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  1. #46
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Can someone provide an example of an "absolute truth?"

    I'd like to know what that is.....

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  2. #47
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Hmm I wonder if some people's opinion is persuaded by the thought of America dropping bombs on Muslims just as they were glad to to see a good Christian quarterback stabbed in the back when he left the Rams.

  3. #48
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by RamTime
    Hmm I wonder if some people's opinion is persuaded by the thought of America dropping bombs on Muslims just as they were glad to to see a good Christian quarterback stabbed in the back when he left the Rams.
    This thread just took a rather unexpected turn........

    Er, no actually my opinion isn't persuaded by the thought of dropping bombs on anyone whether they be Muslim,Christian, Hindu, Buddhist or Zoroastrian.

    Which is one of the reason's I don't agree with your conspiracy theory.

    As for Mr Warner, he got benched and then released for reasons of performance not religion.

    Religion governs moral,ethical and spiritual conduct not sporting prowess so I don't judge Kurt on it and neither do I argue with the nature of faith howsoever it is expressed. This is the primary reason why I find Wahabi Islam so distasteful and AL QAEDA so dangerous.

    Unlike Wahabi Islam however, I don't believe in killing people because they don't share my faith or my opinion on faith whether it be by the knife or the bomb.

    I don't assume this is directed at me in particular, but I find this post a little objectionable.

  4. #49
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Conspiracy theorists must provide proof of things that are normally common sense. Such as planes do not vaporize, concrete does not turn to dust without high explosives, steel buildings do not collapse except when they are demolished with high explosives and airplane crashes leave pieces of airplane at the crash site.

    However the governments theories do not mandate this characteristic that we call common sense regardless of how senseless it is. It also does not matter if the governments theory defies the laws of basic physics. Why? because anyone who dare call themselves an American should place their noses up the administrations ass far enough to obscure their vision and their hearing because common sense is the enemy of the official story. True patriotic Americans will not allow common sense or evidence to stand in the way of their right to be free. So we are left with the following absurd story.

    • Unfortunately 19 Muslims with razor blades and box cutters simultaneously successfully hijacked 4 airplanes.
    • Unfortunately United and American airline pilots were unable to send a distress signal in all 4 hijackings.
    • Unfortunately they flew them into pre determined targets in the most heavily guarded air space on the planet without the aid of air traffic controllers.
    • Unfortunately they flew undetected by Air Force radar and FCC radar.
    • Unfortunately they did not appear on radar again until just before they hit their targets.
    • Unfortunately our air defense system bungled all four hijackings, unable to get a military jet on their wing even though this is a common occurrence happening about 100 times per year when an aircraft stray’s off its flight pattern.
    • Unfortunately both Planes vaporized however fortunately they were able to recover most of the human remains.
    • Unfortunately (Notwithstanding controlled demolition); for the first time in history A Steel Framed Sky Scraper collapsed and after burning for only 47 minutes.
    • Unfortunately (Notwithstanding controlled demolition); for the first time in history fire caused 425,000 cubic yards of concrete to turn to dust shooting out of the demolition err collapse wave hundreds of feet.
    • Unfortunately this somehow also caused steel beams to be diced up and shot out of the side of the demolition err collapse wave hundreds of feet as well.
    • Unfortunately (Notwithstanding controlled demolition); for the second time in history a Steel framed sky scraper collapsed after burning for 102 minutes.
    • Unfortunately the tower collapsed even though there is photographic evidence that the hole in the tower was pitch black and there is a Lady standing in that hole looking down at the ground and a fire fighter said he could knock two isolated pockets of fire down.
    • Unfortunately (Notwithstanding controlled demolition); for the second time in history fire caused 425,000 cubic yards of concrete to turn to dust shooting out of the demolition err collapse wave hundreds of feet.
    • Unfortunately this also caused steel beams to be diced up and shot out of the side of the demolition err collapse wave hundreds of feet.
    • Unfortunately FEMA and the Kean commission were not allowed to entertain the theory of controlled demolition even though virtually everyone in and around the trade center said they heard huge explosions right before the towers turned to dust.
    • Unfortunately (Notwithstanding controlled demolition); for the third time in history a steel framed sky scraper that was not hit by an air plane collapsed perfectly into its own footprint. Fortunately it was decided that the American people had seen enough destruction so video of the 3rd collapse was withheld after being shown only one time.
    • Unfortunately we were incapable of finding any wreckage consistent with a Boeing 757 at two of the crash sites.
    • Unfortunately there was no video of any of the hijackers boarding any of the planes.
    • Fortunately within 72 hours the FBI had the photos of all 19 hijackers along with the details of the plot.
    • Unfortunately many hijackers protested saying that they were still alive and they had nothing to do with the hijackings.
    • Unfortunately FBI officials were at a gas station and a hotel near the pentagon within minutes of the crash to confiscate their video otherwise there may be proof that flight 77 hit the pentagon.
    • Fortunately; even though there was no video cameras on at the pentagon, they released 5 photographs taken from their video camera.
    • Unfortunately those pictures show the exhaust from a missile or a rocket.
    • Unfortunately jets don’t leave white streaks of exhaust unless the atmosphere is below freezing. Unfortunately this was on September 11th not February 11th.
    • Fortunately Even though the secret service knew there were other hijackings and ignored their duties when they allowed the president to sit and read a 2nd grade book about a goat the hijackers did not fly the planes into that school.
    • Unfortunately 7 out of 8 of the black boxes which are made of the strongest material known to man were unable to survive the crash.
    • Fortunately a passport of one of the hijackers (which is made out of paper) was found unharmed two blocks away from the towers in downtown Manhattan.

    All of you patriotic Americans who believe that our government could never be involved in such an event should show as many people as you can the ridiculous evidence of conspiracy minded people in this country. Share in the fun of laughing at them by pointing as many people as you can to the ridiculous video evidence that conspiracy theorists present. In fact you should write letters to the major networks and demand they put this riduculous tripe on television so everyone can get a good laugh.

  5. #50
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    I'm not a patriotic American, so I shall retain the right to do and think and say exactly what I please.

    I imagine those of our colleagues who do count themselves as patriotic Americans but who disagree with you are going to be a little irritated by this post.

    The genteel, good humoured nature of this thread would seem to have gone for a burton...........................

  6. #51
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by UtterBlitz
    Can someone provide an example of an "absolute truth?"

    I'd like to know what that is.....
    up is up, down is down, 1+1=2, the 4th of July is an American holiday celebrated on July 4th (oddly enough).......absolute truths are everywhere. However, in today's post-modern world, nobody wants to hear about "absolute" because if somebody is absolutely right, then opposing viewpoints HAVE to be absolutely wrong.
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  7. #52
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Al-Quaeda (after all, they openly took responsibility for the acts),
    Completely false statement



    So it is quite the opposite I'm afraid. Bin Laden has denied involvement which is uncharacteristic of a terrorist group because they always claim responsibility of successful attacks. One would think if he excuted the attacks he would take responsibility.


    *****************


    Blair's evidence of bin Laden's guilt nothing but old news stories and leaps of logic


    by Stephen Gowans
    One dark morning a few weeks ago I stepped into a cab. The cab driver, keenly following the news of the aftermath of September 11th, had been listening to radio reports all night. But he tore his attention away from the tragedy, and we began to chat idly.

    As used car and donut signs whizzed by, the sonorous voice of the radio news announcer broke in on our conversation. That day's lead story was the Taliban's reply to Washington's ultimatum to hand over Osama bin Laden. We both pricked up our ears as the news announcer began.

    "The Taliban has agreed to hand over Osama bin Laden," the announcer said, "but is asking Washington to show clear evidence of bin Laden's involvement in the September 11th attacks."

    Eminently reasonable, I thought. If there's evidence pointing to bin Laden's complicity, he should be turned over, and prosecuted to the fullest extent of the law. There's plenty of evidence that he's been behind terrorist attacks elsewhere - in Kosovo, in Macedonia, in Bosnia, in Chechnya, and in Dagestan, in those instances, with the full knowledge of Washington.

    For example, on May 4th, 1999, The Washington Post reported that in 1998 "State Department officials labeled the KLA a terrorist organization, saying it bankrolled its operations with proceeds from the heroin trade and from loans from known terrorists like bin Laden...The officials charged that the KLA used terrorist tactics to assault Serbian and ethnic Albanian civilians in a campaign to ruthlessly induce Western media sympathy and achieve independence."

    On June 22, 2001 The Washington Times reported that a bin Laden representative "is the main financial supporter of the National Liberation Army," the NLA, which has terrorized Macedonia.

    In November, 1998 The Sunday Times reported that bin Laden operated a terrorist network out of Albania.

    On September 24, 1999 Agence France Presse reported that bin Laden was granted as Bosnian passport in 1993. The report pointed out that "Islamic fighters battled alongside Muslim soldiers in central Bosnia against Bosnian Serbs."

    Of course, bin Laden's connection to terror attacks elsewhere doesn't mean he plotted the September 11th attacks, but if there's credible evidence he did, he should be held to account for those attacks, and for his involvement in other terror operations too, including those in the Balkans and central Asia. Indeed, bin Laden's support for terrorism in the Balkans should have been stopped long ago. Instead, Washington let bin Laden's terrorism go unchecked, even siding with him against the victims.

    But as I soon discovered, my view wasn't shared - not by the cab driver, not by the news announcer, and certainly not by Washington.

    "Evidence! What evidence do you need?" the driver sputtered in exasperation. "The evidence is staring you in the face."

    Others, including Deputy Secretary of Defense Paul Wolfowitz would later make the same claim. Bin Laden's culpability is so plain that asking for evidence is like asking for evidence that Michael Jackson has had re-constructive surgery.

    But as the days rolled by, the initial acceptance that Washington didn't need to produce evidence started to fray at the edges, and some reporters and some current and could-be US allies began to ask questions. Are you going to show us the evidence that bin Laden's involved? "Sure," said Secretary of State Colin Powel. "Soon." But that promise, was, a few days later, followed by a retraction. Powel couldn't present the evidence, he explained. Security concerns. Disclosing the evidence would compromise intelligence sources.

    Allies flocked to Powel's rescue. "We don't need evidence," they said. "We're convinced it was bin Laden." Of course, anyone who made the equally lame statement, "I'm convinced it's not Osama bin Laden, and I don't need any evidence," would be hooted down with well-deserved derision. So why not leaders like Canada's Jean Chretien, or NATO chief Lord Robertson?

    Perhaps recognizing that Chretien's and Robertson's idiocy was doing more harm than good, Tony Blair, Britain's Prime Minister, and Washington's junior partner, declared that he had seen the evidence, and it was powerful and incontrovertible.

    Yesterday, Blair disclosed the evidence to the public, laying out "in 70 damning points...the complete evidence (showing) the direct complicity of Osama bin Laden in the terrorist attacks of September 11th."

    Someone should tell Blair that restating allegations is not the same as presenting evidence.

    Blair's 70-point brief, if you take the time to sift through it, is nothing more than a rehash of old newspaper stories, innuendo, leaps of logic, and a restatement of the charges, with a significant part of bin Laden's history and connection to "international terrorism" left out.

    Sixty of Blair's seventy-points have nothing whatever to do with the September 11th attacks, but offer an incomplete history of bin Laden , his movements, and Al-Qaeda. There's nothing on the Saudi millionaire's connections to terror campaigns in the Balkans or Chechnya or Dagestan.

    The greatest detail is provided in describing the 1993 attacks on US military personnel in Somalia and the 1998 attacks on the US embassies in Nairobi and Dar es Salaam , as if establishing bin Laden's connection to those attacks, proves he was behind the New York and Washington attacks.

    And then Blair offers something significant: "Mr. bin Laden has claimed responsibility for the attack on US soldiers in Somalia....; for the attack on the US embassies in Kenya and Tanzania in August of 1998." But he hasn't claimed responsibility for the September 11th attacks. Quite the opposite - he denies responsibility. That's something Blair doesn't wonder about.

    You could see a particularly dim prosecutor making the same kind of case against a bank robber, and being excoriated by the judge for wasting the Court's time. "Well, Butch here, robbed a bank in L.A. in 1993, and another in Phoenix in 1995. He's admitted to both robberies. And while he denies he robbed the bank in Sydney, Australia two weeks ago, it must be him because he robbed those two other banks here in the US. "

    Is Blair's case any different?

    After plowing through 60 points of background we finally get to the meat of the document, or what's supposed to be a thick, succulent slab of evidence, but turns out to be a disappointing piece of warmed over shoe leather.

    Points 61 through 69 deal with the September 11th attacks. They're mostly a rehash of what anyone who reads a daily newspaper will already have read - 19 men are identified as the hijackers of which three are linked to al-Qaeda, etc.. Sensing perhaps that by this point anyone who's taken the time to read the brief will be throwing their hands up in exasperation, crying, "You haven't told me anything new," Blair introduces this bombshell: "There is evidence of a very specific nature relating to the guilt of Mr. bin Laden and his associates that is too sensitive to release."

    What? I've gone this far, plowing through a document that purports to present incontrovertible evidence, but has presented none, only to be told at point 62 of 70 that, "We have evidence, but we can't tell you what it is"?

    But Blair's not done. There are seven more points to go. Having established that bin Laden is connected with previous terror attacks against US targets, in Somalia, Kenya and Tanzania, Blair says in point 65, "The attacks of September 11 are consistent with the scale and sophistication of the previous attacks."

    Huh? Has he been briefed on what happened that terrible day?

    The attacks of September 11th were on a much bigger scale and involved infinitely more sophistication and coordination and cunning and daring than car bombings. Comparing previous attacks to the September 11th attacks is like comparing the sniffles to viral pneumonia.

    And isn't there an astonishing leap of logic here? Evidence of Bin Laden being involved in previous attacks, does not constitute evidence that he was involved in the September 11th attacks, especially given the previous attacks were nothing like the September 11th attacks. Blair's simply saying, "Bin Laden's a bad guy. Therefore, he must be involved. He's done this kind of thing before," not much different from the dim prosecutor who points to an accused's previous crimes as evidence of culpability for some current crime. I don't know about you, but in my books - and in a court of law -- that hardly counts as overwhelming, incontrovertible evidence.

    Blair's argument about September 11th having the marks of a bin Laden operation is made in point 64: "The modus operandi of September 11th was entirely consistent with previous attacks."

    No it wasn't. For one, Blair says bin Laden claimed responsibility for the Somalia, Tanzania and Kenya attacks. But the Saudi millionaire has denied responsibility for the New York and Washington attacks. That hardly seems consistent. And the previous attacks were attacks on American targets in foreign countries. This was an attack on US soil. That, too, is inconsistent. Moreover, most attacks bin Laden has some connection to, have been directed at Serbs, Macedonians and Russians, not Americans, a point Blair is silent on.

    What's more, no one would deny that the September 11th attacks were unique. Nothing like the operation has ever been done before. So how can it be said to be like previous bin Laden operations? This wasn't like any operation anywhere.

    Wrapping up, Blair declares in point 69 that "no other organization has the motivation and the capability to carry out attacks like those of September 11," but what evidence does he offer? None, which, it seems, is only to be expected from Blair. I can think of plenty of organizations that have the resources to pull something off like September 11th , none of them a rag-tag band of people living in tents in an enormously poor and backward country, that has never mounted an operation of this scale and sophistication before.

    So, weeks after I first heard the news report that the Taliban had demanded evidence of bin Laden's involvement in the September 11th attacks, we're no further ahead. Nothing has changed, except that Washington and its junior partner in London are a little farther along in their plans to launch a major military operation, directed ostensibly at a man and organization they can't, or won't, provide evidence of being involved in the September 11th attacks. Meanwhile, Washington, and many of its allies, have taken a good many steps toward crafting legislation to limit civil liberties, and towards shoveling billions more into the pockets of defense contractors. In Bush's case, there's been ground made on the tax cut front, with promises to cut taxes even more generously for the wealthy, as a means of "stimulating an economy weakened by the attacks," but it may be more accurate to say he's made a good start in making over the US to benefit the wealthy in a way he would never had been able to do in the absence of September 11th. And significantly, with the establishment of a substantial military presence in central Asia underway, Washington will soon crack the nut of securing access to the trillions of dollars of oil wealth locked beneath the Caspian Sea.

    A lot has been accomplished in a few short weeks by those whose interests lie firmly in oil wealth, lower taxes, defense spending, and muzzling what was becoming a bothersome anti-globalization movement. But those weeks have come and gone, and despite promises that the proof was forthcoming, despite Paul Wolfowitz's claim that the evidence was plain to see, despite Blair's 70-point restatement of the allegations, we still have no more of a sound basis to believe that bin Laden was behind the attacks than we did that dark morning I stepped into the taxi cab to hear the Taliban agree to hand over bin Laden if Washington could present proof.

    Proof? Who needs proof? Washington says, "Trust us. Trust Tony Blair. Have we ever lied?"

  8. #53
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by Fat Pang
    This thread just took a rather unexpected turn........

    Er, no actually my opinion isn't persuaded by the thought of dropping bombs on anyone whether they be Muslim,Christian, Hindu, Buddhist or Zoroastrian.

    Which is one of the reason's I don't agree with your conspiracy theory.

    As for Mr Warner, he got benched and then released for reasons of performance not religion.

    Religion governs moral,ethical and spiritual conduct not sporting prowess so I don't judge Kurt on it and neither do I argue with the nature of faith howsoever it is expressed. This is the primary reason why I find Wahabi Islam so distasteful and AL QAEDA so dangerous.

    Unlike Wahabi Islam however, I don't believe in killing people because they don't share my faith or my opinion on faith whether it be by the knife or the bomb.

    I don't assume this is directed at me in particular, but I find this post a little objectionable.
    Ok getting back on track then lets take it one point at a time.

    1. For a valid airline crash do you believe that an airplane should be found at the crash site or is an airplane at an airplane crash site not a necessity to have a valid airplane crash site.

  9. #54
    AvengerRam's Avatar
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by RamTime
    Hmm I wonder if some people's opinion is persuaded by the thought of America dropping bombs on Muslims just as they were glad to to see a good Christian quarterback stabbed in the back when he left the Rams.
    Allow me to translate for those who didn't get this subtle jab.

    RamTime is suggesting that because I am Jewish, that I am all too happy to accept that there was a valid basis for the U.S. to bomb Muslims, just as I supposedly wanted the Rams to get rid of Kurt Warner because he is Christian.

    Well, you got me.

    You see, I, along with my cohorts at high levels in the banking and entertainment industries, am executing a master plan to destroy the power bases of all gentiles and to bring the Jewish people to their rightful place as the leaders of the World. I tell you this now because the wheels are in motion and it is too late for any of you to stop us!

    Death to the uncircumcised pork eaters of the World!!!!!!

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!

  10. #55
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by UtterBlitz
    So Avenger, does this discussion make you curious about the buildings collapsing as they did, at all?
    No, because I saw a documentary on PBS in which independent engineers explained how the heat of the fire (which was enhanced by the fact that the planes had a full load of fuel) was sufficient to destroy the internal foundation of the buildings, thereby causing their collapse. I'm not an engineer, but that is a far more plausible explanation than some government conspiracy to destroy buildings in New York to justify a war in Iraq.

    Are you curious as to if there is a cover-up regarding Pat Tillman's death?
    No, I have no trouble believing that the military is trying to cover up an act of incompetence (as opposed to murder).

    I think you should not discount all the research that has been done by many people so easily.
    Saying "isn't it strange," and "how can it be," or "unnamed witnesses said" does not amount to "research" in my book. Anyone can throw out questions and form a hypothesis. Particularly those with an agenda. That doesn't make them worth listening to.

  11. #56
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by AvengerRam
    Allow me to translate for those who didn't get this subtle jab.

    RamTime is suggesting that because I am Jewish, that I am all too happy to accept that there was a valid basis for the U.S. to bomb Muslims, just as I supposedly wanted the Rams to get rid of Kurt Warner because he is Christian.

    Well, you got me.

    You see, I, along with my cohorts at high levels in the banking and entertainment industries, am executing a master plan to destroy the power bases of all gentiles and to bring the Jewish people to their rightful place as the leaders of the World. I tell you this now because the wheels are in motion and it is too late for any of you to stop us!

    Death to the uncircumcised pork eaters of the World!!!!!!

    Bwahahahahahahahahahahahaha!!!!!!!
    I knew it, you are trying to take over the world! And just as soon as I finish this BLT sandwich, I'm going to put a stop to it!
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

  12. #57
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote Originally Posted by AV
    No, because I saw a documentary on PBS
    You fool! They're in on it, too. Don't you know how much government money PBS receives? Of course, they're going to tow the government line!
    "Before the gates of excellence the high gods have placed sweat; long is the road thereto and rough and steep at first; but when the heights are reached, then there is ease, though grievously hard in the winning." --- Hesiod

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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows



    Watch out, I have powerful allies!
    Last edited by AvengerRam; -01-24-2006 at 01:22 PM.

  14. #59
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    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    Quote=AvengerRam:
    Al-Quaeda (after all, they openly took responsibility for the acts),
    Quote Originally Posted by RamTime
    Completely false statement

    So it is quite the opposite I'm afraid. Bin Laden has denied involvement which is uncharacteristic of a terrorist group because they always claim responsibility of successful attacks. One would think if he excuted the attacks he would take responsibility.
    Of course, you're incorrect about this.

    Bin Laden Claims Responsibility for 9/11
    Saturday, October 30, 2004

    WASHINGTON — Usama bin Laden (search ) made his first televised appearance in more than a year Friday in which he admitted for the first time ordering the Sept. 11 attacks and accused President Bush of "misleading" the American people.
    Injecting himself into the campaign four days ahead of the presidential election, bin Laden said the United States can avoid another Sept. 11-style attack if it stops threatening the security of Muslims.
    In the portion of the tape that was broadcast, the Al Qaeda (search) leader refrained from directly warning of new attacks, although he said "there are still reasons to repeat what happened."
    "Your security is not in the hands of Kerry, Bush or Al Qaeda. Your security is in your own hands," bin Laden said, referring to the president and his Democratic opponent. "Any state that does not mess with our security, has naturally guaranteed its own security."
    Admitting for the first time that he ordered the Sept. 11 attacks, bin Laden said he did so because of injustices against the Lebanese and Palestinians by Israel and the United States.
    In what appeared to be conciliatory language, bin Laden said he wanted to explain why he ordered the airline hijackings that hit the World Trade Center (search) and the Pentagon so Americans would know how to act to prevent another attack.
    "To the American people, my talk is to you about the best way to avoid another Manhattan," he said. "I tell you: Security is an important element of human life and free people do not give up their security."
    After the video was aired, President Bush said that "Americans will not be intimidated" by bin Laden. Sen. John Kerry criticized Bush for failing to capture bin Laden earlier and said that "I can run a more effective war on terror."
    The political impact of the tape could cut both ways. It bolsters Bush's argument that the world is a dangerous place and plays to his strength as commander in chief in fighting the war on terror, but it also underscores that his administration has failed to capture or kill America's No. 1 enemy more than three years after the terror attacks on New York and Washington.
    It was the first footage in more than a year of the fugitive Al Qaeda leader, thought to be hiding in the mountains along the Pakistan-Afghanistan border. The video, broadcast on Al-Jazeera television, showed bin Laden with a long, gray beard, wearing traditional white robes, a turban and a golden cloak, standing behind a table with papers and in front of a plain, brown curtain.
    His hands were steady and he appeared healthy.
    The Bush administration said it believes the videotape is authentic and was made recently, noting that bin Laden referred to 1,000 U.S. military deaths in Iraq -- which happened in early September.
    White House press secretary Scott McClellan said the administration did not plan to raise the nation's threat level for now. The U.S. official said the 18-minute tape -- which carries English subtitles, though not in the portion shown on Al-Jazeera -- lacks an explicit threat and repeats well-worn themes.
    Multiple sources told FOX News that the tape is authentic and that it was made recently.
    Al-Jazeera, which is based in Qatar, broadcast about seven minutes of the tape. The station's spokesman, Jihad Ali Ballout, said Al-Jazeera aired what was "newsworthy and relevant" and refused to describe the unaired portions, including whether they included any threats. Ballout said the station received the tape Friday but would not say how.
    Before the tape was aired, the State Department asked the government of Qatar to discourage Al-Jazeera from broadcasting it, a senior State Department official said.
    In the video, bin Laden accused Bush of misleading Americans by saying the attack was carried out because Al Qaeda "hates freedom." The terrorist leader said his followers have left alone countries that do not threaten Muslims.
    "We fought you because we are free ... and want to regain freedom for our nation. As you undermine our security we undermine yours," bin Laden said.
    He said he was first inspired to attack the United States by the 1982 Israeli invasion of Lebanon in which towers and buildings in Beirut were destroyed in the siege of the capital.
    "While I was looking at these destroyed towers in Lebanon, it sparked in my mind that the tyrant should be punished with the same and that we should destroy towers in America, so that it tastes what we taste and would be deterred from killing our children and women," he said.
    "God knows that it had not occurred to our mind to attack the towers, but after our patience ran out and we saw the injustice and inflexibility of the American-Israeli alliance toward our people in Palestine and Lebanon, this came to my mind," he said.
    Bin Laden suggested Bush was slow to react to the Sept. 11 attacks, giving the hijackers more time than they expected. At the time of the attacks, the president was listening to schoolchildren in Florida reading a book.
    "It never occurred to us that the commander in chief of the American armed forces would leave 50,000 of his citizens in the two towers to face these horrors alone," he said, referring to the number of people who worked at the World Trade Center.
    "It appeared to him [Bush] that a little girl's talk about her goat and its butting was more important than the planes and their butting of the skyscrapers. That gave us three times the required time to carry out the operations, thank God," he said.
    Excluding the hijackers, the Sept. 11 attacks killed 2,749 people at the World Trade Center, 184 at the Pentagon and 40 in Pennsylvania.
    In planning the attacks, bin Laden said he told Mohammed Atta, one of the hijackers, that the strikes had to be carried out "within 20 minutes before Bush and his administration noticed."
    Bin Laden compared the Bush administration to repressive Arab regimes "in that half of them are ruled by the military and the other half are ruled by the sons of kings and presidents."
    He said the resemblance became clear when Bush's father was president and visited Arab countries.
    "He wound up being impressed by the royal and military regimes and envied them for staying decades in their positions and embezzling the nation's money with no supervision," bin Laden said.
    "He passed on tyranny and oppression to his son, and they called it the Patriot Act, under the pretext of fighting terror. Bush the father did well in placing his sons as governors and did not forget to pass on the expertise in fraud from the leaders of the (Mideast) region to Florida to use it in critical moments."
    The image of bin Laden reading a statement was dramatically different from the few other videos of the Al Qaeda leader that have emerged since the Sept. 11 attacks.
    In the last videotape, issued Sept. 10, 2003, bin Laden is seen walking through rocky terrain with his top deputy Ayman al-Zawahri, both carrying automatic rifles. In a taped message issued at the same time, bin Laden praises the "great damage to the enemy" on Sept. 11 and mentions five hijackers by name.
    In December 2001, the Pentagon released a videotape in which bin Laden is shown at a dinner with associates in Afghanistan on Nov. 9, 2001, saying the destruction of the Sept. 11 attacks exceeded even his "optimistic" calculations.
    But in none of his previous messages, audio or video, did bin Laden directly state that he ordered the attacks.
    U.S. authorities have long said they believe bin Laden is hiding in a rugged, mountainous tribal region of Pakistan that borders Afghanistan, but there has been no firm evidence of his whereabouts for three years.
    The last audiotape purportedly from bin Laden came in April. The speaker on the tape, which CIA analysts said likely was the Al Qaeda leader, offered a truce to European nations if they pull troops out of Muslim countries. The tape referred to the March 22 assassination by Israel of Hamas founder Sheik Ahmed Yassin.
    Retired Lt. Col. Bill Cowen, a FOX News military analyst, said bin Laden timed the tape deliberately.
    "I think he's just trying to slap the president around a little bit and in my opinion is trying to influence the election," Cowen said.
    Cowen said that while the tape showed that the most wanted terrorist was still at large, it also should be seen in another light.
    "This tape is also a reminder of how we've decimated the top Al Qaeda leadership," Cowen said. "It took us 20 years to find Ted Kaczynski, the Unabomber, right here in the United States."
    And, before you shrug this off as a Right Wing Fox News thing, every other major news organization reported the exact same thing at the time.

  15. #60
    RamTime Guest

    Re: Every American Should See And Hear What The Rest Of the World Already Knows

    As I stated earlier i have investigated this for months and I have seen this tape.
    So naturally I hoped that somenoe would make the mistake of bringing up this tape. The support for the current administration escalates when ever they raise the fears of Americans. Funny this tape was released by Washington 4 days before the election. Now I know that common sense is not needed by the sheeple of the country but that tape was phony.
    #1 Bin Laden is left handed however he is writing a note with his right hand in that tape. But you will dismiss that as all perfectly normal since it does not fit your zero proof conspiracy theory of 19 Mulslims with box cutters.
    2. Bin Laden is wearing a gold ring which Islam strictly prohibits
    3. Bin Laden is wearing a watch which is also strictly prohibited by Islam but don't take my word for it.

    I do not remember exactly where in the documentary is so you will have to watch both of them.

    Grab some pop corn.
    http://stlouisrams.net/911/lc1.wmv
    http://stlouisrams.net/911/lc2.wmv

    Hate to keep spoiling your conspiracy theory however until there is proof that Bin Laden did this I have to go with the avalanche of evidence that it was orchestrated by the current Administration.

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