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  1. #1
    Tony Soprano Guest

    We gotta get Huff !

    A friend sent me some videotape of Texas, and I watched them and all I can say - We gotta get Huff!

    I was very impressed with his speed and acceleration. He flies into running plays seemingly coming out of no where.

    Think about it like this, Reggie Bush ran
    a 4.33 and did 24 reps and the GM and personnel directors went wild. Kiper said he instantly cemeted himself as the Number 1 pick.

    Bush (Far and away the Number 1 pick):
    4.33 24 Reps
    Michael Huff
    4.34 21 Reps

    As I've said, I think Huff can be obtained relatively cheap from Detroit. Detroit would be happy with Justice (in our spot) and a 3rd or two 4ths IMO.

    Detroit, a weak team, can get 3 starters with that trade (the two 4ths).

    But, I repeat myself.
    Last edited by Tony Soprano; -04-04-2006 at 06:18 AM.


  2. #2
    Drew4EverRams Guest

    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    im not so sure linehan&co are that fussed to trade up and if thats the case then i gotta agree with them!

    im not too keen to lose draft picks when we still got a few holes to fill and-

    a)huff could fall to us anyway
    b)if he doesnt then someone like VD or ngata will
    C)we can pick up either TE,C,SLB,DT(3 of the 4 major holes we have )with the picks we were gonna trade to move up!

    im also not really buying into the idea of drafting safeties when we drafted 2 last year!

    IMHO
    Last edited by Drew4EverRams; -04-04-2006 at 06:42 AM.

  3. #3
    chiguy's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    We have too many needs to be giving away a lot of picks except under unusual circumstances. For example, if the only QB is off the board by the time Detroit picks...then I'd think about moving up or down because we won't be getting good value for our pick or, to get value, we'll have to choose someone at a slot we don't need (QB, OT). Even then I think I'd rather look into picking up an extra second or third round pick by moving down. Plus, I don't see Detroit moving unless a guy they want falls.

  4. #4
    Tony Soprano Guest

    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by Drew4EverRams
    a)huff could fall to us anyway
    b)if he doesnt then someone like VD or ngata will
    C)we can pick up either TE,C,SLB,DT(3 of the 4 major holes we have )with the picks we were gonna trade to move up!
    Did you see that list of our draft picks over the last 3-4 years and how many of them were totally wasted?

    I'd rather have one Stud than have a mediocre player and couple players that don't make the grade in the NFL.

    That list of our drafts over the 4 years was DEVASTATING. IMO, if you can get a difference maker, you grab him.

    Plus the draft talent drops precipitiously right in that range.

    I'd be happy with Ngata at #11, but
    Greenway (concern of lower-body strength), Jimmy Williams (concern of attitude and work habits), Tye Hill (concern of size, durability) these guys are not top-11 type guys.

    .

  5. #5
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    The draft is such a crap shoot. Everyone thought Tony Mandarich would be a stud for years in this league. Heck, Tommy Polley was an All American and I do believe still holds the national record for tackles by any HS that player. That being said, he couldn't tackle RamGram......

  6. #6
    Drew4EverRams Guest

    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Soprano
    Did you see that list of our draft picks over the last 3-4 years and how many of them were totally wasted?

    I'd rather have one Stud than have a mediocre player and couple players that don't make the grade in the NFL.

    That list of our drafts over the 4 years was DEVASTATING. IMO, if you can get a difference maker, you grab him.

    Plus the draft talent drops precipitiously right in that range.

    I'd be happy with Ngata at #11, but
    Greenway (concern of lower-body strength), Jimmy Williams (concern of attitude and work habits), Tye Hill (concern of size, durability) these guys are not top-11 type guys.

    .
    i know what you saying about our draft picks over the last 4 years,possibly that could apply during the entire martz HC era(last years was the best in the martz era tho in my opinion)there has been exceptions like pisa,butler,curtis(none first round picks!)
    anyway ive got faith in linehan,haslett etc.... to get the job done this and in later years like tx said it is in many cases a crap shoot,but i say if we can get 3-4 plus starters every draft then we wont go far wrong!

    maybe next year we`ll be in a position to throw everything at a single stud muffin of a player but i think this year we need to spread our bets as theres still more than one hole in our roster!

  7. #7
    Drew4EverRams Guest

    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    id be hyped with ngata at 11th,id trade down for greenway and wouldnt want williams in the first round period!

  8. #8
    HUbison's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    i know what you saying about our draft picks over the last 4 years,possibly that could apply during the entire martz HC era(last years was the best in the martz era tho in my opinion)there has been exceptions like pisa,butler,curtis(none first round picks!)
    The same could be said of the vast majority of coaches and the vast majority of teams. If a draft gives a team 1 or 2 contributors, they should count themselves happy.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  9. #9
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    Exceptions - top teams do it well at the TOP

    Recent ESPN report on the draft noted that 18 of Pittsburgh's 22 starters were obtained through the draft or undrafted college FA!!!!!! Also, even if you just look at their #1 picks:

    2005: Heath Miller - starter and probably future Pro Bowler
    2004: Roethlisberger - Pro Bowler
    2003: Polamalu - Pro Bowler
    2002: Kendall Simmons - starter at guard
    2001: Casey Hampton - Pro Bowler

    So of their last five drafts the Steelers have 3 Pro bowlers and two starters. That is how you get to the Superbowl. Contrast this with our FO developmental picks (Kennedy in his 4th year will 'come around', Lewis is coming, even Pickett had never sniffed pro bowl status, Jackson is solid but no star (yet), the best hope is Barron).

    For the investment your top choices should be Pro Bowlers (at least the majority) and not 'solid starters'... I say trade up get the impact players and forget this trying to get depth from more middle round picks.

  10. #10
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Soprano
    Detroit would be happy with Justice (in our spot) and a 3rd or two 4ths IMO.
    If Detroit moves down to 11, Justice could easily go to the Cardinals, who could still use offensive line help. It's certainly not a lock that he'd be available at 11. He could go to the Bills at 8 if Buffalo thinks he's the answer to their tackle problems.


    Quote Originally Posted by Drew4EverRams
    im also not really buying into the idea of drafting safeties when we drafted 2 last year!
    In 2003, the Arizona Cardinals spent their first and second round pick on two wide receivers. In 2004, they then turned around and drafted WR Larry Fitzgerald. So I wouldn't use players picked the prior year as much of an indication of what a team won't select, especially when there's a new coaching staff involved.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Soprano
    Detroit, a weak team, can get 3 starters with that trade (the two 4ths).
    They can, but the odds of them actually getting three starters with that trade is not great.


    Quote Originally Posted by Tony Soprano
    Tye Hill (concern of size, durability)
    I've not seen or heard anything about concerns over Tye Hill's durability.
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  11. #11
    HUbison's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    The Steelers are good at drafting. So are the Chargers and Patriots.

    However, the vast majority of teams will have hits and misses in the draft. If every team COULD draft Pro Bowlers with every pick, then every team WOULD.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  12. #12
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Hmmm......I certainly agree that the NFL draft is a crap shoot. All this talk about player value. Player X represents good value at the 11th spot but player Y would only be good value sometime after the 15th spot...that just never made great sense to me because so very often, the guys who were drafted later turn out to be highly successful. The NFL is full of them. I think it can be a mistake to adhere too strongly to that philosophy. Why pass up a player you really like at a position you need just because he is projected to go a little later in the round than your spot.
    As to Huff, I think he is one of the safest picks in this draft, maybe even more so than Hawk. I wouldn't mind trading up to get him if the cost was not too high. Trading up is seldom my first choice though. In 1997 we gave up our 1st, 3rd, 4th, and 7th picks to move up 5 spots to select Pace. No one can deny that Pace turned out to be worth it but in hindsight, we could have stayed put, selected Walter Jones, had 3 more picks and still have a perenial all pro tackle.
    This year, it seems like we're in a gray zone with the 11th pick. The truly elite players will most likely be gone by then and most of the good second tier players will still be available later in the round. So moving either up or down makes some sense I think. Unless it becomes apparent that Huff will fall to us.
    I really hope Davis isn't there at 11 so that we aren't tempted to pick him. I've always liked strong defensive teams and that's where our needs are. Our offense is more than adequate and I think there will still be a good TE available to us in the 2nd or 3rd rounds. If Davis is still there at 11, I wonder if there are any teams that would want to trade up to get him?
    Bottom line - I really hope we can get Huff.

  13. #13
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by harrydog
    All this talk about player value. Player X represents good value at the 11th spot but player Y would only be good value sometime after the 15th spot...that just never made great sense to me because so very often, the guys who were drafted later turn out to be highly successful. The NFL is full of them. I think it can be a mistake to adhere too strongly to that philosophy. Why pass up a player you really like at a position you need just because he is projected to go a little later in the round than your spot.
    For a couple of reasons:

    It's easy to look back on past drafts and see guys taken later who turned out to be studs. However, if someone could do that with future drafts, and guarantee that a player projected as a later pick would turn out to be a stud and be right about it, they'd be working for an NFL team and not posting on a message board.

    The primary reason why teams don't just take whoever they want and actually do have to look at value is because of the additional compensation they could be missing out on.

    Look at this example, which I recently used elsewhere in a discussion about why the Rams shouldn't take Bobby Carpenter at 11th overall. If you're at 11th overall and want a guy whom you don't think will go before 21st overall at the earliest, then you trade down to that spot or somewhere close to it and acquire an additional first day pick in the process.

    Now providing your grade on this player is similar to those of other teams in the league, you'll likely still get the player you want (if you don't, there are other good players at that spot still), but you'll also get an additional prospect you wouldn't have gotten otherwise. Ideal situation!

    It's one thing to take a guy at 11 who projects to go in the 15-17 range. It's another thing to take a guy at 11 who is a late first round maybe even second round prospect. Furthermore, it would be a mistake to reach for a player with a lower grade simply because he fills a need. If the Rams graded tight end as their biggest need, should they take Leonard Pope at 11? I don't think so.

    Also, you struck on a very good point. The NFL is in many ways a crap shoot. Which is why you want to also consider not just need but the grades of the players you're looking at. A reach can be justified if that player turns out to be an All Pro. But people can lose their jobs if that reach turns out to be a bust. It's not a sure thing that a guy projected later will be worth the reach, which leads back to the initial point I brought up - it's easy to look back and see that later prospects have done well, but it's harder to prognosticate which ones will fit that bill.
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  14. #14
    HUbison's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Now providing your grade on this player is similar to those of other teams in the league, you'll likely still get the player you want (if you don't, there are other good players at that spot still), but you'll also get an additional prospect you wouldn't have gotten otherwise. Ideal situation!
    Not to mention, whoever you select at #11 will be expecting #11 money. What team wants to pay #11 money to a #21 talent?
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  15. #15
    Nick's Avatar
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    Re: We gotta get Huff !

    Quote Originally Posted by HUbison
    Not to mention, whoever you select at #11 will be expecting #11 money. What team wants to pay #11 money to a #21 talent?
    The Redskins.
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