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  1. #1
    general counsel's Avatar
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    jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Here is a random thought of cynicism. Keep in mind that i am basically a professional cynic, its critical to my job, so i admit this thinking is more than a little out of the box.

    Jackson is a free agent at the end of 2008. Going into next off season, the rams dont know if he will be signed long term. The rams dont want jackson to have unlimited leverage. In addition, they needed a backup running back anyway.

    With the selection of leonard, they get a high character guy that they really like and who can contribute without being a starter (ie special teams etc) and in the event jackson tries to hold up the team for unlimited money, they potentially have a guy that can step right into a starting role. He can run, catch and block, which is an excellent array of skills, especially in the linehan offense.

    Anyone else think this might have had any impact on the decision to draft leonard when we were so badly in need of pass rush. Just a thought, not saying its even likely, just a data point.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel



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    KingHigh is offline Registered User
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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Quote Originally Posted by general counsel View Post
    Here is a random thought of cynicism. Keep in mind that i am basically a professional cynic, its critical to my job, so i admit this thinking is more than a little out of the box.

    Jackson is a free agent at the end of 2008. Going into next off season, the rams dont know if he will be signed long term. The rams dont want jackson to have unlimited leverage. In addition, they needed a backup running back anyway.

    With the selection of leonard, they get a high character guy that they really like and who can contribute without being a starter (ie special teams etc) and in the event jackson tries to hold up the team for unlimited money, they potentially have a guy that can step right into a starting role. He can run, catch and block, which is an excellent array of skills, especially in the linehan offense.

    Anyone else think this might have had any impact on the decision to draft leonard when we were so badly in need of pass rush. Just a thought, not saying its even likely, just a data point.

    ramming speed to all

    general counsel
    I agree with your thinking to an extent. SJ is one of the league's best backs. History has shown over and over that 95% of "feature backs" get worn down very quickly after rushing the ball 300+ times per season.

    In one sense, you might say that the Rams are insuring themselves against a SJ injury. In another, you might say that they are insuring themselves against a SJ contract dispute.

    It seems apparent that this is exactly what the Rams are thinking. But it also helps out SJ tremendously. He had 340+ carries last season. Imagine if he did it again in 2007 and again in 2008.

    If he were able to accomplish this, without declining production or serious injury, he'd be in very rare company. Most likely, he'd suffer a big injury or decline between now and then, which would lead to his either getting cut, or having no leverage when he's a free agent for 2009.

    BL getting big pt will help to preserve SJ, which is a win/win/win.

  3. #3
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    I do think the Rams can and will use Leonard as leverage if their negotiations with Jackson turn South, but I don't think they will overdo it with that ploy. Jackson demonstrated last year that he is an elite talent. Leonard may very well be good enough to be an NFL starter, but I don't expect him to be Jackson's equal.

    My expecatation is that the Rams will sign Bulger to an extension before long. That means that, when Jackson's contract comes up, the worst case scenario is that the Rams use a franchise tag on him. As good as Jackson is, I doubt anyone will give up 2 first round picks for the priviledge of signing him to a monster deal.

    If that happens, and Jackson pouts, Leonard's presence as could be a factor again. In the end, though, I wouldn't expect to see Jackson wearing another uniform before he's 30.

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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Maybe yes ... I would like to think that he was selected because of his unique blend of skills and his incredible CHARACTER. I believe that guys like B. Leonard only come along once in a great while. I believe Linny recognised this and knew he had to have him. Now if we are talking about Shaw and Ziggy, I'm sure that they were not opposed to the pick for the reasons you stated related to leverage on Steven J.

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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Small if any, I think the Rams will do everything they can do to sign SJ during the season, if not tag him. If he has a year like last years SJ will and should get paid. His numbers will be down with Leonard getting some touches.

    Again on the pass rush Rams FO must really liked Hall. They signed him quick named him the starter. If they thought he was an injury waiting to happen not so sure they would have signed him so fast.

    Question on injuries?

    Now that Tino was injured last year, is he more likely to miss time every year. Pace missed time is he a sure thing to miss some time again this year? Is that logical conclusion?

    Marc Missed time the last few years miss no time last year….

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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    I personally don't expect Leonard to serve as much leverage in contract negotiations, though the Rams could suggest that they don't have to mortgage the house for Jackson since Leonard combined with another young rookie runner could give St. Louis a true two-back system in the mold of Chicago or Dallas. That said, I don't think Leonard alone is enough to make the Jackson camp come down on their offers, so they'd have to threaten using him in a future combo.

    In the end, like Av, I don't see it becoming an issue. Linehan has seemingly done everything Jackson has wanted since coming here - making him the focal point of the offense in 2006, finding him the back-up he wants in 2007 - Jackson really has no reason to be upset unless the Rams plan to drastically reduce his carries.


    Quote Originally Posted by Rambos View Post
    Question on injuries?

    Now that Tino was injured last year, is he more likely to miss time every year. Pace missed time is he a sure thing to miss some time again this year? Is that logical conclusion?

    Marc Missed time the last few years miss no time last year….
    But the Rams have planned for potential injuries to those players by acquiring very solid depth.

    We signed Chris Draft as insurance in our LB core, and early word is he's playing with the starters at WLB until Pisa gets back. He's a quality starter who racked up 100+ tackles last season.

    Behind Pace we made an effort to resign Steussie, who was solid as a starting left tackle last season. He had the chance to test the market, but in the end we retained him as insurance.

    Behind Marc, we still have Frerotte, who has started plenty of games and can come off the bench and perform. Linehan was sure to grab Frerotte up quickly last year after he left Miami because of the familiarity between the two.

    Again, who do we have behind Hall and Little? Adeyanju and...?
    Last edited by Nick; -05-02-2007 at 01:43 PM.
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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Again, who do we have behind Hall and Little? Adeyanju and...?
    IF he goes down, I would say we would slide Carriker to DE with Victor. I think that is why Carriker is such a soild pick. Wroten could play more at DT.

    DE Little
    DT Wroten/Glover
    NT Kennedy/Rookie
    DE Carriker/Victor



    But the Rams have planned for potential injuries to those players by acquiring very solid depth.
    I agree...

    I see you left one of your list... yep SJ. I feel better now then I did before the draft at that back up. Minor last two years 24 carries for 86 yards.

    How about you?



    Nick anyone could go down at anytime IMO. Last year we would not be talking about depth as much so it's a good thing, we must be gettig better.

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    Re: jackson and leonard- a cynics view

    Rambos, let's move our conversation back to Av's Consensus thread since this one really has nothing to do with injuries and the defensive line. I'll post my reply for you there.
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    Re: Jackson and Leonard- a cynic's view

    Well, GC, I'm just glad you pre-qualified your comment as a 'cynic's view'!

    Maybe, maybe after Leonard's first season or two are in the books, then I would be consider your "Devil's advocate" scheme as related to Jax. Right now, quite frankly, I just want to enjoy the potential -- yes, even as such, a potential -- that our newly recruited RB from Rutgers offers to the Rams.

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