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Thread: WR rankings!

  1. #46
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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by ludairv View Post
    ummm dude, those guys werent drafted in the top 10...
    Um, dude... those guys all are Hall of Fame candidates.

    lol and if you want me to (not like i really need to) post scouts/analysts opinions of blackmon i can. he was smart to declare this year, if he had gone last year he would not of been taken in the top ten you cant deny that for a second... but yes he may of gone in 10-15 range...
    I "can't deny that for a second"? You overestimate me if you think I have that clear a vision of what would have happened. That stated, he certainly would have been a very good candidate for the 14th pick to the Rams. Since then, he's a year older, and a year more proven.


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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by ludairv View Post
    hindsight is 20/20 bro. why not just take a chance on a later round dude (like those hall of fame players were) and see if they have the kind of potential that those players had? you take recievers that you kno are rare and stand above the rest of the pack. (physical talent,mental talent, intangibles) in the top 10. (megatron,jones, green, fitz,)
    You didn't answer the question bud.

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    Re: WR rankings!

    Correct me if I'm wrong but wasn't Julio Jones slotted to be drafted somewhere in the teens when Atlanta just swooped in out of nowhere and grabbed him? Considering the QBs drafted after him I doubt those teams wanted to move down so Cleveland may have been the only spot they could be sure to get him that was willing to trade.

    I also think I read something about Blackmon going before Jones last year if Blackmon had come out. Perhaps that was pre-combine.

    Edit: I'll just correct myself. Did some digging and it seems Jones started in the teens and through strong workouts got himself pushed into the top 10 (in some mocks) in a kinda shallow WR class. Sounds like Floyd.
    Last edited by DE_Ramfan; -03-27-2012 at 01:41 PM.
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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by ludairv View Post
    Screw Blackmon....if hes not in the elite class like Green or Jones thiers no damn reason to take him top 10 regardless if were handicapped at the position. You take a receiver later in this draft ( who arent that far of a drop off) and then you use you future premium picks to grab those elite studs in the future...Dorial Green Beckham? (just an example)
    Are we really discussing this again??? Green and Jones are not in the 2012 draft so why are we comparing...Im more worried about getting the player that will help us win games not the player that is ranked by a so called expert. Right now Blackmon offers us the biggest edge to win games in the draft because of his skill set and position so we take the player that will win us games...

    Let me ask you a question who said Blackmon is not an elite class WR? A so called expert scout like that stupid walter football guy or a GM like Les Snead that is trying to build a team?
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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by RockinRam View Post
    If you knew they would have turned out like they have, would you have picked them at the Top 10? Just curious.
    lol thats the case for every draft pick in the history of the nfl not gunna get into that debate...

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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam View Post
    Um, dude... those guys all are Hall of Fame candidates.



    I "can't deny that for a second"? You overestimate me if you think I have that clear a vision of what would have happened. That stated, he certainly would have been a very good candidate for the 14th pick to the Rams. Since then, he's a year older, and a year more proven.
    they're hall of fame players AFTER the fact, every draft has their respective insight and process of elimination with respect to draft boards... If teams in the top 10 of those drafts (HOF players) had picked them then, then damn those scouting departments should have their tv spot special on NFL network, but they dont, because they didn't lol.

    Oh for sure he could of been there beacuse of the situation the teams in the top 10. Most had their respective #1 receivers on their team (Bengals?)and wouldn't likely go for a position that they have talent @, now a team like atlanta who thought they were one offensive piece away from contending jumped to grab him # 6. Theirs a lot of what ifs but if the trade never happened you dont know what cleveland would of done, hey they could of easily drafted Julio, but they are a team that has alot of holes so they opted to trade down.
    Last edited by ludairv; -03-27-2012 at 04:36 PM.

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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by BarronWade View Post
    Are we really discussing this again??? Green and Jones are not in the 2012 draft so why are we comparing...Im more worried about getting the player that will help us win games not the player that is ranked by a so called expert. Right now Blackmon offers us the biggest edge to win games in the draft because of his skill set and position so we take the player that will win us games...

    Let me ask you a question who said Blackmon is not an elite class WR? A so called expert scout like that stupid walter football guy or a GM like Les Snead that is trying to build a team?
    Its just simply a thought that can go through the process of evaluation, calculating risk vs reward. You need a template on what to base players off of (current NFL players) . if they think hes as good as the elite Wr's in this league then damn lol i hope they go for it, but if they think hes not, then sorry.

  8. #53
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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick View Post
    That's pretty off-base. If that were my intention, I would have torn into your last mock offseason rather than clicking the Like button for it. Had you just posted your rankings with no comments, I probably wouldn't have had any real criticism. Sure, I would have disagreed with some of them, but that was bound to happen. Opinions vary; that's natural.

    But the issue I'm trying to bring to your attention is the inconsistency in your comments and how they simply don't add up either with the rankings or even other comments you've made.

    Look at the Blackmon/Floyd discussion and how much it's changed in this thread. Despite ranking him second in your list, you argued in your initial post that Floyd would be the better pro because of size and route running. Then on page one of this thread, you said Blackmon was only ranked higher because of Floyd's off the field issues and that the Rams wouldn't take him @ 6. After that, you came up with another reason - pro readiness.

    Now, in the response right before your last one, the reasons continue to shift as you appear to be arguing that Blackmon is ranked higher than Floyd because of schematic fit. But if that's how you feel, then why would you have a guy who you don't think is a great fit with what the Rams are looking to do offensively ranked second highest on your Rams-specific ranking? It's unclear and contradictory, and your reasons seem to keep shifting.

    Similar example, you list Stephen Hill as your fourth-ranked receiver in a Rams-specific ranking, only to say you'd avoid him in the very same post. Later in the thread, you went so far as to argue why he isn't a fit for the Rams because he's too raw. If he isn't a good fit for the Rams and you wouldn't take him in the first two rounds (after first saying you'd avoid him), what's he doing in the fourth slot of your Rams-specific ranking? Again, more confusion and inconsistency.

    What does Alshon Jeffery have to do with anything? Well, you've ranked the guy third on a list that's supposed to be geared towards the Rams specifically, but in defending that ranking, didn't speak at all towards how he'd actually fit to the Rams more than other lower-ranked prospects. It furthers the confusion as to whether this is a general ranking or a Rams-specific ranking. But going even further on Jeffery, in this thread he's your third-ranked WR prospect whom you say you believe in, yet barely a month ago, you said...



    So which is it? What's changed so drastically in a month that you've gone from "wouldn't even bother with him" to "happily take him at the top of Round Two?" Do we need to go back to September when you said you'd take Jeff Fuller over Blackmon, only to vehemently deny ever having said anything like that when I brought it up in January?

    Look, I don't care what your opinion is. We all have opinions, and no one's opinion is more right than anyone else's. What I'm trying to do here isn't to attack you personally, but get you to form an opinion and actually stand by it. Because right now, three pages into this thread, I still have no idea what your ranking actually represents because it seems to change from page to page. Even in the response I'm quoting, you seem to change the intent of the ranking again, this time saying it's how you think the WRs are graded and how they may land according to the Rams' use for them (...uh, what?).

    It's hard to take opinions seriously when there's little conviction behind them and they shift depending on which way the wind is blowing. If you're going to have an opinion, actually have it. Stand by it. Then, it'll be taken seriously.
    When I said I didn't want to bother with Alshon it was when reports came out that he ran a 4.9 and was at 260 lbs, finding out they were false was quite the relief and made me change my mind immediately. At this point I'm rating Jeffery that high due to potential, though I think he offers something not many others do, his size and ability to get the ball. I like Jeffery, and thats that.

    I think Blackmon is a much better fit than Floyd for the Rams. Do you not agree? He is the prototypical WCO WR. Floyd I love, and I think he will be the best WR in the draft, like I've said time and time again. He has great size, runs nice routes, and I feel like the only real knock on him is his off the field issues, which I'm fine with. I think he'll end up going to a team in the teens and I think statistically he will do better than Blackmon, for whatever reason.

    Just so you know, my preferred draft would be either Claiborne slipping to us and we take him, or we slide back down around 5 spots and we take Floyd.

    The Hill issue, like I've said these rankings are both WR RANKINGS and how they PERTAIN TO THE RAMS, a mixture of both. Hill I think can develop into a good WR because he has things you can't teach. I just think at this point I'd avoid him because he is too raw of a WR to really change anything for us (in the immediate term). I think he will become more of a complete WR eventually, but at this point we need someone that'll be able to be out there running every route, and playing all the time. I think Hill in that department is very limited. If I was the Texans or a bonafide team like that with a true #1 WR, I'd happily take Hill with a 2nd round or possibly a 1st round pick. For our team though, I wouldn't before a later round, perhaps a 3rd, most likely a 4th.


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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    When I said I didn't want to bother with Alshon it was when reports came out that he ran a 4.9 and was at 260 lbs, finding out they were false was quite the relief and made me change my mind immediately. At this point I'm rating Jeffery that high due to potential, though I think he offers something not many others do, his size and ability to get the ball. I like Jeffery, and thats that.

    I think Blackmon is a much better fit than Floyd for the Rams. Do you not agree? He is the prototypical WCO WR. Floyd I love, and I think he will be the best WR in the draft, like I've said time and time again. He has great size, runs nice routes, and I feel like the only real knock on him is his off the field issues, which I'm fine with. I think he'll end up going to a team in the teens and I think statistically he will do better than Blackmon, for whatever reason.

    Just so you know, my preferred draft would be either Claiborne slipping to us and we take him, or we slide back down around 5 spots and we take Floyd.

    The Hill issue, like I've said these rankings are both WR RANKINGS and how they PERTAIN TO THE RAMS, a mixture of both. Hill I think can develop into a good WR because he has things you can't teach. I just think at this point I'd avoid him because he is too raw of a WR to really change anything for us (in the immediate term). I think he will become more of a complete WR eventually, but at this point we need someone that'll be able to be out there running every route, and playing all the time. I think Hill in that department is very limited. If I was the Texans or a bonafide team like that with a true #1 WR, I'd happily take Hill with a 2nd round or possibly a 1st round pick. For our team though, I wouldn't before a later round, perhaps a 3rd, most likely a 4th.
    Arnt the rams running an Air Coryell offense? simalar to that of Norv Turner? correct me if im wrong but doesnt that emphasis vertical routes and seems as opposed to slants and cross routes

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Coryell_offense
    Last edited by ludairv; -03-27-2012 at 05:29 PM.

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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by ludairv View Post
    Arnt the rams running an Air Coryell offense? simalar to that of Norv Turner? correct me if im wrong but doesnt that emphasis vertical routes and seems as opposed to slants and cross routes

    Coryell offense - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
    Yes my mistake. Primarily, the offense will be conservative and consists of many short routes where Blackmon excels.


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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    Yes my mistake. Primarily, the offense will be conservative and consists of many short routes where Blackmon excels.
    Actually bro the coryell system is about spreading the ball around...no doubt we will be balanced at Run/pass...but the pass game needs short, intermediate, and deep passes so the receiver we need is a speedy deep threat to take the top off the defense and route savvy possessional receiver...at this point both types of receivers are about the same priority

    EDIT: its similar to the Chargers system...Last year they did it with to good outside receivers in Floyd and Jackson with Gates being the safety net inside...we have Amendola and Kendricks inside with Jax pounding it we just need quality outside play
    Last edited by BarronWade; -03-27-2012 at 09:28 PM.

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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by BarronWade View Post
    Actually bro the coryell system is about spreading the ball around...no doubt we will be balanced at Run/pass...but the pass game needs short, intermediate, and deep passes so the receiver we need is a speedy deep threat to take the top off the defense and route savvy possessional receiver...at this point both types of receivers are about the same priority
    Yes I understand that the Coryell offense is one that spreads the ball, he was the first to basically introduce airing the ball out. But Schotty runs a conservative ground and pound approach to the offense. His books are derived from the Coryell system though. Watching the Jets these past few years, and seeing how vital a player like Santonio Holmes has been just shows how much Blackmon could mean to this offense. Holmes is a smaller, weaker, Blackmon basically. Though they both excel in short-medium yardage routes, running precise ones, and creating YAC.

    I agree about the possession WR/ deep threat WR discussion too. I like DX as a deep threat, but he isn't consistent enough. Perhaps this year he's fully healthy (well not 100%, he never will be) but I mean at his peak.


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    Re: WR rankings!

    Quote Originally Posted by sosa39rams View Post
    When I said...
    Alright, you're either missing my point or refusing to see it. Either way, it's clear my post had no impact at all. You're just repeating the same stuff over again or confounding it with new comments rather than actually think about the issues I and others have brought up. There's no point in continuing if you're just going to keep contradicting your opinions at the drop of a hat while arguing with those that point it out.
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