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  1. #31
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeoriaRam View Post
    And the Rams beat you and your franchise quarterback. So the only lesson I take away from that is that drafting a QB #1 overall when you have a bad team is that it enables you to also lose to a extremely bad team.
    That's an extraordinarily simplistic analysis.

    A good QB isn't going to turn a bad team around in one year, but its a pretty big piece of the puzzle in the long run.


  2. #32
    dlions is offline Registered User
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeoriaRam View Post
    And the Rams beat you and your franchise quarterback. So the only lesson I take away from that is that drafting a QB #1 overall when you have a bad team is that it enables you to also lose to a extremely bad team.
    If we could have had any player in the history of the NFL besides drafting Stafford. I think only Elway and Barry Sanders would have been enough to beat the Rams on that Sunday.That's pretty sad,but that's were the Lions are at right now. The Lions have less talent than the Rams,but for the first time in a long time(maybe 10-12 years) they had a good off season. It will take 2 more of those to make us a contender. The game was not as close as the score. I really don't know what your point was. What player in last years draft would have made the Lions much better? We got our Qb of the future. You don't pass on a franchise QB NEVER ! Look at every Super Bowl winning team with the exception of the Ravens. I think in the last 33 years the winning team has scored on average over 33 pts a game, sure they say defense win championships but you only need a top 10 defense. Qb by far is the most important position in sports. I did not come here to talk trash and i won't do it. I just wanted to get the opinions of Rams Fans.

    Good luck this year!
    Last edited by dlions; -02-04-2010 at 01:25 PM. Reason: spelling

  3. #33
    PeoriaRam's Avatar
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    That's an extraordinarily simplistic analysis.

    A good QB isn't going to turn a bad team around in one year, but its a pretty big piece of the puzzle in the long run.
    Presuming, of course, there's one to be found in the draft, and that they won't be demoralized by playing with the bad team's supporting cast.

  4. #34
    peramoure is offline Registered User
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    I don't like the demoralized argument. Good coaching (and from what we've heard it sounds like Spags is a leader by all accounts) is going to offset any "bad team supporting cast". He has already cast off some of the bad apples, and rightly so. If a QB has found his way to the top of his college class, and by all accounts is a leader, I don't think that a "demoralizing locker room" is going to bring them down. They're bred to be the leader, ala Mark Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, etc.

    Now, if you don't think Clausen or Bradford are TALENTED enough to be in the top 5, then I understand. ;-P I personally like Bradford a lot. Although, I know why people have their doubts considering the shoulder and all.

  5. #35
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by peramoure View Post
    I don't like the demoralized argument. Good coaching (and from what we've heard it sounds like Spags is a leader by all accounts) is going to offset any "bad team supporting cast". He has already cast off some of the bad apples, and rightly so. If a QB has found his way to the top of his college class, and by all accounts is a leader, I don't think that a "demoralizing locker room" is going to bring them down. They're bred to be the leader, ala Mark Sanchez, Stafford, Ryan, etc.

    Now, if you don't think Clausen or Bradford are TALENTED enough to be in the top 5, then I understand. ;-P I personally like Bradford a lot. Although, I know why people have their doubts considering the shoulder and all.
    Then why is it so hard for Teh Glorious Franchise Quarterback!!!!!1111oneone to pan out when they join a truly bad team and start from Day 1? Outside of Peyton Manning and maybe Carson Palmer or Michael Vick, the track record of QBs in those situations is not good.

  6. #36
    dlions is offline Registered User
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeoriaRam View Post
    Then why is it so hard for Teh Glorious Franchise Quarterback!!!!!1111oneone to pan out when they join a truly bad team and start from Day 1? Outside of Peyton Manning and maybe Carson Palmer or Michael Vick, the track record of QBs in those situations is not good.

    Payton 3-13, Joe Montana 0-1 & 2-5, Troy Aikman 0-11, Terry Bradshaw 3-5 & 2-8,Jim Kelly 4-12, Eli Manning 1-6, John Elway 4-6 Bronco's won 2 games the year before,Fran Tarketon 2-11-1 & 4-8-1, Bob Griese 3-7 & 5-7-1 & 2-6-1, Joe Namath 3-5-1,Warren Moon 3-13 & 4-10 & 5-10,Dan Fouts 0-5-1 & 3-8 & 2-7, Steve Young 1-4 & 2-12 with Tampa.

  7. #37
    peramoure is offline Registered User
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlions View Post
    Payton 3-13, Joe Montana 0-1 & 2-5, Troy Aikman 0-11, Terry Bradshaw 3-5 & 2-8,Jim Kelly 4-12, Eli Manning 1-6, John Elway 4-6 Bronco's won 2 games the year before,Fran Tarketon 2-11-1 & 4-8-1, Bob Griese 3-7 & 5-7-1 & 2-6-1, Joe Namath 3-5-1,Warren Moon 3-13 & 4-10 & 5-10,Dan Fouts 0-5-1 & 3-8 & 2-7, Steve Young 1-4 & 2-12 with Tampa.
    ^awesome. Lets go Bradford.

  8. #38
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    I won't state anything bad about Bradford. However, I've stated this before, but I don't think enough is known about Bradford, to make an investment of a #1 pick, based on two factors

    (1) The majority of Oklahoma's offense is little dink and dunk throws, and its difficult to guage Bradford's ability to read defenses and other transitions that a NFL qb would have to make in coming to a pro style system
    (2) Bradford was rarely touched during his Heisman season b/c his offensive line was extremely strong, and in the limited time this year (BYU) he wasn't very impressive handling pressure.

    Although I think Bradford certainly could be successful, I don't think anyone can say for sure that he will be. If you are drafting at #1, i think you should be at least 90% sure that the person you draft will be a pro-bowl/all-pro player consistently throughout his career , I don't think you can say that with Bradford.

    Coupled with the immense talent of Suh (and even Gerald McCoy) although Bradford is indeed a wildcard that might end up paying off for some team, I don't think it is wise to pull the trigger (as much as it might hurt seeing another quality qb passed up).

  9. #39
    PeoriaRam's Avatar
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlions View Post
    Payton 3-13, Joe Montana 0-1 & 2-5, Troy Aikman 0-11, Terry Bradshaw 3-5 & 2-8,Jim Kelly 4-12, Eli Manning 1-6, John Elway 4-6 Bronco's won 2 games the year before,Fran Tarketon 2-11-1 & 4-8-1, Bob Griese 3-7 & 5-7-1 & 2-6-1, Joe Namath 3-5-1,Warren Moon 3-13 & 4-10 & 5-10,Dan Fouts 0-5-1 & 3-8 & 2-7, Steve Young 1-4 & 2-12 with Tampa.
    So...over 30 years, 13 guys. There've been a heckuva lot more than 13 QBs taken with a high 1st rounder over that span. Additionally, there's been a trend towards not giving your young 1st rounder 3 years to figure it out. All in all, this doesn't disabuse me of the notion that the Rams either need to take one in the 2nd or 3rd and let them sit while they build up the talent of the rest of the supporting cast, or build up the rest of the supporting cast and take TEH GLORIOUS FRANCHISE QB!!!!!!!!11111oneone in the first round in 2011.

  10. #40
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by PeoriaRam View Post
    So...over 30 years, 13 guys. There've been a heckuva lot more than 13 QBs taken with a high 1st rounder over that span. Additionally, there's been a trend towards not giving your young 1st rounder 3 years to figure it out. All in all, this doesn't disabuse me of the notion that the Rams either need to take one in the 2nd or 3rd and let them sit while they build up the talent of the rest of the supporting cast, or build up the rest of the supporting cast and take TEH GLORIOUS FRANCHISE QB!!!!!!!!11111oneone in the first round in 2011.

    Only about 15 or so Super Bowl winners, but I guess that means nothing. All I'm saying is if Bradford shoulder is fine, I think he's a special player that's worth taking # 1. Suh,McCoy,Berry or Haden should strongly be consider. I just think its coming down to Bradford or Suh with an outside chance for McCoy.

    All QB are a crapshoot. Recent First Round QB'S -2009 Matthew Stafford, Mark Sanchez, Josh Freeman 08 - Matt Ryan, Joe Flacco 07 - JaMarcus Russell,Brady Quinn 06 - Vince Young, Matt Leinart, Jay Cutler 05 - Alex D. Smith, Aaron Rodgers,Jason Campbell.

  11. #41
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    Thumbs up Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    good post, I like how you broke down the odds of each re: impact at respective positions.

    This is definitely going to get more interesting after this weekend. Then, it's all eyes towards the Draft and Free Agency

    My DVR has missed NFLN these past 9 months. It's itching

  12. #42
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlions View Post
    Payton 3-13, Joe Montana 0-1 & 2-5, Troy Aikman 0-11, Terry Bradshaw 3-5 & 2-8,Jim Kelly 4-12, Eli Manning 1-6, John Elway 4-6 Bronco's won 2 games the year before,Fran Tarketon 2-11-1 & 4-8-1, Bob Griese 3-7 & 5-7-1 & 2-6-1, Joe Namath 3-5-1,Warren Moon 3-13 & 4-10 & 5-10,Dan Fouts 0-5-1 & 3-8 & 2-7, Steve Young 1-4 & 2-12 with Tampa.
    I'm sorry I have to pick apart this post.

    Steve Young was Montana's backup and can hardly be used as being on a bad team as an example.

    Tarkington was a 3rd round draft pick.

    Montana was a 3rd round pick.

    Jim Kelly was drafted in the first round in 1983 but played 3 seasons in the USFL before joining the Bills in 1986.

    Moon wasnt even drafted and played in the Canadian football league before coming to the NFL.

    Dan Fouts was drafted in the 3rd round.

    Several of the guys you mentioned were not looked at as franchise qb's when drafted or not drafted for that matter.The draft is an absolute crap shoot and you can hardly call guys drafted in the 3rd round or not drafted at all franchise qb's. Do at least a little research before just throwing names out there. The fact you even mention Steve Young's days in Tampa is laughable. He sat behind Montana for years before getting his chance and then joined a very good football team as a starter. Not really a lot of guys who were considered franchise qb's just come right in and save the franchise from day one. The best year was the year Eli Manning,Rivers, and Roethlesburger came out but those guys were highly touted coming into the draft. I don't get that vibe with any of the qb's coming out in this years draft.
    Just Fix It

  13. #43
    dlions is offline Registered User
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by rammiser View Post
    Several of the guys you mentioned were not looked at as franchise qb's when drafted or not drafted for that matter.
    I don't think you ever draft a QB to be a backup,maybe now someone might draft one for the wildcat offense. I think even Miami took Pat White to be a starter down the road. The point I've been trying to make is you never pass on a franchise QB.

  14. #44
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlions View Post
    I don't think you ever draft a QB to be a backup,maybe now someone might draft one for the wildcat offense. I think even Miami took Pat White to be a starter down the road. The point I've been trying to make is you never pass on a franchise QB.
    To address the former point, Keith Null says hello.

    To address the latter point, if those guys weren't high first rounders, then a lot of teams did pass on these guys.

  15. #45
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    Re: Sam Bradford is the true "Wild Card" for the Rams first choice.

    Quote Originally Posted by dlions View Post
    I don't think you ever draft a QB to be a backup,maybe now someone might draft one for the wildcat offense. I think even Miami took Pat White to be a starter down the road. The point I've been trying to make is you never pass on a franchise QB.
    Every team in the NFL passed on guys like Tom Brady,Joe Montana,Warren Moon,Jim Kelly and Dan Fouts even the teams that eventually drafted them. So apparantly no one knew those guys would be franchise qb's. On the other hand teams jones for guys like Akilli Smith,Ryan Leaf,Jamarcus Russel and Andre Ware. Picking a qb first overall just because doesnt make him a franchise qb.
    Just Fix It

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