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  1. #1
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    Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Updated: March 3, 2006, 9:00 PM ET
    Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'
    ESPN.com news services

    ATLANTIC CITY, N.J. -- For nearly a week, University of Texas quarterback Vince Young has had his intelligence discussed, dissected and demeaned in the wake of reported Wonderlic test scores at the NFL scouting combine.

    Vince Young
    Young

    Young, who was honored Friday at the 69th annual Maxwell Award ceremonies, would not answer specific questions about the Wonderlic test but did acknowledge how upsetting the reports have been.

    "It hurts a little bit, and I think it's very disrespectful. But it's cool, it's cool," Young said. "I know what I can do, and I'm going to continue doing what I'm doing."

    Young's agent, Major Adams, brushed off criticism of Young, saying some of it was expected.

    "People are going to try to bring him down between the Rose Bowl and the draft day," Adams said. "They will try to take shots at him, and he hasn't done anything wrong, so we just take it with a grain of salt."

    The 6-foot-5, 230-pound Young led Texas to a 41-38 Rose Bowl victory over USC in college football's national championship game. He could be a potential No. 1 overall pick by the Houston Texans in next month's NFL draft.

    "A rumor is a rumor to me, it's just like high school, they say you kissed some girl, but you really didn't, so that's how I feel about it," said Young, referring to the reported Wonderlic test scores.

    Young has kept his sense of humor, and relied on advice from players like Steve McNair, who also faced his share of doubters coming out of college. He's also gotten the support of reigning NFL MVP Shaun Alexander, a fellow honoree at Friday's Maxwell Awards.

    "Tests are tests to me," Alexander said. "The key thing with any football player is, what can he do when he gets on the field."

    Scouting directors around the league have emphasized the Wonderlic is just a small part of their overall evaluation of Young, and are giving him plenty of tests of their own.

    "I don't really care about the criticism, because I'm pretty much used to it," young said. "There's always something about Vince. ... I feel like I've overcome all of that, turned out pretty good, so I want to continue to do that in the NFL as well."

    Information from ESPN reporter Rachel Nichols and The Associated Press was used in this report.

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  2. #2
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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Ever since Vince Young spoiled everybody's SC bandwagon party, there's been a bullseye on his back. His stock soared after the Rose Bowl and immidiately the detractors tried to shoot him down by questioning his mechanics, his intelligence and his NFL potential.

    Interesting how Young's wonderlic scores were leaked, followed by those of Matt Leinert.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Are the wonderlic scores published for all the draft guys? I thought they were, but I could be wrong.

    It is only a test. I would think that a high wonderlic score does not instantly translate to a good football player.

    Very cool signature 16. Did you make that up?
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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by UtterBlitz
    Are the wonderlic scores published for all the draft guys? I thought they were, but I could be wrong.
    Here is what I have been seeing regarding the scores:

    Wonderlic scores are supposed to be confidential and are never confirmed publicly by the NFL. Because they are included in combine results given to teams after the combine, scores leak out.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    If Young is upset about reports regarding the score, maybe he should have silenced critics by doing well on the second test. Instead he got a 16.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    If Young is upset about reports regarding the score, maybe he should have silenced critics by doing well on the second test. Instead he got a 16.
    So does that mean he is too dumb to be a QB?
    He seems to have done pretty well in college. Maybe he is not good at taking tests.
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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    If Young is upset about reports regarding the score, maybe he should have silenced critics by doing well on the second test. Instead he got a 16.
    I tend to agree with you Nick, but it does seem to me that Young has been scrutinized under the microscope to an unfair degree. In another thread on this subject I think you were able to find some information that Marino reportedly scored a 14, and it was obviously a non-issue. I honestly can't think of any other player entering the draft that has faced as much flack over a wonderlic test score than Young. Both the media and so called "experts" have really tried to tear this guy down, for whatever reason.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by UtterBlitz
    Are the wonderlic scores published for all the draft guys? I thought they were, but I could be wrong.

    It is only a test. I would think that a high wonderlic score does not instantly translate to a good football player.

    Very cool signature 16. Did you make that up?
    No mam I did not. I found it off of some internet site. I don't remember which one but I love it
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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike
    I tend to agree with you Nick, but it does seem to me that Young has been scrutinized under the microscope to an unfair degree. In another thread on this subject I think you were able to find some information that Marino reportedly scored a 14, and it was obviously a non-issue. I honestly can't think of any other player entering the draft that has faced as much flack over a wonderlic test score than Young. Both the media and so called "experts" have really tried to tear this guy down, for whatever reason.
    Well, Marino's low score is a non-issue in hindsight because of the player he became. There are plenty of players with low Wonderlic scores who have excellent careers and get by on talent, and there are plenty with high Wonderlic scores who aren't successful because smarts alone doesn't make you a star.

    There's been plenty of talk about Leinart not having a strong arm or Bush not being an every down back as well, so I wouldn't say Young is the only player to face serious scrutiny. We're talking about a guy who was borderline top five prior to his Rose Bowl performance, which shot him as a lock for the top three, and now the championship high is starting to wear off.

    Was the media trying to tear Young down right after the championship game whenever some journalists felt Houston should pass on Reggie Bush and take the hometown hero instead?

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    Well, Marino's low score is a non-issue in hindsight because of the player he became. There are plenty of players with low Wonderlic scores who have excellent careers and get by on talent, and there are plenty with high Wonderlic scores who aren't successful because smarts alone doesn't make you a star.

    There's been plenty of talk about Leinart not having a strong arm or Bush not being an every down back as well, so I wouldn't say Young is the only player to face serious scrutiny. We're talking about a guy who was borderline top five prior to his Rose Bowl performance, which shot him as a lock for the top three, and now the championship high is starting to wear off.

    Was the media trying to tear Young down right after the championship game whenever some journalists felt Houston should pass on Reggie Bush and take the hometown hero instead?
    You make a good point about the wonderlic not being a accurate barometer of a players true potential. Marino is a prime example. His low score was not an issue. He was given the chance to prove himself and he wasn't subjected to a media gauntlet of inuendo that portrayed him as unintelleigent or lacking in mental abilities before he even stepped on an NFL field. Vince Young, IMO should have been afforded the same considerations. Unfortunately, that didn't happen.

    I am pulling for him to prove his detractors wrong because I think he's a great kid with amazing talent and a lot of character. I like his chances, despite the added burdens he now finds himself under.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike
    You make a good point about the wonderlic not being a accurate barometer of a players true potential. Marino is a prime example. His low score was not an issue. He was given the chance to prove himself and he wasn't subjected to a media gauntlet of inuendo that portrayed him as unintelleigent or lacking in mental abilities before he even stepped on an NFL field. Vince Young, IMO should have been afforded the same considerations. Unfortunately, that didn't happen.

    I am pulling for him to prove his detractors wrong because I think he's a great kid with amazing talent and a lot of character. I like his chances, despite the added burdens he now finds himself under.
    But Marino came out in a different time where the media and the idea of information reaching the public as quickly and widespread as it does did not exist. Marino was not subjected to a media gauntlet because said gauntlet as we know it today did not exist when Marino came out in 1983.

    Furthermore, Marino wasn't a top prospect when he came out like Young was after his Rose Bowl victory. Marino was drafted late in the first round. A better comparison may have been John Elway since he was a top pick that year, but he had to go and ruin any possibility of a comparison by actually getting a respectable 29 on his Wonderlic.

    I like Young as well and was happy to see him help lead Texas to a national championship, but this would be the case if any top prospect had done this. If Leinart doesn't throw well at his pro day or Bush doesn't show blazing speed, the media will be on them as well. I find it hard to believe that Young is some poor persecuted bystander to a relentless media assault, especially when articles like this are still coming out. The fact of the matter is a poor Wonderlic score does generate questions about how well a quarterback prospect can read complex pro defenses, and again, if he really wanted to get the media off his back, he could have done better than a 16 on the retest. We're not exactly talking about the MCATs here.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by Nick
    But Marino came out in a different time where the media and the idea of information reaching the public as quickly and widespread as it does did not exist. Marino was not subjected to a media gauntlet because said gauntlet as we know it today did not exist when Marino came out in 1983.

    Furthermore, Marino wasn't a top prospect when he came out like Young was after his Rose Bowl victory. Marino was drafted late in the first round. A better comparison may have been John Elway since he was a top pick that year, but he had to go and ruin any possibility of a comparison by actually getting a respectable 29 on his Wonderlic.

    I like Young as well and was happy to see him help lead Texas to a national championship, but this would be the case if any top prospect had done this. If Leinart doesn't throw well at his pro day or Bush doesn't show blazing speed, the media will be on them as well. I find it hard to believe that Young is some poor persecuted bystander to a relentless media assault, especially when articles like this are still coming out. The fact of the matter is a poor Wonderlic score does generate questions about how well a quarterback prospect can read complex pro defenses, and again, if he really wanted to get the media off his back, he could have done better than a 16 on the retest. We're not exactly talking about the MCATs here.
    I guess my problem with this whole Young situation is that way too much emphesis has been placed on a test that IMO has little or no legitimacy in evaluating football savy. The fact that Marino scored a 14 tells me all I need to know about the relevance of the wonderlic.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Yea I don't think that test is a big deal either. I mean its kind of embarassing to get a 6. But it has nothing on football. He is more Football Smart than Book Smart evidently. I mean I really don't think that test is that big of a deal.
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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by r8rh8rmike
    I guess my problem with this whole Young situation is that way too much emphesis has been placed on a test that IMO has little or no legitimacy in evaluating football savy. The fact that Marino scored a 14 tells me all I need to know about the relevance of the wonderlic.
    Well, if the test really did have little or no legitimacy in evaluating football savy, then I doubt the NFL would continue to administer it. But that's just my opinion.

    The fact that Marino got a 14 shouldn't tell you anything really, because I don't think you can look at one successful guy who didn't do well and use him as an example as to why not to be concerned when someone else doesn't do well. I can point to a number of guys who have scored high and have done well, and also point to a number of guys who have scored high and stunk.

    There's a lot of variation among the test, as there are many tests from the combine. The best receivers aren't always the fastest or the tallest, and the best QBs don't always have the strongest arms or best accuracy.

    Yeah, Dan Marino scored in the teens. While I know this isn't what you're saying, that doesn't mean other players who score in the teens or worse are going to be Dan Marino. Nor does it mean the test has no merit. There aren't clubs out there that swing their entire opinion on a guy due to his Wonderlic score, but it's not a non-factor in evaluation.

    I wouldn't be surprised if there's a club like Tennessee who may be weighing between Cutler and Young, and Young's score plays a factor. It's not the biggest factor, but a factor nonetheless.

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    Re: Young calls Wonderlic reports 'disrespectful'

    Quote Originally Posted by RamsFan16
    Yea I don't think that test is a big deal either. I mean its kind of embarassing to get a 6. But it has nothing on football. He is more Football Smart than Book Smart evidently. I mean I really don't think that test is that big of a deal.
    The problem is, if a guy doesn't do well at the combine in a particular drill or test, you can make this excuse for just about anything. I've seen them all, really.

    He ran a poor forty, but that measures track speed, not football speed.

    His bench press wasn't impressive, but he's not weight room strong. He's football strong.

    He didn't score well on the Wonderlic, but he's football smart.

    At some point, you have to ask yourself why the NFL and NFL teams are wasting their time testing athletes on things that apparently, according to some fans, don't measure anything.

    What's even better is when a guy does well, suddenly the tests are proof of his talent and ability as a pro prospect. He ran a fast 40 time because he has elite speed for the next level. His bench press numbers indicate he can be a dominant force on the line of scrimmage. His Wonderlic score shows he has the mental capacity to read and react to given situations.

    Obviously I'm speaking in generalities and not referencing anyone specifically. But if Vince Young decides to take a third Wonderlic test, and scores in the mid 20s, is it still going to be a non-factor? Will the people who have tried to brush off the legitimacy of the poor test do a 180 and try to make the case that Young has demonstrated the necessary mental capacity?

    It's a fine line. Either the tests mean something, or they don't. Frankly, I tend to believe they all have their merit, or else they wouldn't be administered in the first place. While organizations deal with large sums of money, I find it hard to believe they'd throw $70 grand away to go to a combine that runs tests which apparently aren't accurate assessments of what an athlete will be or could be in the pros.

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