So... who's in the wrong here?
So... who's in the wrong here?
Looks like the driver was the first to use force, which puts him in hot water, for sure. My concern is that there probably wasn't a procedure in place regarding how the driver should have handled this (i.e. calling the school and reporting the student, or something to that effect).
The kids should have a heavy penalty from the school, not to mention what their parents should do to those disrespectful uncivilized punks.
The fault lies with the parents of those kids who raise a couple of brats and give that driver a hard time every day. I'm sure it's not just that driver they feel they can walk all over. He was wrong in touching him, but I don't blame him for what he did. Some kids have no respect for their elders, or anyone else for that matter. The drivers charge is a misdomeaner, the kid has a felony charge of striking a person over 65, ( he's 66), and another for striking a school department member. I'm sure the driver just snapped like a dry carrot, probably taking his S**T for the whole school year. Maybe taught that kid a lesson, but most likely not.
The guys 66, probably works part time to offset his S.S, and he's got to put up with this kid every day. I say the parents need a little of what the kid got.
I think my opinion though is that there is absolutely no excuse for this man using the kind of force he did on those kids. There are multiple other alternatives to going back and nearly choking one of them to try to get him to sit down, and it was because of the bus driver's actions that the situation came to a boil and the teen threw a punch. An adult needs to have more patience than that if he's going to work in public education.
Kids or not, they outnumbered him 2 to 1. He's a 66 year-old-man, and they are 13 and 15. So it's not like he laid into a couple of 1st graders. Plus the 2nd kid came up behind the driver. He was between the two kids and probably a little nervous and angry both at that point. It's a bad situation, but my first instinct is to blame the kids. Had they done what they were supposed to in the first place none of this would have happened.
The apple doesn't fall far from the tree though, so I'd bet the parents are as much to blame as the kids in some respects.
Again I say, 'Sign of the Times'. :upset:
We all know this is nothing new -- quite the contrary. It is an too well recognized pattern of disrespectful punks, stressed out parents who fail to educate their children with decency and dignity while struggling to make a living; adults that fail to treat other people's children with restraint and patience (i.e., some school bus drivers, perhaps suffering from depression).
No, this is not an attempt of mine to play Social Worker or to pretend a Ph.D. in psychology/counseling. It is simply a comment of trying to remind ourselves that we reap what we sow. That we must be careful in how we teach our children, despite the tough and inherent challenge!
Society today harbors much of this type of Jerry Springer reality; the local TV news is chock-full of disappearing kids and/or adults, of murder and drugs and meth labs being found and stupid people acting stupidly.
From renegades that train pitbull dogs to attack, fight and kill to child molesters, this kind of typical scenario, like the one recorded in this school bus incident ... it is simply an alarming call (certainly not a "wake up call", it is getting late in the day), another cold-fact indicator for us to be on the careful, watchful way our kids are growing up, especially if they are in their elementary school days.
In the meantime, let's watch yet another ad of 'Happy Youth Having a Great Time Dancing and Laughing at a Bar, Drinking Captain Morgan's Poison or hailing, "íViva Cuervo!"'. Another one of those funny beer commercials. They're so funny.
Oh, that's right, everyone is reminded to "drink responsibly". :bored: Bah! I wonder how some of the serious paramedics or people at the hospital's trauma center feel about all this advertising.
This particular incident could have been prevented if they would just install seat belts on school buses (which they should do anyway) and simply tell students - undue the seatbelt until its time to get off the bus and you get suspended.
Avenger, my wife of 25 years told me she always thought (in her junior school days) that school buses should have seat belts. We're talking some 35 years ago. It certainly would help in terms of safety and overall order!
Of course, safety isn't really the issue here.
Because we all know 13 and 15 year old boys always do what they're told, right?Quote:
Originally Posted by HUbison
The adult needs to have more patience and, if this event did get as out of control to where he needed to pull over the bus, there need to be alternate non-violent ways of dealing with it.
Punk kids or not, the guy was out of line. You expect teens to be smart asses from time to time. You expect adults to act like adults. This guy blew a hose and was out of line, IMO.
I think this is part of the problem. We expect too little from kids. They do something wrong and we write it off to "kids will be kids". Maybe when we start expecting more, we'll see more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Nick
E-d-u-c-a-t-i-o-n. Home, family education. Values / virtues, scruples and character. :)
You see it in athletes out of crisis, not only because they made it big in sports (amateur or pro), but because they ususally have an inspiring story of how their parents in poverty or single mom stuck to said principles that formed the person to being a straight, respectable adult.
You also see it in clean cut youngsters. Respectable kids of whom you feel proud.
I agree, Nick. This fellow lost his temper (due to depression or lack of fortitude is relative). So much for his job. That sets a good example for others in the school field, both kids and adults, of what NOT TO DO!
But I still believe it is a matter of EDUCATION. Teach your children well (try to). :tough:
So you're saying we should expect kids to never ever act like a smart ass at any time?Quote:
Originally Posted by HUbison
Don't hold your breath.
I'm not saying we shrug it off as kids will be kids, because these kids should be disciplined for their behavior. But this guy's fuse was way too short. When you're a bus driver chugging around with 13-15 yo's, you're going to get some misbehaving. That doesn't mean you get out of your seat and manhandle some teens.
As an education major who has spent time in classrooms, I can tell you that first hand. Even the most well behaved and well mannered kids have their moments.
That may be true, but these kids seemed to get more defiant and more aggressive in the face of the driver's attempt at discipline. That whole "you dis me and I'm coming after you" mentality is a real problem.
Getting back to Nick's original question, as far as the incident itself, I believe it is the bus driver's fault to have overboiled the way he did. Period.
Now, the cause, it obviously is an issue of far, far greater insight. Indeed, cause and effect.
You would think that schools screen their bus drivers at depth. But the parents are not "screened". We often fail as such and it shows: on camera, off camera; on line, off line. Moreso in recent times and in this country. It is a profound priority, to say the least.
Resorting again to the demeanor of some athletes, this time dipping into the sad, negative side, ever seen an athlete swear and spit at his coach during a game? Or lose his head and actually jump into the stands to assault a fan?
Teach Your Children Well. --Crosby, Stills, Nash & Young
I'm sorry to tell you this Nick, but you are obviously too young to know of what you speak. You also are probably too close in age to these hoodlums to see how wrong their actions were.Quote:
Originally Posted by NickSeiler
No amount of patience would have been enough there. That "child" was challenging the authority of that bus driver, which would have made his ablity to manage that bus any further impossible. I also saw that situation differently. The driver went back to manage one rider, and another came up from behind him to do who-knows-what. The bus driver did what he felt was necessary to put that rider back in his seat.
Did the bus driver go too far? Based on the footage of that tape, yes. The problem is, that tape only displayed the outcome, not the cause. If those were the measures that the bus drive felt were necessary to insure the safety of the other passengers, and quite possibly other motorist, then they were called for.
I used to drive a school bus, but it was almost 20 years ago, when children still had a little respect for their elders. I know a little of what that driver had to deal with. While I never put my hands on a "rider", I made it quite obvious that I would only be pushed so far before it would be my word against theirs.
Now-a-days, kids don't have any respect for their elders. They also know they can do whatever they want, and get away with it. Anything an adult does to squash their beligerence can get that adult jailtime. Even if it is their own parents paddling their behind.