Announcement

Collapse
No announcement yet.

For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

Collapse
X
 
  • Filter
  • Time
  • Show
Clear All
new posts

  • For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

    After seeing everybody play in Mobile, and keeping everything in mind (estimated draft position, etc.) if we are to draft a qb in this draft I think it comes down to three players.

    Colt McCoy
    Tony Pike
    Dan Lefevour

    I know the Clausen and Bradford supporters might come out and state their case, but I honestly don't think the value of either supercedes (1) taking the BPA at #1 (or even at #3 as some want), which they certainly are not (2) the difference in ability from the three above players.

    Personally, while I wouldn't be disappointed seeing us draft McCoy at the top of the second, if he's there, again I think the same principle as above comes into play in the second and there is too little difference in value between McCoy and Pike and Lefevour to bypass the bevy of talent likely available at that slot.

    Therefore, hoping (and praying) either Pike or Lefevour is available in the third I take the remaining qb in the third and I think we have our qb of the future. Either of which I would be plenty happy with. As always, its a roll of the dice drafting a qb, but I think this situation will maximize value while minimizing the risk associated with drafting a qb and allowing us to fulfill other important holes along the way.
    Last edited by npow81; -01-31-2010, 03:36 AM.

  • #2
    Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

    Im really liking what im seeing from Pike and LeFevour at the moment. But if they keep getting better and with a lack of QB talent in the draft they could end up as second rounders. It really depends where Bradford and Clausen end up going on draft day
    @EssexRam_

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

      Agreed, unfortunately that is a possibility. While I don't like to talk trading picks (because its way too speculative at this point) the way the draft is set up this year (second round occurs on day two) might help us this year and in this situation.

      I think more likely than not after teams have a chance to reset their boards after the first round there will be a few teams with offers in to us before round 2 even begins to get a few players that have slipped past round one. If its looking like both of these two don't make it to the third it might be possible to trade down 10-15 slots, pick up another pick, and draft one of them later in the round.

      Frankly, I see at least one of Bradford Clausen slipping to late one, which should push things back a bit, hopefully some bonehead team will take Tebow before Pike and Lefevour further pushing back the slot these two are taken.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

        For me watching Dan Lefevour was immense yesterday making some very very good throws right on the money but then saying this, Jarrett Brown also made some good throws but looked alittle raw but with good coaching he could turn out to be quite a find I reckon. He got his passes out very quickly and atleast when he got his footing set he was very acurate.

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

          I agree about jarret brown. Could be a diamond in the rough. Or jamarcus russel just not taken first overall. I think he is in better shape than chubs russel. And i think he has a big strong arm. Not sure if he can make the throws He has very little experience as a starter. Which either means hes not very good or we have yet to see his best. Id guess hes a 5th rounder? i dont know i could be wrong.I would take a chance.

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

            The star Qb of the senior bowl was Zac Robinson. Hands down. Aside from the fumble, he was awesome. Theres a lot of potential, but I dnt think we need another project Qb. We got Null. So I dnt entertain the thought of picking a Qb in the later rounds.
            Last edited by The Optimistic Lamb; -02-01-2010, 02:13 PM.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

              Originally posted by SJacks039 View Post
              I agree about jarret brown. Could be a diamond in the rough. Or jamarcus russel just not taken first overall. I think he is in better shape than chubs russel. And i think he has a big strong arm. Not sure if he can make the throws He has very little experience as a starter. Which either means hes not very good or we have yet to see his best. Id guess hes a 5th rounder? i dont know i could be wrong.I would take a chance.
              Brown can make all the NFL throws. He has a cannon for an arm and the accuracy, though a bit inconsistent, is there. The reason he only had one year of starting experience here at WVU is because he was sitting behind Pat White.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                After seeing everybody play in Mobile, and keeping everything in mind (estimated draft position, etc.) if we are to draft a qb in this draft I think it comes down to three players.

                Colt McCoy
                Tony Pike
                Dan Lefevour

                I know the Clausen and Bradford supporters might come out and state their case, but I honestly don't think the value of either supercedes (1) taking the BPA at #1 (or even at #3 as some want), which they certainly are not (2) the difference in ability from the three above players.

                Personally, while I wouldn't be disappointed seeing us draft McCoy at the top of the second, if he's there, again I think the same principle as above comes into play in the second and there is too little difference in value between McCoy and Pike and Lefevour to bypass the bevy of talent likely available at that slot.

                Therefore, hoping (and praying) either Pike or Lefevour is available in the third I take the remaining qb in the third and I think we have our qb of the future. Either of which I would be plenty happy with. As always, its a roll of the dice drafting a qb, but I think this situation will maximize value while minimizing the risk associated with drafting a qb and allowing us to fulfill other important holes along the way.
                I think that there are significant differences between these guys, not just in terms of some quantitatively ranked draft value but also qualitatively. For example, Tony Pike rushed for 128 yards in college. Dan LeFevour rushed for 128 yards in the Bowling Green game last year, and it wasn't even his highest total of the season. We're talking about two very different players even if they might go around the same time in the draft.

                McCoy is interesting because he makes plays on his feet but still completes 70% of his passes--which is ridiculous--but there are questions about the system he played in. I get the feeling he'll either transition well into the NFL and be a star, or he won't and will wash out.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                  To me if your not taking Claussen or Bradford in this draft the best value you are going to get by drafting a QB is in the third round. I like Jarrett Brown all the tools ton of upside, but he is inexperienced. Tony Pike might also be available at the top of the 3rd so they are both better option IMO instead of Colt McCoy at the top of the second.

                  This draft is stacked with talented receivers and TE's that's the position im looking at regardless of what we do in the first.

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                    Originally posted by Goldenfleece View Post
                    I think that there are significant differences between these guys, not just in terms of some quantitatively ranked draft value but also qualitatively. For example, Tony Pike rushed for 128 yards in college. Dan LeFevour rushed for 128 yards in the Bowling Green game last year, and it wasn't even his highest total of the season. We're talking about two very different players even if they might go around the same time in the draft.

                    McCoy is interesting because he makes plays on his feet but still completes 70% of his passes--which is ridiculous--but there are questions about the system he played in. I get the feeling he'll either transition well into the NFL and be a star, or he won't and will wash out.
                    There's no question the Pike and Lefevour are different types of qbs. Although, I don't think Lefevour's legs do anything in the NFL besides provide a little scrambling ability (i.e. Aaron Rodgers). Overall, at this point I do think there value from their various strengths equals out. I would say that Lefevour is a bit more accurate and probably a better reader of defenses (along with the mobility). Pike on the other hand has that rocket arm that everyone is looking for and that is the great equalizer, it also makes it that he probably has a much higher ceiling if he can become more consistent and a little bit more intelligent on the field over time.

                    As for Brown, I don't see it, although when I judge a qb I rely alot on just the plain ol' eyeball test (combined with productivity in college), so I can't say what exactly I don't like about him...but that is just my two cents.

                    Comment


                    • #11
                      Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                      mccoy is extremely risky, he's a hard worker and all but he's got a ways to go, the red flags about being a system guy are legit. i don't think i'd take him in the second, i'd rather see who falls to the 3rd.

                      Comment


                      • #12
                        Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                        Personally prefer Lefevour as a solid franchise QB over McCoy and Pike. McCoy is groomable because has accuracy and the other tools, Pike worries me because he will need to add weight for the NFL and we don't know how that will affect his throwing or other mechanics. I also want to add the thought of injury-free to this thread. Lefevour appears to be the most resilient of the group. Let's not forget the fact that Marc Bulger has been out for a slew of games the past few years. What good is a franchise QB on IR?

                        I also think if the Rams REALLY feel Lefevour or any of these guys is the REAL DEAL then squeeze the trigger whenever you feel you need to make the move.

                        Go Rams w/Lefevour!

                        Comment


                        • #13
                          Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                          Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                          I would say that Lefevour is a bit more accurate and probably a better reader of defenses (along with the mobility). Pike on the other hand has that rocket arm that everyone is looking for and that is the great equalizer, it also makes it that he probably has a much higher ceiling if he can become more consistent and a little bit more intelligent on the field over time.
                          Tony Pike does not have a rocket arm, IMO.

                          Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                          As for Brown, I don't see it, although when I judge a qb I rely alot on just the plain ol' eyeball test (combined with productivity in college), so I can't say what exactly I don't like about him...but that is just my two cents.
                          If you figure out what it is, I'd be interested in hearing it. The only thing I think is working against him is his inconsistency this season. Otherwise, I think he has a very good set of physical tools, and if he could put them together under the guidance of a proper NFL QB coach, he could be a pretty solid player.

                          Comment


                          • #14
                            Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                            Originally posted by Nick View Post
                            Tony Pike does not have a rocket arm, IMO.



                            If you figure out what it is, I'd be interested in hearing it. The only thing I think is working against him is his inconsistency this season. Otherwise, I think he has a very good set of physical tools, and if he could put them together under the guidance of a proper NFL QB coach, he could be a pretty solid player.
                            I guess rocket arm should probably be reserved for truly elite arms, but I do believe his arm strength is above average (you were in Mobile you would know better so I'll defer to you).

                            As for Jarret Brown I know I'd be a terrible GM trying to explain what it is, my feeling on him is purely instinctual and that probably isn't the place for a discussion board. However, what always sticks out in my mind with him is the previous years when Pat White would go down mid-game, and he couldn't produce a victory for WVU (although you would probably know more than me about him, just as I might know a bit more about the draft prospects of Kyle Wilson from BSU). Albeit, that's a tough situation, and he ultimately is inexperienced so maybe that is not fair.

                            I guess everybody has there hunches and although I can provide an in-depth analytical assessment of him (nor have I watched him enough to really know for sure), something about him tells me he doesn't have "it". Fair or not that's my feeling.

                            You are undoubtedly right that he has the physical tools, and could be successful in the right situation with the right instruction. However, (1) that's a slippery slope(qbs taken on this premise seem to me to be highly unsuccessful), and (2) I'm not sure if the Rams are the right situation for a developmental qb (not that they all aren't but Brown would be more of a project).

                            I guess I see Pike or Lefevour being able to play and be moderately successful from at worst the start of the 2011 season. I see Brown as taking a great deal more time. Ultimately, I think we need to develop a plan to have people in place by that time.
                            Last edited by npow81; -02-01-2010, 11:43 AM.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: For Me...Its Down to Three QBs

                              Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                              I guess rocket arm should probably be reserved for truly elite arms, but I do believe his arm strength is above average (you were in Mobile you would know better so I'll defer to you).
                              I was not at the Senior Bowl, but I've watched Pike quite a bit in the Big East. I would agree his arm strength is somewhere from average to above average, but I agree, I would probably only refer to those with elite arm strength as having a rocket arm.

                              Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                              As for Jarret Brown I know I'd be a terrible GM trying to explain what it is, my feeling on him is purely instinctual and that probably isn't the place for a discussion board. However, what always sticks out in my mind with him is the previous years when Pat White would go down mid-game, and he couldn't produce a victory for WVU (although you would probably know more than me about him, just as I might know a bit more about the draft prospects of Kyle Wilson from BSU). Albeit, that's a tough situation, and he ultimately is inexperienced so maybe that is not fair.
                              I understand having difficulty putting your finger on what it is you don't like about a guy, or just not having a great feeling about a prospect for some reason, but your analysis that Brown wasn't able to win for WVU simply isn't very accurate. Ignoring the eight wins (nine if you count Marshall, but I don't) he helped the team accumulate as a first year starter this season, Brown helped WVU win against Syracuse and Rutgers in 2008 in relief of White. He also quarterbacked the 2006 team in their final regular season game of the year, a great overtime win against Rutgers.

                              Originally posted by npow81 View Post
                              You are undoubtedly right that he has the physical tools, and could be successful in the right situation with the right instruction. However, (1) that's a slippery slope(qbs taken on this premise seem to me to be highly unsuccessful), and (2) I'm not sure if the Rams are the right situation for a developmental qb (not that they all aren't but Brown would be more of a project).

                              I guess I see Pike or Lefevour being able to play and be moderately successful from at worst the start of the 2011 season. I see Brown as taking a great deal more time. Ultimately, I think we need to develop a plan to have people in place by that time.
                              (1) That's generally why teams wouldn't spend high picks on them, and I wouldn't advocate spending a high pick on Brown.

                              (2) Maybe, maybe not. If the Rams find a veteran stop gap who can be effective enough for 2-3 years while Brown develops, it could work out. I don't necessarily think that a veteran stopgap has to only be a one year solution.

                              That being said, I would agree that Pike or LeFevour are better options, and I would project them as going higher than Brown. But I do think Brown could be successful in this league if brought about appropriately because of the physical tools he already has.

                              Comment

                              Related Topics

                              Collapse

                              • ManofGod
                                Top 5 Senior QB's
                                by ManofGod
                                According to Mel Kiper Jr., the top 5 senior QB's are as follows:

                                1. Colt McCoy, QB, Texas
                                2. Tim Tebow, QB, Florida
                                3. Dan Lefevour, QB, Central Michigan
                                4. Tony Pike, QB, Cincinnati
                                5. Sean Canfield, QB, Oregon State

                                I believe a few of you may be suprised by this order, and whether you are a fan of his Kiper or not, he does seem to have acces to what many NFL teams are looking for when it comes to the draft. Now this draft order is current (1/8/10), and of course we will have to wait until the combine to see who's stock falls, who's rises, and who simply falls off of the face of the earth.

                                Now since we have the #1 pick in almost every round, baring a monumental improvement by these five men, they will all be available in the 2nd round for us & if necessary the 3rd or 4th. Now I know many of you are Pike fans, and some of you favor McCoy or Lefevour. Some of you even believe in the magic that is Tim Tebow (as I do), but we obviously need to look towards our QB of the future. I believe we start Bulger this season for many reasons most notably being financial, but we do need to start grooming the successor.

                                With that being said my fellow clam members, who from these 5 men would you want behind center as the #2 or #3 QB(provided that we move Null up to #2, or pick up another free agent in the off-season)?
                                -01-08-2010, 01:34 PM
                              • AvengerRam_old
                                The Thing That Worries Me Most About The Second Tier QBs
                                by AvengerRam_old
                                First, let me define my terms. Right now, I have the QB "tiers" as follows:

                                Tier 1 (First Round Prospects)
                                Sam Bradford, Oklahoma
                                Jimmy Clausen, Notre Dame

                                Tier 2 (Second/Third Round Prospects)
                                Colt McCoy, Texas
                                Dan LeFevour, Central Michigan

                                Tier 3 (Fourth/Fifth Round Prospects)
                                Tony Pike, Cincinnati
                                Levi Brown, Troy
                                Jarrett Brown, West Virginia

                                Tier 4 (Sixth Round or later)
                                Everyone Else

                                Note: Before we get off on a tangent, let me say that I am aware that there are many who have Tony Pike in Tier 2 and Tim Tebow in Tier 2 or 3. Let's just agree to disagree on those.

                                Now... here's my worry...

                                Where do you value the Tier 2 QBs?

                                At this point, I feel as though Colt McCoy and Dan LeFevour would both be reaches at pick number 33. However, I also think there is a very good chance that both will be gone by pick number 65.

                                In a perfect world, the Rams woudl trade from pick 33 to a pick in the middle of the second round, get McCoy or LeFevour, and obtain an extra pick in the process. But what if such a trade is not available?

                                My fear is that the Rams pass on the Tier 1 QBs in Round 1, pass on the Tier 2 QBs at pick No. 33, and then find themselves at the top of Round 3 with the choice of going with a Tier 3 QB or "Door Number 2" (Bulger, Boller, Null, ???).

                                If the Rams share this concern, it could push them towards taking Bradford first. However, that would the wrong reason to take Bradford. If they think he's worth the first pick, then they should take him. Taking him because of need is very risky.

                                Its issues like this that make me glad I'm not the GM.
                                -03-03-2010, 11:15 AM
                              • r8rh8rmike
                                The Watercooler: Who Are The Rams' Top Draft Options At QB?
                                by r8rh8rmike
                                10.22.2009 12:27 pm
                                Who are Ramsí top draft options at QB?
                                By Roger Hensley

                                THE WATERCOOLER

                                QUESTION: If the St. Louis Rams were to take a quarterback in the first round of next yearís draft, which current college quarterback would you suggest they select?

                                BERNIE MIKLASZ
                                Very tough call, and of course I reserve the right to change my mind later, after these kids play more games and also go through the NFL Scouting Combine. Because a lot can change between now and the draft. But if we are talking right now, Iíd go with Washingtonís Jake Locker. Big (6-3), strong and athletic, Locker has a plus arm, and a quick release. Heís been thriving in the pro-style offense installed by first-year head coach Steve Sarkisian. Also, Locker is being tutored by one of the best, QBs coach Steve Clarkson, who in the past has worked with Ben Roethlisberger, Matt Leinart and others. Clarkson cleaned up Lockerís mechanics and the improvement was immediate. And keep in mind that Locker is getting it done at Washington, and heís not surrounded by elite talent. That makes his performance even more impressive.

                                Notre Dameís Jimmy Clausen has moved up as an NFL prospect. Clausen has always had the natural talent, but heís grown at Notre Dame, and is more physically imposing now. Looks like a tough kid, too. He is certainly used to pressure and it doesnít get to him. The best is yet to come for Clausen. The red flags are out on Oklahomaís Sam Bradford; itís not only the shoulder injuries, but the questions of whether he can throw while under pressure, because he doesnít encounter much of a pass rush at OU. Cincinnatiís Tony Pike could be the steal of the draft; heís likely to be downgraded and drop down the board because of multiple injuries to his left wrist. But heís a player. Not sure if Colt McCoy (Texas) has the frame, but he seems like a good fit for a West Coast offense. Jevan Snead (Ole Miss) has been touted by scouts and draftniks, but I havenít seen enough (yet) to get excited by his NFL future. Again, that could change. All of this could.

                                VAHE GREGORIAN
                                With his bum shoulder this season, Oklahoma quarterback Sam Bradford may be losing stock for the 2010 draft or may even be considering waiting another year to come out. But if heís available, the Rams would be wise to snap him up. Although he could stand to be more mobile, especially considering the Rams line, last yearís Heisman Trophy winner has all the tools to build a team around: accuracy (67.9 percent of his passes last season), height (6-4) and a leadership presence that makes players want to play better just for him, OU coach Bob Stoops says. Maybe some will see the shoulder injury and apparent aggravation of it last week against Texas as something chronic or signs he is brittle, but sometimes quarterbacks just get hit and hurt. Thereís no reason to think itís anything more with Bradford.

                                JEFF...
                                -10-22-2009, 05:20 PM
                              • AvengerRam_old
                                Av's Pre-Combine/Pro Days QB Ranking
                                by AvengerRam_old
                                Here's how I rank the QB prospects going into the pre-draft testing season:

                                1. Sam Bradford, Oklahoma [STEADY]
                                If Bradford has recovered from his shoulder injury, I think he is firmly entrenched as the No. 1 QB in the draft. He has the size, accuracy and quick release that scouts look for in a QB prospect. I don't know if the Rams will consider him as a potential first pick, but he'll be gone within the first ten.

                                2. Jimmy Clausen, Notre Dame [STEADY/FALLING]
                                Right now, I have Clausen as the clear No. 2 QB, and a likely top 20 pick. I do think, however, that he might not measure up in either the height or arm strength categories. He also will have to overcome the perception of immaturity. If he has a good testing season, he'll stay right where he is, and could be taken as early as picks 5-10. If not, he could drop into the second round.

                                3. Colt McCoy, Texas [FALLING]
                                Fair or not, the most recent memories people will have about McCoy are him being rag-dolled, first by Ndamukong Suh and then by the Alabama defense. Meanwhile, other QBs below him have had good showings in the bowl games and All-Star games. Still, if he can show reasonable arm strenth when he works out (I believe he is going to throw at the Combine), he should stop the falling trend and hold firm as the third QB off the board, probably in Round 2 of the draft.

                                4. Dan LeFevour, Central Michigan [STEADY/RISING]
                                I would have given LeFevour a grade of "rising" if no for his questionable decision not to throw at the Combine. Still, after his performances at the GMAC Bowl and the Senior Bowl, he is a prospect on the rise. I think he's a Round 2 or 3 prospect right now, but could be firmly within Round 2 (or even late first round) by April.

                                5. Tony Pike, Cincinnati [FALLING]
                                Pike is a hot and cold prospect. Watch some of his game films, and he looks like a Blue Chip prospect. Then, watch some more, and he looks like a college/system QB who is not quite ready for Prime Time. I think there will be quite a bit of scrutiny of Pike in the coming weeks, and my gut tells me he might not fare so well. I expect he'll be gone by the end of Round 3, but he might last until Round 4.

                                6. Levi Brown, Troy [RISING]
                                I may be alone on this one, but I think Brown could be this draft's biggest sleeper. Watch his game film, and you could easily conclude that he has a better arm than Clausen, McCoy, LeFevour and Pike. He also has ideal size. Right now, most probably have him ranked as a 4th or 5th round pick, at best. I think he could be a Round 2 or 3 value.

                                7. Jarrett Brown, West Virginia [STEADY/RISING]
                                Brown opened some eyes with his Senior Bowl performance. I think he is a prospect on the rise as a result, and could be selected as early as Round 4. But, is he the QB equivalent of a workout wonder? His career 16 TDs and 13 Ints (11/9 last year) might suggest that...
                                -02-23-2010, 03:34 PM
                              • NJ Ramsfan1
                                If we Draft a Quarterback...
                                by NJ Ramsfan1
                                ...And I think it's fairly obvious we must, who do we take? I gotta' tell ya, I have reservations about all of the top three guys on most peoples' draft board- Bradford, McCoy and Claussen.

                                With Bradford, of course, it's his shoulder. He's injured himself twice this season and this doesn't bode well for the rest of his senior year and who knows down the road. McCoy, quite frankly hasn't played particularly well thus far- and most analysts would agree. As for Claussen, he's probably playing as well as anyone in the country, but he is green and doesn't have much of a track record.

                                All of these guys could become good pros, but are they right for the Rams? If so, which one would you want?
                                -10-17-2009, 07:54 PM
                              Working...
                              X