Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123
Results 31 to 41 of 41
Like Tree23Likes

Thread: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

  1. #31
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,409
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by Tampa_Ram View Post
    Great job Sosa. good breakdown.

    How do you all feel about double dipping at the safety position? Im not saying get rid of Mikkell, and if we did id like to sign a veteran, but i personally like the idea of double dipping for the future.
    I wouldn't mind it. I think we need a double dip whether its two through the draft, or one from FA and one from the draft. I prefer grabbing a FA like Kenny Phillips and drafting another guy, but the class is stacked at the position so I wouldn't be against double dipping in the draft either.



    THE DREAM TEAM

  2. #32
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,409
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I feel Kenny Vaccaro is a prime example of the dissonance between NFL draft fans and NFL draft analysts and journalists.

    As of mid to late February, Mike Mayock believes Vaccaro'll be a Top 15 selection. Russ Lande said he could be a Top Five pick to a team like Detroit. A January poll of NFL scouts showed a consensus that Vaccaro is the top safety in this class. Of the four most recent mock drafts on NFL.com, Vaccaro is off the board no later than 17th overall.

    And yet some of the comments and responses here make it sound like the guy is a mid round talent at best. Poor tackler, so so in coverage, offers nothing in the run game. Geez, why would anyone ever draft this guy to begin with?!

    It really makes you wonder what they're seeing that some fans aren't.
    I don't think he's bad at all. He offers excellent ability to cover like I've said. That is the most coveted thing in a centre fielder, essentially the position he'd be playing. He has amazing range and would solidify anything deep. He lacks run support and isn't a great tackler, but at the end of the day nobody is perfect, and what someone lacks, another prospect will thrive in. For example Ed Reed may be the best deep FS in the league, but he won't be around the LOS stopping the run and being sent on blitzes. Whereas Bernard Pollard is often left around the box because he is much better at being physical and tackling.

    To me you have to have a pair that are good compliments. A Vaccaro and Mikell duo would certainly work for me.


    THE DREAM TEAM

  3. #33
    CRAZYHORNS's Avatar
    CRAZYHORNS is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jun 2004
    Location
    Maryland near DC
    Age
    47
    Posts
    633
    Rep Power
    12

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    He was more "pro-ready" than Sam Bradford, that doesn't mean he's better..

    I said this in 2010:

    " If this upcoming draft of QB's was in the same draft as last years what would be the order?

    Would we have taken Locker because of Sam's shoulder? Is Locker better than Clausen?

    1. Bradford
    2. Locker
    3. Mallet
    4. Clausen..

    Is that correct? What about Terrelle Pryor?

    Thanks Guys! "

    and:

    "
    Clausen only looks good because of Golden Tate. I watch highlights, and so many of his passes are off, luckily Tate is a beast and fights for them whilst in the air.

    Bradford has everything above Clausen except "pro ready" which I assume is more playing under center. "
    I seem to recall much more than that but that is OK Sam was Rookie of the Year so I think he was more than ready to play in the NFL....

    Sosa what are you looking at when you watch these players. Do you have a high NFL IQ so that you understand all the schemes and responisibily of each position? I do not but if you do then Kuddos and I will be more open to your ranking of prospects.

    If not thanks for you feedback and providing us with your thoughts.

    Go Rams

  4. #34
    Nick's Avatar
    Nick is online now Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Morgantown, WV
    Age
    31
    Posts
    19,296
    Rep Power
    153

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    I don't think he's bad at all. He offers excellent ability to cover like I've said. That is the most coveted thing in a centre fielder, essentially the position he'd be playing. He has amazing range and would solidify anything deep. He lacks run support and isn't a great tackler, but at the end of the day nobody is perfect, and what someone lacks, another prospect will thrive in. For example Ed Reed may be the best deep FS in the league, but he won't be around the LOS stopping the run and being sent on blitzes. Whereas Bernard Pollard is often left around the box because he is much better at being physical and tackling.

    To me you have to have a pair that are good compliments. A Vaccaro and Mikell duo would certainly work for me.
    Here’s what I don’t understand.

    Six weeks ago, you claimed that after watching sufficient film on Vaccaro, he was your #1 safety. Two days later, you called him as complete a safety as you'll find. Fast forward to this thread, and he's dropped to your #4 free safety and is one-dimensional as a coverage safety because he lacks run support and isn't a great tackler.

    One of the guys you rank ahead of Vaccaro in this thread is Baccari Rambo. But you weren’t a fan of his around the time of the Senior Bowl, and as recently as a week or so ago, you didn’t list him among the safeties you’d consider in the first four rounds of the draft when discussing a replacement for Dahl. In this thread, you tried to convince Zia you were the first on this board to like him.

    So as it stands now, based on the response above and your response in the Craig Dahl thread, you'd be fine with the Rams drafting your #4 free safety in the first round, but it's unclear at best as to where you'd feel comfortable drafting your #2 free safety.

    Speaking of that list from a week or so ago, Matt Elam appears nowhere on it even though he's your #2 strong safety here. You also indicated you'd consider drafting the Honey Badger as a free safety in the third or fourth round as he has All Pro potential if he could stay clean, yet he's not among your Top Five in this thread.

    I get the fact that rankings can change, but it seems to me like your opinions are kind of all over the place and pretty inconsistent from thread to thread. I guess I’m also having a hard time figuring out what the point is in rankings that don’t drive your opinions on where guys should be drafted or in what order you believe they should come off the board.
    Last edited by Nick; -03-10-2013 at 07:07 PM.

  5. #35
    ZiaRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Location
    Las Cruces, New Mexico, United States
    Age
    34
    Posts
    1,530
    Rep Power
    20

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    I feel Kenny Vaccaro is a prime example of the dissonance between NFL draft fans and NFL draft analysts and journalists.

    As of mid to late February, Mike Mayock believes Vaccaro'll be a Top 15 selection. Russ Lande said he could be a Top Five pick to a team like Detroit. A January poll of NFL scouts showed a consensus that Vaccaro is the top safety in this class. Of the four most recent mock drafts on NFL.com, Vaccaro is off the board no later than 17th overall.

    And yet some of the comments and responses here make it sound like the guy is a mid round talent at best. Poor tackler, so so in coverage, offers nothing in the run game. Geez, why would anyone ever draft this guy to begin with?!

    It really makes you wonder what they're seeing that some fans aren't.
    Hell almost all of these so called draft analysts and journalists are utter trash. Kiper/Mcshay are a joke but slightly entertaining to watch which is why the keep them on T.V. It's nothing to give your opinion about anybody after giving tape a once over, so other than us on a fan site or those guys getting paid to write whatever which are nothing more than fans of football like we are. Mayock and those with a idea of what it takes to make it I'd have to default any opinion to them like I would a GM, a head coach like Jeff Fisher or a experienced scout. There are a limited number of people that make a decent effort on taking a look at prospects with a level mindset, and you Nick, I'd have to say would be one of those people.
    Last edited by ZiaRam; -03-10-2013 at 07:39 PM.

  6. #36
    HUbison's Avatar
    HUbison is offline Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Kentucky
    Age
    40
    Posts
    13,541
    Rep Power
    144

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    It really makes you wonder what they're seeing that some fans aren't.
    Actual coaches' game film.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  7. #37
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,409
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    Here’s what I don’t understand.

    Six weeks ago, you claimed that after watching sufficient film on Vaccaro, he was your #1 safety. Two days later, you called him as complete a safety as you'll find. Fast forward to this thread, and he's dropped to your #4 free safety and is one-dimensional as a coverage safety because he lacks run support and isn't a great tackler.

    One of the guys you rank ahead of Vaccaro in this thread is Baccari Rambo. But you weren’t a fan of his around the time of the Senior Bowl, and as recently as a week or so ago, you didn’t list him among the safeties you’d consider in the first four rounds of the draft when discussing a replacement for Dahl. In this thread, you tried to convince Zia you were the first on this board to like him.

    So as it stands now, based on the response above and your response in the Craig Dahl thread, you'd be fine with the Rams drafting your #4 free safety in the first round, but it's unclear at best as to where you'd feel comfortable drafting your #2 free safety.

    Speaking of that list from a week or so ago, Matt Elam appears nowhere on it even though he's your #2 strong safety here. You also indicated you'd consider drafting the Honey Badger as a free safety in the third or fourth round as he has All Pro potential if he could stay clean, yet he's not among your Top Five in this thread.

    I get the fact that rankings can change, but it seems to me like your opinions are kind of all over the place and pretty inconsistent from thread to thread. I guess I’m also having a hard time figuring out what the point is in rankings that don’t drive your opinions on where guys should be drafted or in what order you believe they should come off the board.
    I feel like because Vaccaro is #4 on my list people are thinking I don't like him.. I LIKE Kenny Vaccaro as a prospect. I would NOT be mad if the Rams decided to take him at #16 or #22. If Fisher thinks he can make him a pro bowler, so be it. He is an excellent cover safety. If you want someone to go head to head with the Gronks of this world, Vaccaro is your guy. He can lay the wood if someone is running a crosser, but I definitely would not want Vaccaro anywhere near the LOS as a in the box safety.

    I forgot about Rambo when I made that list in rounds 1-4. I've been up and down on him, but I'd definitely consider him in rounds 2-4 (preferably 3-4). Also, I had a mock very long ago with Rambo on it, so I did initially like his skills. His off the field concern does bring a little something to worry about, but I don't think its major.

    I like Elam, and wouldn't mind spending a 2nd on him. This is coningent upon finding a TRUE FS whether thats through FA or the draft. It doesn't make a ton of sense to go get a SS and pair him with Mikell, when Mikell's strength is playing SS. Which is why I like the FA's.

    Also, I'd like to see Mathieu at FS. I think he would be better there especially with his size. I'd spend a 4th on him at highest. His ball skills are top notch, but I wouldn't want him anywhere near Janoris Jenkins. It's a shame because these guys are grown men and to have this worry...


    THE DREAM TEAM

  8. #38
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,409
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by CRAZYHORNS View Post
    I seem to recall much more than that but that is OK Sam was Rookie of the Year so I think he was more than ready to play in the NFL....

    Sosa what are you looking at when you watch these players. Do you have a high NFL IQ so that you understand all the schemes and responisibily of each position? I do not but if you do then Kuddos and I will be more open to your ranking of prospects.

    If not thanks for you feedback and providing us with your thoughts.

    Go Rams
    I look at everything. I look at their ability to line up (are they just at the S spot? slot CB's? Outside CB's? LB's?). I look at how they use their eyes, and how they read their QB. Coverage is pretty easy to spot. I look at their closing speed which is crucial in this league. I look at their ability to wrap up.

    And I'd like to think I have a high NFL IQ. I guess that's really for others to determine.


    THE DREAM TEAM

  9. #39
    FestusRam's Avatar
    FestusRam is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Festus, Missouri
    Posts
    1,169
    Rep Power
    20

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Why's Eric Reid not on your list?

    He's one of my favority safety prospects and I'm just interested as to what you see/don't see in him.

  10. #40
    sosa39rams's Avatar
    sosa39rams is offline Registered User
    Join Date
    Jan 2010
    Location
    Hamilton, On
    Posts
    5,409
    Rep Power
    43

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by FestusRam View Post
    Why's Eric Reid not on your list?

    He's one of my favority safety prospects and I'm just interested as to what you see/don't see in him.
    Reid is an excellent athletic prospect. He's a big guy and has great size. To me, he's a guy that has a 50/50 chance. If he is taught the ins and outs of the game and understands the playbook (by that I mean he is taught how to play deep FS more effective) I think he can be great. He is a guy that I think will be drafted because a coach will want to get their hands on him. Physically he can match up with anyone. I question his coverage ability, but if he gets a good coach and works at it, he could be a really good one at the next level.


    THE DREAM TEAM

  11. #41
    Nick's Avatar
    Nick is online now Superbowl MVP
    Join Date
    May 2004
    Location
    Morgantown, WV
    Age
    31
    Posts
    19,296
    Rep Power
    153

    Re: Sosa's Top Safety Prospects!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    I feel like because Vaccaro is #4 on my list people are thinking I don't like him.. I LIKE Kenny Vaccaro as a prospect. I would NOT be mad if the Rams decided to take him at #16 or #22.
    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    I forgot about Rambo when I made that list in rounds 1-4. I've been up and down on him, but I'd definitely consider him in rounds 2-4 (preferably 3-4).
    No, sosa. The issue isn't that we think you don't like Vaccaro.

    The issue is how little sense it makes to say you'd be fine if the Rams took your #4 free safety in the first round, but that when it comes to your #2 free safety, you'd prefer him in the third or fourth rounds. That defies logic.

    If you think there are three safeties better than Vaccaro, then you shouldn't be fine if the Rams passed on them to take a guy you think is fourth best among them.

    Furthermore, if you rank Rambo ahead of Vaccaro, that should represent wanting to take Rambo instead of Vaccaro if both are available because you have ranked Rambo as the better prospect.

    As it stands, your rankings do not drive your opinions on where guys should be drafted (ie. #4 FS in first round, #2 FS in third or fourth) nor do they represent the order you believe they should come off the board (taking fourth-rated guy before the three ranked ahead of him).

    So again I ask, what's the point?

Page 3 of 3 FirstFirst 123

Similar Threads

  1. Sosa's MOCK.
    By sosa39rams in forum DRAFT & FA
    Replies: 11
    Last Post: -01-25-2011, 09:40 AM
  2. Sosa's Draft v 3.0
    By sosa39rams in forum DRAFT & FA
    Replies: 2
    Last Post: -01-17-2011, 06:01 AM
  3. Sosa's Mock Draft v2
    By sosa39rams in forum DRAFT & FA
    Replies: 5
    Last Post: -01-07-2011, 04:34 PM
  4. Sosa's Mock Draft
    By sosa39rams in forum DRAFT & FA
    Replies: 8
    Last Post: -01-07-2011, 12:40 AM
  5. SOSA's MOCK DRAFT v3.0!!!!
    By sosa39rams in forum DRAFT & FA
    Replies: 7
    Last Post: -03-11-2010, 10:53 AM

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •