Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

Collapse
X
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • TorontoRam
    started a topic Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    has convinced me, even more than watching RGIII and Kapernick this season that a mobile, ground gaining, quarterback is the present and future of the NFL, because they can beat you with their legs as well as his arms. The multiple options that an OC has when his QB can scamper are amazing. And, then, it dawned on me that Johnny Football may be on the Draft board in 2014 (after packing on a few pounds albeit not a Tebow-like 35 or so) or 2015 at the latest, but probably 2014. My oh my what an NFL franchise who might be in the market for a QB could do with that kid! However, said franchise would have to have a lousy 2013 season to do so. Maybe some GMs will be rooting for their oponents next season ()
    :helmet:

  • ZiaRam
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    You know I'll be honest I have never watched this Manziel until now on highlights on youtube. He is quite impressive! But here is the thing, those LB's/CB/Safeties in the NFL are going to be faster/stronger/more athletic he isn't going to be able to get away from them all the time like he does in college and when the do catch him they are going to make him pay. It only takes one time. Running QB's are exciting and do add another dimension that is hard to cover but that comes with a price if they aren't smart like a Brett Favre on being more of a pocket passer first, running the ball as a secondary option/last resort. How do you think Brett got the Iron Man award? he was mobile enough and not just a statue. That all being said I REALLY enjoy watching mobile QB's more and will follow this Manziel next year.

    Leave a comment:


  • AvengerRam_old
    replied
    I'll still take a pocket passer like P.Manning, Brady or Ryan to win the Super Bowl over any of the run option QBs.

    Leave a comment:


  • TorontoRam
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by Rambos View Post
    Everything you said about Webb maybe true I just don't know that much about him. But he is what he is and he is a hybrid QB. I did not say he was any good, just said he lost. Also not every pocket QB is very good. I'm not comparing anybody to Johnny Football. I'm focused on the argument that we will see the take over of the hybrid QB. Not going to happen.

    I thought we have the worst WR in football
    Again, I really appreciate your points, and the fact that you've caught on to the 'smiley face' craze. BTW A. Luck just ran for a 1stD, although he looks about 7' tall and 500lbs so he's a load to bring down, albeit not fleet of foot.

    I just ask myself who would I rather have QBing the Rams and Johnny Football, RGIII, and Kapernik (I'm not a huge Wilson fan) or one of their clones would do nicely if we need them in the future. I truly hope we don't.
    :8
    BTW I'm practicing my smiley facing, which is kinda like texting or tweeting.

    Leave a comment:


  • sosa39rams
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by Rambos View Post
    Everything you said about Webb maybe true I just don't know that much about him. But he is what he is and he is a hybrid QB. I did not say he was any good, just said he lost. Also not every pocket QB is very good. I'm not comparing anybody to Johnny Football. I'm focused on the argument that we will see the take over of the hybrid QB. Not going to happen.

    I thought we have the worst WR in football
    Yeah I doubt hybrid QB's take over football, though there is and will be an influx. And no, I'd MUCH rather have Givens and Amendola over Michael Jenkins and Jerome Simpson.. (At least they are the worst without Harvin).

    Leave a comment:


  • Rambos
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by sosa39rams View Post
    Yes, but the difference is:

    1) Joe Webb is strictly an athlete, and he CANT throw (Tebow anyone?)
    2) Webb is NOT smart
    3) He's not even close to as talented as Johnny Football

    Comparing Webb to Manziel is foolish.

    And mind you, Webb hasn't thrown 1 pass ALL year and he didn't even get to practice with the #1's this week, and to top all of that off he has the WORST WR corps in all of football.
    Everything you said about Webb maybe true I just don't know that much about him. But he is what he is and he is a hybrid QB. I did not say he was any good, just said he lost. Also not every pocket QB is very good. I'm not comparing anybody to Johnny Football. I'm focused on the argument that we will see the take over of the hybrid QB. Not going to happen.

    I thought we have the worst WR in football

    Leave a comment:


  • TorontoRam
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Your points are well taken, and I agree that neither Kapernick, Wilson, nor RGIII have enough of a body of work to tell us how they'll do in the NFL short or long term, but they're certainly fun to watch, which is why I'm looking foward to tonight's game. I dislike the Seahags and their fans who are rumoured to be boorish and even nasty to visiting fans. And, I'm not looking forward to their coach imitating a Seahag cheerleader in the sideline. Didn't one of the Harbaugh boys (Jim I believe) almost get his clock cleaned for his cheerleading antics after winning his first game? So, I'm rooting for RGIII.

    Leave a comment:


  • TorontoRam
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Not to mention the fact that he was facing The Pack. Not a fair fight IMHO.

    Leave a comment:


  • sosa39rams
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by Rambos View Post
    The Vikes started a new hybrid QB and he lost.
    Yes, but the difference is:

    1) Joe Webb is strictly an athlete, and he CANT throw (Tebow anyone?)
    2) Webb is NOT smart
    3) He's not even close to as talented as Johnny Football

    Comparing Webb to Manziel is foolish.

    And mind you, Webb hasn't thrown 1 pass ALL year and he didn't even get to practice with the #1's this week, and to top all of that off he has the WORST WR corps in all of football.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rambos
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    The Vikes started a new hybrid QB and he lost.

    Leave a comment:


  • gap
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by TekeRam View Post
    There's a reason why no one will break Brett Favre's ironman record. The defenses are faster and bigger than ever before.
    They also do a better job of drug testing for pain killers.

    Originally posted by TekeRam View Post
    A smaller QB like Vick, RGIII, Wilson, or Kapernick who goes downfield is going to end up on the wrong side of a Ray Lewis who will rip his leg off.
    Unfortunately, Ray is retiring after this year.

    Originally posted by TekeRam View Post
    Give me a drop back passer who won't get hit as much and has some size to take the hits. I know that he can last for 20 games, which is the most important thing to me.
    Amen on the 20 games, and winning the last one. Although, I'd be happier 19 wins.


    gap

    Leave a comment:


  • TekeRam
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    For the ongoing question, the third running QB is in our very own division... Colin Kapernick. Everyone forget about him? The guy we beat once and should have a second.

    Here's my thinking. Yes, a mobile quarterback who threatens to run at any time is dynamic and can break a game wide open. Look at what RGIII does, he freezes the linebackers and opens up the intermediate routes for receivers. The problem is that the NFL as a whole is injury prone. There's a reason why no one will break Brett Favre's ironman record. The defenses are faster and bigger than ever before.

    I actually was hoping to see what Tebow could do in a second year of starting, because I think he could actually be successful as a running QB. Why? He's not fast, but he has the bulk to hit the linebacker and put the hurt on him like Jax does. His problem is that he isn't accurate anytime before the 4th quarter. In a system that actually works, I think Cam Newton could be great. Because he has the bulk to withstand hits.

    A smaller QB like Vick, RGIII, Wilson, or Kapernick who goes downfield is going to end up on the wrong side of a Ray Lewis who will rip his leg off. Give me a drop back passer who won't get hit as much and has some size to take the hits. I know that he can last for 20 games, which is the most important thing to me.

    Leave a comment:


  • Rambos
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by TorontoRam View Post
    First of all, you can't lose because two of em are playing one another tomorrow night. Quite a stretch eh!
    That's true but two pocket passers are playing in the first game... one will lose.

    In that case, I'll bet ya that a scrambling QB's team wins tomorrow night's game. Okay?
    I bet you neither one goes to the show!

    Second, you only need one ring to be a SB champ, since this is not a marathon in the NFL (a la the Rams) this is a sprint.
    If you are saying they don't need to have long careers... I agree they won't. But even in the short run the defense in the playoffs gets even tougher. In the short term these guys have about two years before the D coordinators stop the pistol and the option IMO.

    Third, who's the third QB? Luck? NIMHO. If not Luck, who?
    It's not Luck, how many times have you seen him run the option? None, and how many times have you seen him in the pistol none. Yes he can run and so can Aaron Rogers but they are not using the option to create passing lanes and creating misdirection with the play action out of the pistol formation.

    Ask 'Stupes' how old man football worked out for him. When they had to throw Katey bar the door! Ball A&M. Game over!
    Well lets see how it works out in the NFL playoffs.
    Gosh, I love these smiley faces!
    ;)

    Whatever floats your boat...
    Last edited by Rambos; -01-05-2013, 04:03 PM.

    Leave a comment:


  • NJ Ramsfan1
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    Originally posted by TorontoRam View Post
    has convinced me, even more than watching RGIII and Kapernick this season that a mobile, ground gaining, quarterback is the present and future of the NFL, because they can beat you with their legs as well as his arms. The multiple options that an OC has when his QB can scamper are amazing. And, then, it dawned on me that Johnny Football may be on the Draft board in 2014 (after packing on a few pounds albeit not a Tebow-like 35 or so) or 2015 at the latest, but probably 2014. My oh my what an NFL franchise who might be in the market for a QB could do with that kid! However, said franchise would have to have a lousy 2013 season to do so. Maybe some GMs will be rooting for their oponents next season ()
    :helmet:

    They said the same thing when Randall Cunningham entered the league and was successful. Michael Vick, Kordell Stewart, Jake Plummer- all guys who were supposed to change the way the position was played. Never happened. This league has been and always will be a drop back passer league.

    That is not to say that there won't be a few guys from time to time that can scramble around and cause problems for defenses. Certain elements of the position will evolve, but these guys will remain the exception for two reasons. One, NFL defenses from top to bottom are 10 times as quick as the college game. What works in college doesn't work in the pros- that's why they don't run the option, the wishbone, etc. And two, QBs must engage in self-preservation if they want to survive for any length of time in the pros. It does not benefit them to scramble around and risk serious injury. You saw the scares involving RGIII this season; don't expect this to become a trend.

    Leave a comment:


  • sosa39rams
    replied
    Re: Watching Johnny Football Dismantle the Swooners....

    I actually really like Manziel. I dont think he's going to be a top 25 prospect when he comes out, but I do believe he can be a serious steal for a team willing to take a chance on him. He's going to slip just like Russell Wilson did. This league is so complex and yet miss the simplest things. He's going to slide only because he isn't a prototypical 6'5 240lb QB, but he gets the job done.

    Just like Wilson he is short. Though everyone and their mothers knew that Wilson could throw, was extremely intelligent, and had the ability to extend plays with his feet. I think Manziel can be the exact same, just needs to work on his deep ball.

    He clearly has all the motivation a man needs. Redshirted, the guy brought himself up from nothing really. Excited to see him come draft time.

    Leave a comment:

Related Topics

Collapse

  • Nick
    NFL GM: 2014 QB class not as good as some think
    by Nick
    NFL GM: 2014 QB class not as good as some think
    According to one exec, Bortles, Bridgewater, Carr and Manziel remind him of Ponder, Locker and Gabbert
    By Jason Cole
    January 21, 2014, 06:14 PM EST

    The 2014 draft may not be as heavy on quarterbacks at the top of the draft as many people have been projecting. According to three general managers who have a serious interest in what happens with the quarterbacks, passers such as Blake Bortles, Teddy Bridgewater, Derek Carr and Johnny Manziel may not end up going as quickly as many draftniks have suggested.

    And the most damning analysis came Tuesday morning when one of them said: “This group is reminding me a lot of the first round in 2011, except there’s no Cam Newton.”

    The 2011 NFL draft featured four quarterbacks being selected in the first round. Newton went No. 1 overall before Jake Locker went No. 8, Blaine Gabbert at 10 and Christian Ponder at 12. All three of those players have flopped after only three years in the league. Their teams (Minnesota, Tennessee and Jacksonville) are all looking to draft quarterbacks again this year.

    In hindsight, all of the general managers questioned about this draft say that the group in 2011 is proof of the pratfalls of reaching for a player.

    “A couple of things happened with that class that I think will make some teams hesitant this year,” one of them said. “First, the desperation to get somebody forced those guys up the board a lot higher. Second, the desperation also forced those team to play those guys before they were ready and before they had talent around them to make it easier.

    “You look back at it and say, ‘Be more patient.’”

    Will that happen in a league where finding a quarterback is paramount to success? The an-swer is probably not. Starting with Houston at No. 1 overall, Jacksonville at No. 3 and Cleveland at No. 5, there are plenty of teams in need.

    Yet, there is some belief that the difference between the quarterbacks perceived to go at the top of the first round and the ones who are likely to be in the second or third round is so small that waiting is wise. Players such as A.J. McCarron, Aaron Murray, Zach Mettenberger, David Fales and James Garoppolo are expected to be in that group later in the draft.

    “The difference between all those guys is about this much,” one of the GMs said, holding his forefinger and thumb about a half-inch apart. “If that’s how you see it, why not wait?”

    Furthermore, Bortles, Bridgewater, Carr and Manziel each have their issues. There are con-cerns about Bortles’ accuracy, Bridgewater’s lack of size and quiet personality, Carr’s pocket pres-ence and Manziel’s personality.

    Or as one GM put it: “I’m telling you right now, don’t be surprised if those guys start to fall. It’s just like last year at this time when we all thought Geno Smith was going No. 1 overall and then...
    -01-21-2014, 04:21 PM
  • AvengerRam_old
    I'm not saying Johnny Manziel is overhyped, but _________ (finish the joke!)
    by AvengerRam_old
    I'm not saying Johnny Manziel is overhyped, but Pro Football Focus has already rated him as the No. 4 QB in the NFL for 2014.
    -05-05-2014, 12:39 PM
  • Nick
    Johnny Manziel cements his status as franchise quarterback
    by Nick
    Johnny Manziel cements his status as franchise quarterback
    By Bucky Brooks
    NFL Media analyst
    Published: Jan. 1, 2014 at 12:20 a.m.
    Updated: Jan. 1, 2014 at 03:20 a.m.

    NFL evaluators pay close attention to how well elite prospects perform in bowl games. Executives believe these contests rival the intensity and competitiveness of NFL games, while also creating a big-game atmosphere that allows observers to witness a player under pressure.

    While Johnny Manziel has played in a ton of big games in his brief career, I thought it was important to see how well the former Heisman Trophy winner performed in the Chick fil-A Bowl after finishing the regular season with a pair of lackluster games. With a national television audience paying close attention to his every move, Manziel put on an epic performance that cemented his status as one of the top quarterbacks in college football, and a future franchise player at the next level. Watching it up close and personal, here are my thoughts on Manziel's game and it projects in the NFL:

    Athleticism
    Johnny Football took the college football world by storm a season ago by showcasing a sandlot game built on improvisational playmaking. Part of his success stemmed from his exceptional speed, quickness and movement skills. Few quarterbacks in the college game can rival his elusiveness in tight quarters, making him a rare commodity at the position.

    Watching Manziel work his magic on the Georgia Dome turf against the Blue Devils, I was blown away by his sudden acceleration and burst. He is quicker than a hiccup in space, with a knack for making defenders miss in the hole. Although he has scaled back on his impromptu runs this season, it's nearly impossible to contain Manziel when he elects to use his legs as a primary weapon.

    I must express some concern about his durability based on his diminutive stature and willingness to seek out contact, but I don't believe it will be a major issue because of his combination of instincts and athleticism. He has a knack for avoiding the big shot, which is why he is such a threat when he gets on the perimeter.

    Arm talent
    Questions about Manziel's arm strength and range dominated the discussion in the NFL scouting community during the offseason. Evaluators wondered if Manziel could make big-boy throws from the pocket, particularly the deep out from the opposite hash and the go-route down the boundary.

    Watching Manziel pick apart the Blue Devils, there's no doubt in my mind that he can make every throw in the book. He attacked every area of the field with a variety of fastballs and rainbows to open receivers. Additionally, Manziel showed the ability to squeeze the ball into tight windows between the hashes. While those traits are expected of a franchise quarterback, I believe Manziel's unique ability to deliver accurate throws from various throwing platforms separates...
    -01-01-2014, 07:33 AM
  • MauiRam
    Johnny Football ..
    by MauiRam
    I am curious as to how high in the draft Johnny Manziel will be selected. Apparently he is going to declare for the draft at the end of his sophmore season. Is this guy for real? Will his skills translate to success at the NFL level? Thoughts ..
    -10-04-2013, 10:45 AM
  • Flippin' Ram
    2014 Rookie QB
    by Flippin' Ram
    With Bradford down and Fisher still believing that he's the future QB of the Rams, which prospect are you most interested in?
    Marcus Mariota, Oregon
    12.50%
    2
    Johnny Manziel, Texas A&M
    6.25%
    1
    Tajh Boyd, Clemson
    12.50%
    2
    Teddy Bridgewater, Louisville
    6.25%
    1
    David Fales, San Jose State
    12.50%
    2
    Derek Carr, Fresno State
    18.75%
    3
    Aaron Murray, Georgia
    0.00%
    0
    AJ McCarron, Alabama
    6.25%
    1
    Other (Please specify)
    25.00%
    4
    -10-21-2013, 10:43 PM
Working...
X