maulauga (sp)
    4. James Laurinitis

    Could the K from USC be our next Jeff Wilkins....who was our best Special Teams tackler for years?



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    Azul e Oro is offline Registered User
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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Does he do a handstand & kick with a balled fist?

    That would put butts in the seats.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    I thought it was a punter rather than a kicker. Maybe he does both. When i see the highlights, they specifically said punter.

    Bench press is a matter of practice and training. Brady Quinn did more reps than any of these guys!

    The best bench press performance in the history of the combine belongs to adam archuleta, who at 210 pounds did (i believe) 41 reps, only two or three reps off the all time record, which is held by some 340 pound lineman.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel


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    txramsfan's Avatar
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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    This is why I think the combine is more overrated than Greys Anatomy. To base judgement on how many reps a player does or how they do in cone drills is insane. Just look at Adam Archuleta. Hands like feet, couldn't cover, even missed tackles. However, he pumped 41 reps and got a first round pick.

  5. #5
    MarshallMarshall Guest

    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    The kid is a stud. If he's there in the 7th I might take him.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    The kicker/punter in question, David Buehler I believe, has shorter arms than those guys. Buehler's arms measured in at 30 1/4". Monroe was 33 7/8" and Oher was 33 1/2". Might sound small, and that doesn't completely explain it, but longer arms do make it more difficult to put that weight completely up. It's entirely probable that Buehler has put in more training time on the bench than either of these guys have, too. The fact that Maualuga, who also went to USC, put the bench up less time might suggest Buehler's number is more indicative of his own personal regimen than USC's training program.

    I know some people have some concern over Monroe's 23 reps, but if you're a blind-side left tackle in the NFL, elite upper body strength is not nearly as important as athletic ability, lateral quickness, quick feet, the ability to slide and mirror, etc. And Monroe has all of those things. Plus, I'd also point out the following from a recent Gil Brandt article regarding the combine tests...

    The Dallas Cowboys have been testing and recording prospects with these drills since the early 1960s. Likewise, most teams have been doing it long enough to know what "good measurables" look like. Sure, some players will blow people away with an amazing 40 time or a record number of reps in the bench press. But it's more important to identify the target numbers that indicate a prospect is worthy of further evaluation.

    As you follow along and check the results of this year's combine, here are what the target numbers look like by position (note: quarterbacks do not lift weights or run the 60-yard shuttle; offensive and defensive linemen also do not run the 60-yard shuttle):
    Brandt's target number for offensive tackles on the bench press? 24. So Monroe was only one rep short, which is a marginal difference IMO.

    For those unfamiliar with Brandt's résumé, he served as VP of Player Personnel for the Cowboys for nearly 30 years, and is generally considered to be a personnel guru in league circles.

    You said it though, tx. I think people put a bit too much stock in testing at the combine. Tests at the combine by themselves should not be enough to move a guy all the way around a draft board. They shouldn't completely change your perception of a player from what you've seen him do on the field.

    Rather, the tests at the combine should be used to support the kind of things you've seen on tape or answer some of the questions you may still have about a prospect. If the testing at the combine does not support the impression that you got by watching tape, then it should prompt you to go back and give the player further evaluation.

    I'll give you an example. I've not been particularly impressed with Max Unger as a center prospect, and I'll explain why. I simply don't think he's going to hold up well going against quality tackles in this league, particularly nose tackles. He's a tall guy who has a tendency to play a bit upright and thus lose any leverage he might have had. But he also doesn't appear to be incredibly strong, which is more important for the interior linemen.

    At Senior Bowl practices, I saw him get pushed back a number of times by defensive linemen like Raji and Brace, both of whom look to be bull rushing nose tackles at the next level. So the question with Unger is, does he have the strength to compete with these guys at the point of attack? He came to the combine and benched 22 reps. To compare, Brandt's target number for interior linemen is 26.

    Thus, strength remains a concern for him, and that concern will be reflected in my mock as he likely goes in the second round. I'll be surprised if an AFC East or North team takes him as a center, simply because of the caliber of defensive/nose tackles in both conferences. So the strength issue was established by analysis before the combine, and then the combine testing confirmed strength as a possible area of concern.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Why does a kicker need to do the bench press at the combine.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Quote Originally Posted by jmk321 View Post
    Why does a kicker need to do the bench press at the combine.
    I thought he volunteered to do it?
    Last edited by laram0; -02-25-2009 at 03:04 PM.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post

    I know some people have some concern over Monroe's 23 reps, but if you're a blind-side left tackle in the NFL, elite upper body strength is not nearly as important as athletic ability, lateral quickness, quick feet, the ability to slide and mirror, etc. And Monroe has all of those things.
    I agree upper body strength is a measurable area of concern but by all means not the most important attribute of an outside (OT/DE) lineman. I would think that core and leg strength would be measured especially for interior lineman on both sides of the ball.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Quote Originally Posted by jmk321 View Post
    Why does a kicker need to do the bench press at the combine.
    thats what i thought!

    apart from leg strength for a punter/kicker...what does it matter..for them its basically a non contact sport.

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    The kicker/punter in question, David Buehler I believe, has shorter arms than those guys. Buehler's arms measured in at 30 1/4". Monroe was 33 7/8" and Oher was 33 1/2". Might sound small, and that doesn't completely explain it, but longer arms do make it more difficult to put that weight completely up.
    Absolutely. Range of motion is a factor in bench reps. Think about it like this.....Monroe and Oher have an extra 3 inches in range of motion approximately. So for every 4 reps, they are moving 225 lbs. a foot farther. So after 24 reps, they have moved the bar 6 feet farther than Buehler.

    An overly simplistic example, but still......arm length is a huge factor in this.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Quote Originally Posted by Ramblin` Ram View Post
    thats what i thought!

    apart from leg strength for a punter/kicker...what does it matter..for them its basically a non contact sport.
    Not always...

    YouTube - Dallas Cowbys Punter makes a BIG hit

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Ultimately, I agree. There is the potential to put too much emphasis on certain aspects of the combine, or even the combine itself. The bench is a fine example of that. The top performance at the Combine was from an Ohio State DE a few years back named Mike Kudla. He put up (IIRC) 45 reps. Amazing numbers that never translated to success on the field. But he trained specifically for the bench, and it doesn't hurt that OSU is centered in the Mecca for Powerlifting.....Columbus, OH. Columbus has two of the greatest powerlifting gyms in the nation (Westside Barbell & Elite Fitness Systems); both of which work closely with OSU athletes.

    Never bet against an OSU man when it comes to the bench.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    Bench press is a matter of practice and training. Brady Quinn did more reps than any of these guys!
    Precisely!!
    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    The best bench press performance in the history of the combine belongs to adam archuleta, who at 210 pounds did (i believe) 41 reps, only two or three reps off the all time record, which is held by some 340 pound lineman.
    Anyone think Archuleta would make a good nose tackle? A good bench number at the combine indicates a player is disciplined enough to hit the weights regularly. Just one of many requirements necessary to succeed at the NFL level .. Munroe's 23 reps is fine ..

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    Re: Draftnix....explain this to me....

    Oh please....the dude is a frickin kicker. Either he's a freak or these guys just failed.

    I think he's a freak. He outran some LB's in the 40 too

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