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  1. #16
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Chase the Eagles Fan View Post
    If Peppers is franchised, he can ask for a trade all he want...but it doesn't mean the Panthers have to trade him...and if they do, they're going to expect two first round picks as compensation...
    If anyone wants to offer two first round picks for Peppers, they are welcome to him. I doubt anyone will, which opens the door for a team like the Rams to try to put together a package that would entice the Panthers.


  2. #17
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    If they franchise him they obviously want to keep him and if no one wants to give them two firsts...then he'll just be a Panther in 2009...no sweat off of Carolina's back...

    Plus I thought it was being discussed on this board that the Rams should just trade down from #2 overall to get more picks to fill all the needs you have...wouldn't trading away your mother and first born for Peppers be counter productive?

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    Last edited by AvengerRam; -02-16-2009 at 03:26 PM.

  3. #18
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Chase the Eagles Fan View Post
    If they franchise him they obviously want to keep him and if no one wants to give them two firsts...then he'll just be a Panther in 2009...no sweat off of Carolina's back...
    No. Just a big cap number that would make it difficult for them to go after any other FAs or to sign Jordan Gross.

    Plus I thought it was being discussed on this board that the Rams should just trade down from #2 overall to get more picks to fill all the needs you have...
    Actually, I've repeatedly stated that I don't see much chance of the Rams trading down.

    wouldn't trading away your mother and first born for Peppers be counter productive?
    Orlando Pace is not my mother, and Torry Holt is not my first born.

  4. #19
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by Chase the Eagles Fan View Post
    If Peppers is franchised, he can ask for a trade all he want...but it doesn't mean the Panthers have to trade him...and if they do, they're going to expect two first round picks as compensation...
    Why would they? The 2 pick deal simply protects teams wanting to keep a player -- it is not an absolute. The Panthers like any team will try and get the best deal they possibly can .. if they want to move him.

  5. #20
    djdeeznutz Guest

    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    I don't see that working. First, I don't know that the Panthers can absorb all of those salaries. Second, I don't like the notion of a future first rounder being in the possible compensation. I'd rather have the deal completed this year.

    To me, a better trade would be something like Pace, Little or Holt and the Rams' second round pick for Peppers.
    I think we will have to include a 1st rounder type somewhere cuz last tear the Chiefs got a 1st and 3rd for Jered Allan. Pace and Little are not worth much. So how bout this:

    Panthers get:

    OT Pace
    LE Little
    2010 compensation (this is a little better)

    1st rounder: Peppers plays 16 games (rams make playoffs)
    2nd rounder: Peppers plays 10 games (rams win 8 games)
    3rd rounder: Peppers plays > 1 game (rams win 5 games)
    4th rounder: Peppers plays < 1 game (rams win 2 games)

    Rams get:
    LE Peppers
    Last edited by djdeeznutz; -02-16-2009 at 07:43 PM. Reason: took out tha 4th

  6. #21
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Orlando Pace - if the Panthers loss Jordan Gross to free agency, Pace would be a very good stop-gap for them, allowing them to devote their first round draft choice to a different position.
    As was already pointed out, the Panthers don't have their first round pick. But a package of Pace and a second makes sense for both teams, as long as the Rams do something to address the hole created by moving Pace.

    IMO, the Rams aren't going to find a defensive end in the second round more capable of making the kind of impact Peppers could make. Plus, Peppers is a larger body which seems to fit the Spagnuolo and Devaney mold.

    That said, if the Panthers are planning to tag and trade Peppers, then that means they'll have plenty of cash on hand to throw at Jordan Gross. I don't think it's unreasonable to think that, with Peppers potentially out of the long term picture in Carolina, Gross gets retained long term, reducing Carolina's need for a tackle. Something to think about.

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnyram View Post
    As for a pick as well i think that would be offering to much
    The Panthers aren't going to trade Peppers in a player-for-player deal with the Rams. No single player we'd make available for trade comes close to what Peppers' value is, and the Rams won't trade multiple players to make it work IMO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Weddle View Post
    Would be not be better going for Suggs?
    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Suggs is a pure 3-4 guy. Peppers is built like 4-3 DE, regardless of his stated preference to play in a 3--4. Apart from a sub-par 2007 season, Peppers has been far more productive as a pass rusher.

    To me, its not even close. Suggs really does not fit here, unless you think he could play SLB in a 4-3, which I think is questionable. Peppers, playing opposite Long, could be a HUGE upgrade.
    I don't agree that Suggs is a pure 3-4 guy, but I agree that I think Peppers physically is a better fit. Suggs is two years younger, but Peppers has been much more productive and just as consistent IMO. Suggs will probably be a bit cheaper both in contract and in the compensation we wouldn't have to give to Carolina. I think both are worthy of consideration.

    Quote Originally Posted by djdeeznutz View Post
    I could see this work like this:

    Panthers get:

    WR Torry Holt (after restructre of contract)
    OT Orlando Pace (after restructure of contract)
    DE Leonard Little
    Rams 2009 3rd round pick

    2010 compensation for Peppers play (like the brett farve deal):
    1st rounder if Peppers plays 14 games + 10 sacks
    2nd rounder if Peppers plays 10 + 8 sacks
    3rd rounder if Peppers plays 6 games + 4 sacks
    4th rounder if Peppers plays < 1 games (basically a darft pick is garenteed)

    Rams get:
    Julius Peppers

    2010 compensation for Torry Holt:
    4 rounder if Holt play 16 games
    5 rounder if Holt plays 10 games
    6 rounder if Holt reports to camp (basically garenteed)
    Don't take this personally, but your trade ideas seem to be getting less realistic as time goes by. Three players and two picks for one player and one pick? Trades in the NFL are no where near this congested and big.

    When Randy Moss was traded to Oakland, it was for one player and two picks (a first rounder and a seventh rounder). And even after a down year, there were few that contended Moss wasn't still among the top players of his position.

    Three players and two picks, one potentially a first rounder, is just a bloated and unrealistic trade package. This is a Madden trade, not a real life trade.

    Quote Originally Posted by djdeeznutz View Post
    My advise is to not move pisa cuz he is still only 27 and he had a good year and could easily move ot SLB if Spoon moves to WLB.
    I would dispute the claim that Pisa could easily move to the strong side linebacker position. If memory serves me right, Pisa dislocated his shoulder over half a dozen times the last time he played the SAM position for the Rams. I do not feel he's strong enough to take on and shed blocks from a tight end or even a pulling lineman on the strong side, nor do I think he's physical enough to hold up with that kind of additional contact.

    Quote Originally Posted by 39thebeast View Post
    I think they would take picks instead of older players.
    Maybe, maybe not. The Panthers made it to the second round of the playoffs this year. They may feel that a veteran helps them win now more than a rookie does. Then again, rookie Jonathan Stewart certainly contributed to much of their success this year.

    Quote Originally Posted by Chase the Eagles Fan View Post
    and if they do, they're going to expect two first round picks as compensation...
    Well, they're not going to get that, so...

  7. #22
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Julius Peppers has reportedly stated that, if franchised, he'll ask for a trade. The Rams COULD afford to get into that discusson.

    First... two caveats.

    1. I am not saying the Rams WILL try to trade for Peppers. I have no reason to presume this.

    2. I am aware that Peppers has also stated that he would like to play in a 3-4. That said, I don't know if that would ultimately be a "deal breaker."

    Here's my thought. The Rams COULD offer the Panthers a package that includes some, but not all, of the following commodities:

    Orlando Pace - if the Panthers loss Jordan Gross to free agency, Pace would be a very good stop-gap for them, allowing them to devote their first round draft choice to a different position.

    Leonard Little - while Little's performance has declined in recent years, largely due to injury, he could be a good short-term replacement for Peppers.

    Torry Holt - Holt obviously would love to play in Carolina, and he could be very productive opposite Steve Smith, who is still young enough to draw double teams.

    Pisa Tinoisamoa - With Witherspoon moving to the WLB spot, Pisa could be the odd man out. Carolina could have a use for him, and his contract would not be a huge burden to them.

    First Round Pick*: I would be very reluctant to include the Rams' first round pick in this deal, unless the Rams also received the Panthers' first rounder in return.

    Second Round Pick: I would, however, consider including the Rams second round pick.

    The key here for the Rams is cap room. By including Pace and/or Holt in the deal, a significant amount of cap room is cleared to sign Peppers long term. Little and Pisa's impact would be smaller, but still significant.

    So... if Peppers hits the trade market, should the Rams make a pitch?
    Why GIVE UP SO MUCH on such a TALENTED PLAYER who tends to DISAAPEAR even with all that talent. HE has the ability to dominate every play and every game but often gets lost in the shuffle.

    WAY TOO INCONSISTENT TO GIVE UP SO MUCH and then lets talk PESOS. All I can say is Peppers we don not need no stinking Peppers....

    Hate to say it but no big name free agent is going to make the RAMS a contender next year. I am not saying it can not happen but 1 big name free agent will not be enough in itself.... Just my 2 pennies..

    Go Rams

  8. #23
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Hmm didn't peppers say he wanted to move to a linebacker, isn't that part of why he is losinginterest in Carolina?? 2nd about suggs, the ravens float between a 3-4 and 4-3 as we'll as the conventional nickel etc tec.. In 06 Lewis said he felt the ravens were better as a 4-3 team.. Although I also think suggs would sink our cap.. He's going to get big money with all the teams that are flying above cap this year.. If we are going to trade someone to get cap space for the love of god can we dump drew on someone??

  9. #24
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    I am aware that Peppers has also stated that he would like to play in a 3-4
    I haven't followed the Peppers situation so I am a little dumbfounded by this statement. I'm just surprised to hear that a 4-3 End (ie. lots of sacks, high profile) wants to be a 3-4 End (double teams, low profile......if your name isn't Richard Seymour).

    Has he stated why?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  10. #25
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    Re: The Rams COULD afford Julius Peppers

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison View Post
    I haven't followed the Peppers situation so I am a little dumbfounded by this statement. I'm just surprised to hear that a 4-3 End (ie. lots of sacks, high profile) wants to be a 3-4 End (double teams, low profile......if your name isn't Richard Seymour).

    Has he stated why?
    I think he feels he'll get even more sacks. It very likely could be that he's just stirring the pot in an effort to have even more teams bidding for his services at the end of this month .. He's been a 4-3 end, so why not try and appear more versatile?
    Peppers hope Panthers grant wish, let him leave
    By MIKE CRANSTON 2 days ago

    CHARLOTTE, N.C. (AP) Julius Peppers was polite, insistent that he has no problems with his coaches and stressed that North Carolina will always be his home.

    The four-time Pro Bowl defensive end just doesn't want to play for Carolina anymore and hopes the Panthers grant the impending free agent his wish by not placing the franchise tag on him.

    "If they decide to use the tag on me, the first thing that I'll be doing is requesting a trade," Peppers said Saturday. "Then anything after, basically I don't know what would be the course of action. We'll deal with that when that time comes."

    In a conference call with reporters Peppers' first extended interview since his agent announced last month he wouldn't sign a long-term deal with the Panthers Peppers focused on his desire to leave coach John Fox's 4-3 defensive system to play outside linebacker in a 3-4 scheme.

    And he hopes Carolina fans eventually respect his intentions to leave.

    "You've done everything you're supposed to do and played seven years, or worked seven years and when that contract expired, you wanted to do something different and you were told basically, 'I know you did all that and fulfilled what you're supposed to do, but you've still got to stay,'" Peppers said of the negative fan reaction.

    "I don't think people would be willing to live under those same standards that they want to place on me. I say put yourself in my shoes and look at the situation instead of being emotional about it."

    For Peppers, it's simply about playing in a new system he hopes will better feature his freakish athletic ability. While Peppers wouldn't say which teams he's eyeing, Pittsburgh, New England, the New York Jets and Miami are among those with a 3-4 defense.

    "I feel like my abilities could be maximized and I could be even more productive than I have been in the past in a new system," Peppers said. "I feel like I've gotten close to maxing out in the system that I'm in now."

    It's the only system the Bailey, N.C., native and former North Carolina star has played in as a pro. The No. 2 overall pick in the 2002 draft, the 6-foot-7 Peppers is Carolina's all-time sacks leader and recorded a career-high 14 1/2 this season, when he was selected to the Pro Bowl again after a one-year absence.

    Losing the cornerstone of the defense would be a big blow for the Panthers, who have a big decision to make before Thursday's deadline to designate one player for the franchise tag.

    It's complicated by the impending free agency of starting left tackle Jordan Gross, who played under the franchise tag this past season. The Panthers would like to sign Gross to a long-term deal, then they could possibly tag Peppers and trade him.

    Placing the franchise tag on Peppers would force the Panthers to offer a one-year deal for a whopping $16.7 million. But it would mean no team could sign him without giving Carolina first-round picks. That would allow the Panthers to work out a trade for less, but still get something in return for losing the key cog of their defensive line.

    "I'm not going comment at all," general manger Marty Hurney said, when reached by phone Saturday after Peppers' conference call.

    If Peppers left, the remaining defensive ends on the roster would be Tyler Brayton, Charles Johnson and Hilee Taylor, who combined for 11 1/2 sacks last season. The Panthers also do not have a first-round pick in April's draft, something they would likely insist on obtaining in a trade.

    Peppers said he has no idea what the Panthers will do, and wouldn't say if he would hold out of offseason workouts and training camp if the Panthers keep him.

    However, Peppers did offer some advice.

    "If it was my decision, this is what I would do: Jordan Gross has come and stated that he wants to sign an extension with the Panthers," Peppers began. "We've got one player who says he does and one player that says he wants to move on and try something different. If I was in that situation, I would try to accommodate the guy that wants to be there, No. 1 priority."

    The 29-year-old Peppers, who turned down Carolina's lucrative contract extension before last season, insisted he didn't decide he wanted to leave until after the Panthers' disappointing 33-13 loss to Arizona in the NFC divisional playoffs, where Peppers was held without a sack.

    There had been speculation the quiet and reserved Peppers wanted to leave his home state, where he's often barraged with autograph requests when he's in public.

    "If I were to sit here and say that had nothing to do with it, that wouldn't be the truth," Peppers said on the prospect of leaving North Carolina. "But it's not as big of a deal as people may think it is.

    "It's really more about me getting to the point where I feel like I'm happy and I'm comfortable with what I'm doing and how my career is going. North Carolina is home for me and it's always going to be home."

    But after seven years and 60 1/2 sacks, Peppers wants a new professional home.

    "Seven years is a long time," Peppers said. "Since I've been here, I've given everything I've had. There's never been a time I wasn't giving my all. Basically, it's a situation where I feel like it's a point in my career where I want to do different things."
    Hosted by Copyright 2009 The Associated Press. All rights reserved.

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