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Thread: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

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    Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Per Evan Silva

    #Rams will be in on Finnegan, can take that to the bank. Versatile, physical playmaker. Also, cutting Bartell saves serious coin vs cap.
    I am beginning to believe this as well... And to be honest I would rather have Finnegan than Bartell at this stage, no offense to Ronny B. Id love both.

    See how it shakes out, but Finnegan has been, and will remain to be, the guy I am most confident in us acquiring during the off-season.


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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    #Rams will be in on Finnegan, can take that to the bank. Versatile, physical playmaker. Also, cutting Bartell saves serious coin vs cap.
    Yes and no.

    I'm all for the pursuit of Finnegan, but I wouldn't cut Bartell. That is of course assuming he can pass a physical. If so, why cut your current #1 to make room for the new #1?

    Here's an idea: keep the current #1 and pair him with the new #1. Cut the #11 or #12 CB on our roster instead. I mean, I'm no GM candidate, but that seems pretty sensible to me.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by THOLTFAN81 View Post
    Per Evan Silva



    I am beginning to believe this as well... And to be honest I would rather have Finnegan than Bartell at this stage, no offense to Ronny B. Id love both.

    See how it shakes out, but Finnegan has been, and will remain to be, the guy I am most confident in us acquiring during the off-season.
    I agree Holt. Finnegan is an upgrade over Bartell on the field, and is more inline to a true No1 CB. Im just hoping the new era Rams, set their sights a little higher now, and definitely not settle on a mediocre player like Bartell. Bartell will masquerade as a No.1 CB, for as long as the Rams allow him get away with it. So I just hope the new era Rams will realize the mistakes of the previous regime, adjust, and put an end to this nonsense.?

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Bartell, mediocre? Wow. Once again Bartell gets underrated.

    Tell me guys, which lineup from #1 to dime sounds better?

    1 - Finnegan, Fletcher, Murphy, King
    2 - Finnegan, Bartell, Fletcher, Murphy

    I'll take 2 everyday of the week, and twice on Sunday.
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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    I dunno how a guy who gives up more catches and for more yards per catch is a better corner, but sure.

    Yes, he's younger, but they really are of the same physical CB mold. Bartell is basically a FS type who can cover, while Finnegan is just a guy who can hit hard. He racks up tons of tackles and gets highlights of him hitting guys because he CAN'T cover. He gives up catches and then tackles the guy. Bartell actually defends the pass. Neither gets many interceptions.

    So, would you rather the guy who gives up like 6 yards a pass, or 9? Personally, I'd rather stick with the guy who gives up 6.

    If somehow we can fit him under the cap, I'm fine with Hub's idea of pairing them together, but if you plan on replacing Bartell with Finnegan, you're going to find that it costs the same in terms of the cap, but will lose you more yards in defense.
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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    I couldn't care less if Finnegan came to the Rams . I would prefer a much bigger corner than Finnegan. I'm just trying to make a point about the Rams needing to raise the bar more, in their quest for players, to improve the roster. Just because I think Finnegan is a better corner than Bartell, doesn't mean I want the Rams to be stupid, and go all out to try and sign him Teke. Im just throwing something out their. Things are being taken way too literally here.

    I don't understand what your point is with the line- up Hub, all its has proved is that Bartell is a better player than Fletcher. Im not debating this. The bottom line in my post, is the Rams need to somehow get more talented players in, END OF STORY.
    Last edited by GROUND DOG 39; -02-10-2012 at 02:06 PM.

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Well, if Finnegan was going to come to the Rams, do you think he'd be giving us a "Fisher" discount? Do you think that he'd come with some kind of backloaded deal that gave us a cap break this year or will he look for the big time guaranteed money that he could find because he has a reputation?

    My point is that Bartell has been a better cover corner than Finnegan, but because he doesn't get highlights, everyone thinks that he's only mediocre. The reason he doesn't get highlights is because he doesn't get a lot of INT's, which Finnegan doesn't either, and then doesn't talk smack or get into fights like Finnegan. He does his job, he shuts down Fitzgerald in coverage, as opposed to needing to stuff him at the line and taking swings at him, and then he gets back to the huddle to do it again.

    Now, Finnegan pumped it up this year and through the first 13 weeks charted as a top 10 corner, and in fact ranked #2 in terms of average yards per pass. However, this is a little bit of a game, because he was used completely differently in 2011 than during Fisher's tenure. In Fisher's tenure, the average distance downfield that Finnegan was targetted was 13 yards downfield. In 2011 it was 7.2. Practically half the distance. In 2011 it seems like all he did was play cover 2 and cover the flat. When he covered downfield, he gave up over 7 yards per pass in 2008-2009 and gave up 9.4 yards per pass while not even stopping half of the plays that came his way in 2010!

    The stats say that Finnegan is fine in a cover two playing press coverage, but that he can't cover downfield. He's not a #1 corner. Bartell is. The stats and opponent receivers say he is. Now, if we have both, we can probably make something work, but if we trade Bartell for Finnegan, I will not be surprised to see our pass defense become more suseptible.
    Last edited by TekeRam; -02-10-2012 at 03:32 PM.
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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    I don't understand what your point is with the line- up Hub
    I am refuting the notion espoused in the original quote that the Rams best move would be to sign Finnegan and cut Bartell.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by TekeRam View Post
    Well, if Finnegan was going to come to the Rams, do you think he'd be giving us a "Fisher" discount? Do you think that he'd come with some kind of backloaded deal that gave us a cap break this year or will he look for the big time guaranteed money that he could find because he has a reputation?

    My point is that Bartell has been a better cover corner than Finnegan, but because he doesn't get highlights, everyone thinks that he's only mediocre. The reason he doesn't get highlights is because he doesn't get a lot of INT's, which Finnegan doesn't either, and then doesn't talk smack or get into fights like Finnegan. He does his job, he shuts down Fitzgerald in coverage, as opposed to needing to stuff him at the line and taking swings at him, and then he gets back to the huddle to do it again.

    Now, Finnegan pumped it up this year and through the first 13 weeks charted as a top 10 corner, and in fact ranked #2 in terms of average yards per pass. However, this is a little bit of a game, because he was used completely differently in 2011 than during Fisher's tenure. In Fisher's tenure, the average distance downfield that Finnegan was targetted was 13 yards downfield. In 2011 it was 7.2. Practically half the distance. In 2011 it seems like all he did was play cover 2 and cover the flat. When he covered downfield, he gave up over 7 yards per pass in 2008-2009 and gave up 9.4 yards per pass while not even stopping half of the plays that came his way in 2010!

    The stats say that Finnegan is fine in a cover two playing press coverage, but that he can't cover downfield. He's not a #1 corner. Bartell is. The stats and opponent receivers say he is. Now, if we have both, we can probably make something work, but if we trade Bratell for Finnegan, I will not be surprised to see our pass defense become more suseptible.
    The thing about me Teke is Im not a big fan of stats. My enthusiasm for that went years ago, same for the draft. I only go off what I see. This is probably half the reason why I have a different perspective on Finnegan. Like you have pointed out, Finnegan seems to stand out much more when watching a game. Ive seen Bartell play nearly every week for years, yet Ive noticed Finnegan a lot more over the years, in highlights. I will admit its almost impossible to judge any CB's watching the game on the TV, let alone these internet links Ive been using recently. But Im still hopeful the Rams can do a bit better than him in the immediate future. He is a good No.2 in my opinion. Thats it, though. But I can at least now see where your coming from regarding Bartell. Lets hope improved coaching will bring the best out of Bartell.
    Last edited by GROUND DOG 39; -02-10-2012 at 03:36 PM.

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    I am refuting the notion espoused in the original quote that the Rams best move would be to sign Finnegan and cut Bartell.
    Sorry Hub, my bad.

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    95% of people who like Finnegan don't know a thing about him besides "is he that guy that fought Andre Johnson?". Bartell in my opinion is better. He's so underrated. He has great size, such underrated speed (Caught Jamaal Charles 80 yds), and like Teke said he's not on the highlights because of the lack of INT's.

    I frankly dont care if hes not on the cover of Madden 12... If he continues to play the way he has been, why waste money on Finnegan? Hes good too, but I'd rather stay with what we have or draft a later round CB or sign a cheaper FA like Stanford Routt.

    Bartell is one of my favourite Rams.

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Bartell is a great cover corner no question about it. And actually has been one of my few favorite players on D last few years. A finnegan - bartell combo or Routt- Bartell combo would be good enough. Just hoping as he is coming back the injury, he is back to his oldself with a little improvement.

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    If so, why cut your current #1 to make room for the new #1?
    Because it may be difficult to pay for both, with Bartell scheduled to make $6.2 million in 2012. This year is also the final year of his contract as well.

    If you're Jeff Fisher, you may feel more comfortable spending the money on a healthy corner that you're familiar with versus an injured corner that you're not.
    Last edited by Nick; -02-10-2012 at 07:17 PM.
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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Because it may be difficult to pay for both, with Bartell scheduled to make $6.2 million in 2012. This year is also the final year of his contract as well.

    If you're Jeff Fisher, you may feel more comfortable spending the money on a healthy corner that you're familiar with versus an injured corner that you're not.
    Maybe. But also maybe, they can sign Bartell to an extension and lessen the cap hit. Also, it may be a moot point if Bartell isn't healthy (it's been my contention all along that Bartell has played his last game already). But if both are healthy, it would be in the Rams best interest to find a way to keep Bartell. Especially considering Williams blitz happy defense. That will require single coverage corners, and in that regard, I don't know that Finnegan is much of an upgrade over Bartell.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Evan Silva: Rams will be in on Finnegan

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    Maybe. But also maybe, they can sign Bartell to an extension and lessen the cap hit. Also, it may be a moot point if Bartell isn't healthy (it's been my contention all along that Bartell has played his last game already). But if both are healthy, it would be in the Rams best interest to find a way to keep Bartell. Especially considering Williams blitz happy defense. That will require single coverage corners, and in that regard, I don't know that Finnegan is much of an upgrade over Bartell.
    Or we could extend Long, re-structure J.Smith and J.Brown, and we can also take some guys' salaries and change them into singing bonuses to create 4 or 5 mill in cap. But like you said, Bartell is 100% healthy and I dont see Finnegan being an upgrade over Bartell.
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